Sent you a more detailed pm to the points the guy raised. A fact I did not mention was the Mazda 40A rotary engine was so called because it was 0.4 litres!

 

look im 16 now ok.


im gonna be involved in rotarys probally all my life.

im the next generation. trust me, there not going anywhere.

 

take alook at the size of this forum...and the sizes of other rotary forums...I don't think there will be a problem of them dying out...becuase theres us...

 

I thought I read somewhere that in like the first year or two mazda sold close to 100,000 rx-8's. I'm sorry I can't rember the publication I think it might of been something like "Motor Trend" or " Car and Driver" the artile was about how mazda sold almost twice as much RX-8's than Hummer was selling the H2's. Anyone know what I'm talking about?

 

I think that there is something funny in the water in Kansas.

43,028 or so since production began.

2003- about13,000
2004- about 23,000
2005- about 6,300

That drop from 04' to 05' is killer. Partly because lazy people don't drive sticks and the automatic isn't quite as zoom-zoom as it needs to be. But there is nothing wrong with that cars chassis. I would buy one if I had the cheddar. And its funny Mazda tried to make this one as accessible as possible, unlike the last gen 7. I'm sure some people bought it who wouldn't have bought and no compromise sports car, but they alienated those that would of loved it to be though.

 

RX-8 outsold the FD many times, and is considered a succes. Actually ALL current Mazda models are bringing profit. So why dropping it?
Then for hydrogen engines: Mazda clearly puts it's bets on the rotary for future developments (hydrogen; bi-fuel; hybrid). I can't imagine they would do this if they don't believe in the engine. They must have enough experience with it to see it's potential by now. And yes, other engines can run on hydrogen (or other alternatives) too, but none can do this so easily as a rotary. A piston engine needs mods that will make the engine a compromise. A rotary can switch between fuels with a flick of the finger.
Plus, in europe other companies are building rotary engines. So depending on their succes (or failure...) the rotary engine can either become more widely spread, or indeed a memory.
Right now however, future looks rather bright. And one more thing: Mazda didn't sell 1.6 million rotary engined cars in 1972! That's the total of rotaries they build SINCE then!

 

Just wanted to add this: Mazda has build 1.8 million rotary engines by March 2002. By december 2001 it had build 810.000 RX-7's (all gens together) So they have build 1 million engines other then those in the rx-7's. Undoubtly many of these will have been spare RX-7 engines. I guess they build a lot less cars in 1972...

 

Like I said It was a year or two ago and the article could of meant worldwide sales. I also could be wrong and misread the article. that's why I asked, besides the water here is brown and green and taste like anti-freese, dosen't it look and taste like that everywhere else?

 

lol

brother-FD
me-FB
my dad-Rx8

 

You bring up a good point here from a business aspect, and I do not understand why Mazda has never taken advantage of it. The costs for keeping the rotary alive could easily be spread out over many cars if they just made it an option. Why not make the rotary an option for their most popular car, the miata? Had they done this from the beginning, they would have been able to cater to the rotary nuts, and the **** with poodles, LOL.

Seriously though, they have a good stable of cars, and should exploit the Rotary in some of those applications. It would help with R & D, and make the renesis a more ubiquitious motor.

 

maybe the cost of modifying the other production cars to house a rotary is too great for the the size of the market that would buy it? For your cars that are front wheel drive it would be a first for the rotary ( I think that is right) to be cross mounted in stead of the usual front mounted rear whell drive, so the cost of research development would be too much.

 

FWD rotaries: NSU Ro80 (engine in length)
Citroen GS Birotor (engine cross-mounted)
So, it's done. Actually, I think the reason they do not go this route (= rotary option for other cars) is to avoid costs to homologate such an option in most countries where it would still be a less wanted option due to price and fuel consumption.
Research development to put a readily available powerplant (rotary engine from RX-8) into a readily available chassis (any non-rotary car) are peanuts for a factory.
It's probable more something like nnnot feeling the need to do it, simply because there's not that much demand. Allthough a rotary Miata/MX-5 would be a logical step.
In my opinion, the most economic step would be a new RX-3 sort of car. Based on the "3" platform with a smaller renesis (say 1.0l / 2.0l piston engine equal), some new 10A. It'd be putting out enough power to have a spirited ride (about 75% of RX-8 power, so 150hp shouldn't be a problem) and it'd be a hit in the countries where over two-litre cars are heavily taxed (most EU countries).

 

Thanks for the correction I just knew mazda's history. Didn't know that about the Ro80 or the Birotor.

 

no they had a front wheel drive rotary.

13A
The 13A was designed especially for front wheel drive applications. It had two 655 cc rotors for a total of 1310 cc. This was the only production Mazda Wankel with different rotor dimensions: Diameter was 120 mm (4.7 in) and offset was 17.5 mm (0.7 in), but depth remained the same as the 10A at 60 mm (2.4 in). Another major difference from the previous engines was the integrated water-cooled oil cooler.

