Ok I've been getting numerous request for pics of my engines positioning. I took the long road with my approach because I care more about staying with Mazda's design and engineering philosophy than just getting the engine in the car. The engine sits about 2" lower than stock and is moved back 5-3/4". Make no mistake, there is a TON of work that needs to be done to make it all work as a whole. Most of my fabrication is still in it's raw state so it will look a little ugly till I get everything completed and painted. None the less, it should give those an idea of what needs to be done. In the below pics you will notice that I'm trying to give you an idea of what needs to be done on the LIM if you wanna retain the factory UIM. When I 1st started doing my conversion back in 2007, I cut up my LIM thinking I was gonna go in a specific direction. I quickly realized I needed to make my own intake to do what I wanted. My set-up runs with my custom build intake (which I'm not going to show right now). Everything else should pretty much duplicate what AutoTech did years ago with their 20b set-up. Also keep in mind I'm on an extreme budget so that meant I practically had to make everything to keep my cost down.

In the 2nd pic you can clearly see the difference in the fire wall. All I did has use a stiff mallet to round the tunnel so the transmission would clear. Don't worry, it will look nice and neat when I paint the whole engine bay.


3rd pic shows engine sitting just behind the rack. I had to cut back on that front cover lip to get it to clear. There's only a 1/4" gap their!

4th pic shows what I did with my oil filter pedestal. It's just a two way galley that sends the oil to the bearings and pressure regulator like normal (only except oil filter is relocated) lower. It's made in steel and has a 1/2" inner diameter barbed fitting that I welded to it because I don't have the machine to weld aluminum yet.

 

1st pic heres my oil filter pedestal. No more oily engine oil changes I also found it easier to just tap the big banjo bolt and thread the oil pressure regulator into it. It works great!

4th pic is where I'm trying to show you the clearance you will have with the factory UIM. The factory LIM wont work at all in this position unless you completely cut the firewall like Carsli (rest in peace) did!

I also tried to use MS paint to draw up an example of a LIM you would have to make to fit the UIM.

 

Nice to see you taking your own approach on the build, looks good and keep us posted

 

4th pic you can see the Turbo II engine mounts I used. I had to cut the metal surround to make them fit my sub-frame. You will also notice that I don't have a oil pan on. With the engine this low, the oil pan is only 4" from the ground (and that's at stock ride height.) I already got a scrape on the bottom of the stock unit so your most definitely going to have to shorten it or make a new one. I'm getting ready to make a new one out of some 1/2" thick aluminum. I'll have a whole thread on that later on.

5th pic you can see my relocated shifter. I still sits pretty far back so I had to move it forward a bit. You will see what I did in the next post.

 

As you can see, I had to cut my Miata Shifter and re position it forward to center it in the console. I only paid $40.00 for that shifter and it works perfectly. The throws are extremely short.

My sub-frame wanted to be able to remove the oil pan without raising the engine, so I designed it with a large opening.

 

2nd pic you can see the routing of the oil line up to the upper oil galley fitting.

Keep in mind, you still have to shorten the drive shaft, and PPF. Once these basics are done, the engine will be in the factory position making it much easier to run V-mounts and regular 13b frontal after market accessories. Also moving the engine back will center it Left & Right within the engine bay. The factory 13brew is biased to the drivers side to clear all the turbo stuff. Mine sits perfectly in center.




That's all I have for now.

 

Thx! Everything you see was completed back in 2007-2008. I can't believe it's been that long ago when I 1st started. At least I'm 98% done now! The funny thing is, to duplicate what I've done would only take me a few months while still fabbing everything. You spend soooo much time planning than actually fabbing anything is why it take so long with these projects. I've learned a lot. With my current knowledge, if I had an Rx7 Specialties sub-frame, hell I probably could do a 20b swap in a couple weeks easy.

 

i like the fact that you have maintained the stock position of the steering rack while also pushing the engine back and down.

 

Appreciate the info.

How is the clearance between the lim/uim from the firewall, any concern there?

 

No! There's plenty of room for a custom LIM. For illustration purposes, I only included my chopped down LIM to show you that there was room near the firewall. You would still have to fabricate a custom LIM (Engine flang to top flang with secondary injector ports) like in my Microsoft paint example. Positioning of the UIM all depends on how you design the LIM. Either way, your going to have to fabricate a portion of the intake to make it fit in this position if you not wanting to cut the firewall. AutoTech fabricated their own LIM and placed the stock UIM practically in the same spot as in my example.

 

Thx! I felt this is the way Mazda would have done it.


Gordon, I noticed the same thing when you post your pics on the other thread. My intake is almost finished, but now I will have to put focus on my dailey driven M5. The damn fuel pump just went out leavig me without transportation. It's always something!

 

No I have the 2000 e39 M5. Wont have enough money to pay for a new one till thursday, so I had to getto rig it. Since my engine is out again on the fd, I decided to use the Fd pump in the bimmer. They flow about the same. This should get me by till the new one gets here. Oh and my intake doesn't use that cut off LIM. These pics are of this past week. I didn't have a camera back when I originally started fabbing everything back in 2007.


Are you talking about using those Delphi units for an exhaust cut out mechanism?

 

I know it's expensive but you can put a dry sump system to eliminate the oil pan clearance issue.

 

Gordon only way for me to know if those would work is to see how fast they respond.

 

With were my engine is, dry sump wont work with the factory dry sump cover. It sticks out too much and would hit the rack. I'm thinking about buying the fabricated dry sump cover from this thread.

https://www.rx7club.com/20b-forum-95/uk-20b-n-pp-build-891781/

Piecing a system together like this should be a lot cheaper.

 

Would be nice to find out which part number of these pumps is it actually

http://paceproducts.co.uk/

Have not found anything from either Pace directly or other parties involved...

 

When I eventually go drysump, the only thing that sucks is having to eliminate one of my accessories. I love the convenience of still having both PS and A/C but one would have to go. I would have to install the oil pump where the A/C compressor is and fabricate a bracket to move the compressor up where the power steering use to be. There's no way I can be without A/C in my part of the country.

 

I'm pretty new to the 20B community, so please excuse my experience.

I am really intrigued by your swap; or more over, the placement of your engine. (20B behind the steering rack, same as 13B)

Do you think that engine placement is a fair trade for giving up certain components or opportunities elsewhere in the build? (lack of ability to use GM bell housing & transmissions, inability to use the Mazda dry sump front cover, having to lose an accessory if you plan to use the custom billet dry sump front cover)

Do you think that if you were to approach the project with your current experience, that you might do things differently?

 

I still plan on installing a T56 later down the line. It will have to have a 13b auto bell housing though. It still will make it difficult to find a tranny that fits the shifter in my engines new location. I really need a junk tranny to test fit. You actually can use the Mazda dry sump front cover. You will just have to raise the engine enough to clear the rack. Originally I had my engine so low that I couldn't install the A/C compressor as it would hit the top of the rack steering gear housing. At that time, the lower engine half was only 1/2" from the bottom of the of the sub frame (which was perfect if you ran a dry sump flat pan and that custom billet front cover). Power steering isn't that important if I decide to eliminate it the future. You only need dry sump if you plan on running past 8,500rpms as the stock 20b oil pump starts loosing pressure. My peak power band is what's gonna determine if I need to go the dry sump route. I'm also in the process of installing the liquid filled FD engine mounts to make it more refined. This will raise my engine 1/4".

Now as far as doing everything over again. I wouldn't change a thing because with where my engine is currently, makes its very easy for me to go 4 NA rotor in the near future.