phalerider

Ok. I filled up and put in a drop of premix. Drove home and as I was backing in a space "sputter and stall" restart "sputter and stall". Now it wont start.

My question is I pulled both main fuel lines and cranked it and no gas spurt from them, Is this normal for rotary's? or should there be a gas flow from the lines under cranking?

I replaced the filter a month ago

I ask cause for me to get a used pump is a 3 hour trip, 1 bus and my bike. So I'd like make sure the pump is the problem before I start my A.M. oddessy.

I searched and got good info on testing and which fuses to chk etc. but no info on if there is flow under cranking.

I'm about to go out and put some gas in the carb to r/o the pump

74RX4

iTrader: (10)

FI or carb? If everything is connected as it left the factory, plentiful fuel should only flow while cranking or running. Many cars have had pump relay jumpers installed by their owners and fuel flows anytime ignition is on.

gsl-se addict

iTrader: (3)

Depnds on the year of the car:

'79-'83 will run the pump whenever the key is 'ON'

'84-'85 will run the pump only during cranking or engine running

Since you didn't post the year of the car, I took a look at some of your old posts. It looks like you have an '84 w/ the 12A?? Anyway, assuming that you have an 84/85 model, there are a few possibilities that would cause this:

1. fuel pump died
2. fuse for fuel pump blew
3. fuel pump relay is bad
4. the portion of the ECU circuitry the runs the fuel pump relay is dead
5. completely clogged fuel lines filter..not likely as you would have seen symptoms before
6. ran out of gas

For an '79-'83 car, you can eliminate #3 and #4 from the list.

Check your fuses and check to see it you have power to the pump when cranking. If fuse is good, but still no power, check the relay next. There is a thread on here that will show how you can bypass the relay so that the pump runs whenever the key is 'ON' (like the '79-'83 cars).

If you are getting power to the pump when cranking, but no fuel is flowing, it is probably a bad pump (or you are out of gas ). You can try to hear the pump while someone else is cranking to see if it is working.

phalerider

1984 12a 1.1 liter (I love saying that). I will remember to post that in the future.

I did get out this morning and pull and test it, the pump works and all the fuses are good.

I believe its the relay. i'm digging thru the manuel now for the location of the relay.

If u know where it REALLY is i'd appreciate it.

THX guys

Kentetsu

Do you have spark on your trailing ignition? You'll need that before the pump will run... A blown trailing ignitor will cause these symptoms...

phalerider

I jumped the pump to the battery and it ran fine, so i belive spark is there. But i havent r/o the ignighters yet. But i dont suspect the igniter. I do keep 3 in the glove box though.

The diagram list either "B30" strut tower, "b25 or 32" behind the headlight

on a 1984 which is the ACTUAL fuel pump relay?

I am going to grab ALL the relays i can get my hands on at the yard but I'd like to have an idea who the problem is...

I can help but think of 1988 when I had to figure this stuff out by as my Toyota tech instructor called it "Letting the smoke out". Hurray for the web.

Thanks again folks.

gsl-se addict

iTrader: (3)

Take a look here:

https://www.rx7club.com/showthread.p...p+relay+bypass
https://www.rx7club.com/1st-gen-archive-71/electrical-car-died-wont-start-my-tach-not-working-car-84-85-a-597857/
https://www.rx7club.com/1st-gen-archive-71/fuel-84-85-fuel-pump-relay-trick-597949/

A bad trailing ignitor will cause no fuel when running, but it should still get fuel when cranking. There is a wire that goes from the 'START' terminal on the ignition to the ECU. The ECU should trigger the fuel pump relay when in cranking mode OR when engine is running. On the GSL-SE, the fuel pump relay is energized while cranking (signal from 'START' terminal) and then requires the flapper door on the AFM to be open to keep the pump running once it starts. On the SE, the injectors fire from the trailing ignition, so no trailing means no fuel (eventhough the fuel pump could still work).

phalerider

I'm reading the links now. but the car will crank and run with 12v to the FP

Rogue_Wulff

Search the archive for "Evil relay". It's the relay under the dash on 84-85 model cars that can cause this same problem.
Here, I found the pic...

phalerider

got it thanks.

Jeff20B

iTrader: (13)

Thanks for posting that Rogue_Wulff! I successfully bypassed the evil relay on the red '84 yesterday.

Rogue_Wulff

NP. FWIW, I found that pic a couple years ago in the 1st gen archive.

On my GSL-SE, that connector is laying in the passenger floorboard (all EGI wiring is GONE, including the ECU), with a jumper wire plugged into it. But, the wire is not run the way the pic shows. It has the wire running to the upper middle location, rather than the lower middle. I dunno why, but without that wire, the fuel pump doesn't run. My son stepped on the connector, and the car quit. I had to remove his foot, and wiggle the jumper, before the pump started rattling again.
Perhaps the SE is wired differently at that relay????

DivinDriver

iTrader: (15)

Totally understandable reaction, though I doubt your medical insurance would have covered that.

Rogue_Wulff

Lol!!!!