hornbm

Wouldn't the A/C line that goes from the firewall to the compressor need to be extended rather than shortened and recrimped, since the compressor is farther forward in the engine bay?

Akagis_white_comet

iTrader: (4)

Yes, that is the suction hose that needs to be extended. It is the LARGER hose on part #83 in the included picture of the S4 Sanden system. This connects to #77 (Pipe, Cooler No. 7), which runs along the firewall

Here's a pic of the S4's Sanden A/C System, from the S4 Parts Catalog. They don't list anything for the S4 Nippondenso system in the catalog or the EPC


On the passenger side, #71 (Pipe No. 5) has the High Pressure service port on it, #70 (Pipe No. 4) connects it to the Receiver/Drier (#68). Then it connects to the condenser via #74 (Pipe No. 6), which has #75 (Refrigerant Pressure Switch) on it.

What I had in mind was to extend the Suction Hose, then replace #70 and #74 with barrier hoses rated for at least 500psi. Doing this lets one mount the Receiver/Drier anywhere relative to the Condenser. Perfect for a car that is now missing the original Radiator/Condenser mounts, there's no way I could realistically get it back in the same X/Y/Z position

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

there are 2 (maybe 3?) paper binders for A/C parts, there is a sanden, and denso. its a mazda, there is a separate parts book. i was going to say 80's mazda but they STILL do it...

t-von

iTrader: (8)

UPDATE:


I just got my 20b water pump back from being rebuilt. All I can say is WOW on the guality.

waterpumpman.com

It also looks like it's been powder coated. The really nice thing is the cost and turn around. I sent it off last Monday and got it back today (about 1 full week). Total cost including return shipping was $101.00. They can damn near rebuild any water pump you send them. Extremely pleased with the results!

bcool

I'm still fighting with cooling. I still need to do some duct work but im currently running the afco radiator, an intercooler and 2 FC oil coolers. I think i'm using an n/a water pump. What I think im getting out of this thread is that there is a difference between n/a a TII water pumps correct?

t-von

iTrader: (8)

^ Turbo II and NA should be the same. As far as ducting and a front mount IC, my recent research is showing that a 20b runs cooler without an under tray. This is on an Fd though!

CBR

I havent read all so sorry if already mentioned but stock fc sized radiater that is twice as thick does the job with 500whp road race set up with stock 20b water pump.also 600whp 20b in race car with electric pump and double thickness fd radiater works well to.
also stock fc oil cooler works too.

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

yeah thats very good! a NEW cosmo pump thru mazda is quite a few american dollars....

stokrx

Very interesting thread. Trying to decide what pump to use on my 20b in my first gen atm. Have a S5 and a 20b one, both impellers seem the same size...


20b pump v's S5 pump

t-von

iTrader: (8)

^ Even if the impellers are the same size, you will get more flow "volume" from the 20b's unit due to the dual thermostats.

damian

iTrader: (2)

Good info TVON,

After researching I think I plan to stick with the 20b pump and have it rebuilt by the same place you did. The only other option I see was going to a custom electricl pump setup, but I wanted to keep things simple for now and avoid that direction.

Note: Keep in mind this is for my race car, so track/race only conditions.

Attila the Fun

iTrader: (1)

I had heating issues when my car was first converted, in spite of a large aftermarket aluminum radiator. When that one finally failed, I got one from Becool http://www.becool.com/

They asked how much horsepower the engine would put out, then plugged that figure into some formula that they use. I have had no heating problems since installing the Becool.

I'll dig around and see if I can find the original specs for the one they built. If I do, I'll post them here.

hwnd

iTrader: (4)

You guys are crazy...

I've got a collection of water pumps from 70's on up.. the 20B is the 2nd largest - says who? says the caliper. As far as I can recall, the biggest was another cast iron impeller.

I didn't measure the pitch of the blades, etc.. so there isn't any real "solid" info by saying "AH! 20B pump is BIGGEST!! so its the best to use!!". You guys are smart people :-)


I don't mean to be a jerk here but I didn't read anything in here to help me cool my 3rotor.
Sorry but there is little actual-fact in here and a lot of "i think" and "i heard" info.

So why don't we move away from hear-say and open the discussion about internal modifications that's we've all tried. I know Barry has a few ideas on his plate.

t-von

iTrader: (8)

Fair enough! I do know that the 20b pump had a drastic improvement over the 13brew pump that I originally had on before. When my engine was on the test stand, it took considerably longer for my engine to get really hot before having to turn my fans on. Lets be real, where not trying to re-invent the wheel here. On these conversions there are 2 main reasons 20b pump usually gets removed. 1 To run the same set-up that came with the car your installing the engine in (which is easier). 2. The availability of rebuilt 20b water pumps was virtually non-existent (until now of course). Sure #1 makes it simpler but does that mean that's what we really should be doing? My experience tells me "I don't think so"!

Mazda designed and installed that 20b style water pump for a reason. Sure they could have saved money and used the 2nd gen style set-up but they didn't. Sooo obviously Mazda knew something. I stated earlier that the 20b's unit does allow for more flow volume with it's dual thermostats. So regardless of which impeller is biggest, you will most definitely get more flow out of the 20b's pump set-up.

black93RX7

To properly cool a 20B takes a combination of things: proper fan shroud helps a lot, appropriately sized radiator, large oil cooler/s, strong fan, water pump in good working order and possibly a vented hood. This is what has worked for me, if one part of the system is inadequate higher temps could easily result.

t-von

iTrader: (8)

^ Great info. I'm just trying to figure out the ideal solution for my part of the country. Down here 100 Degree summers are the norm around here.

Black13B

iTrader: (1)

TTT

t-von has alot of experience with this stuff.

Can we get onto oil cooling? That's half the job in keeping the engine cool. The oil cooler that came with my 20B (which was in the cosmo), was roughly 16"x10"x2". What have you guys run for an oil cooler? Have you used a simple cooler or one with a thermo-bypass like the fc?

hIGGI

iTrader: (7)

In FMIC config, running 2 stock FC oil coolers i have no problem to keep oil temps under 100C, even at hard track duty, drifting (not enought air flow from forward moving etc..)
However, once oil temps reach 100C, i cant keep coolant under 100C on small tracks (2nd gear drifting), fast tracks (4th gear drifting) are no problem and both oil and water stays under 100C without thinking about it....

Switching to V-mount should help it hopefully.....

Running Craig Davies EWP115