The 13A was used only in the 1969-1972 R130 Luce, where it produced 126 hp (94 kW) and 126 ft.lbf (172 Nm). This was the end of the line for this engine design: The next Luce was rear wheel drive and Mazda never again made a front wheel drive rotary vehicle

 

ok fine, I thanks for the corection, thought i knew more than i did.

 

lol dont look at me. i have no clue about it untill i read it.

just off of website.

ive got addicted to anwser.com the rotary section.

ive read about almost all fo em now.

 

I get my information from "RX-7: Mazda's Rotoary engine sports car" By Brian Long. It gives really detailed history of the RX-7 and how it came to be.

 

60 bucks.....

does it have alotta pictures??? : OP

 

the rx-8 is targetted at the recently married, upper middle class urban professional that has two small toddlers. The pragmatic suicide rear doors offer huge opeming, while the small rear seat is ideal for toddlers. The electronically adjustable driver's seat would appeal to the older recently married guy with back problems. The demographics in America show that people are marrying and starting families later in life.

Also the wide torque band and smoothness of the rotary engine allows the car to retain the original "it's a driver's car" appeal. While not as fast as a N350, nor as nimble as a s2000, the RX-8 is a compromise between a driver's car and a family station wagon.

Any mass marketted car that is not a ridiculously expensive abomination (eg. a ferrari, and that's just one) has to be a compromise. I was dissappointed in the performance and handling of the RX-8. But if I had a hot babe for a wife who insisted on a car with rear seats for the rug rats, I'd overlook the performance short comings of the car in favor of my wife's performance in bed.

 

The soft top Capri was built by Ford Australia, directly onto the Mazda 323 platform, it was going to use the AWD turbo platform to create a special sports car before the US beancounters got wind and cut the budget to such a point that it was rushed into production before it had adequate testing for fit and finish, reliability and handling, the car suffered irrepairable and terminal blows to its reputation, by the end of its run it had become a decent car.

By the way Australia got the next generation of 323 AWD turbo platform as a shared Ford called the Laser TX3 turbo. This is the same platform as the early to mid 90's Ford Escort in the USA. The TX3 was a revelation in Aussie rallying until the turbo Subaru WRX arrived.

The father of a friend of mine back then was a Ford Engineer who was responsible for the development of the Capri, he retired soon after, a very disappointed man. His family name was Chell and he was from England.

PS the car was designed from the Geelong Plant, in Victoria.

Stat link: http://www.geocities.com/capricarclub/convert.html

 

You are right, while 1972 was the high point of rotary sales it was only some 240,000 cars.

The error was in my reference, which I did not check as obviously the maths are wrong. 1.6 million +the RX-7 does not equal 2 million. The mistake continues in other secondary references, if you look at the chart posted by NicholasP it has the annual and cumulative scales round the wrong way.

On another point, very few spare RX-7 engines were built as inventory was rolled. It could be less than 2,000 and did not appear in production statistics. The last time I did the exercise, you could build an engine from spares but the retail cost made it 280% more expensive than a total engine plus time of construction!

 

This is an EXCELLENT book. It is more expensive because it is hardcover, but there is a wealth of information, and yes lots of pictures! Another great Rotary book is: Mazda Rx-7 (Sports Car Color History) by John Matras. This one's a little harder to find because it is out of print, but is an excellent insight into Mazda's history, and the history of the rotary engine/RX7.

 

I have not read this entire thread, but I agree with others that the answer is no, the rotary will live on.
When Mazda last killed the RX-7, the Supra and Z car died as well. Too many HP 2 door sports cars, the market just could not support all of them. Look at what has happend in the last 3 or so years, a pleathora of 2 door sports cars have come onto the market. At first they sell in pretty good numbers, but soon the numbers will fall. The rotary sport cars will always sell in low numbers, and even lower as new Miata, Solstace, and a slew of others join the 2 seat (or near 2 seat) market. There is a limited demand for such vehicles and at some point the buyers just arent there. Just my 2 cents.

 

It's a little light on technical aspect but covers models, prices, colors and available accessories. Quite a few colour photos but they are typical publicity shots. Very little information on engines.

I have a good library on the rotary, and have found the most interesting 'Mazda RX-7 Performance Handbook' by Mike Angas great value for money, and mine is falling tp pieces with use. Due to lack of time, I make no pretence of being a good mechanic like Trochiod and Robert and many others on the forum, but it means reading the book I can learn their language and know what is possible.

I just wish someone would produce such a book covering all the stock Mazda engined rotary cars.

 

I've got a pretty good Mazda book collection but not the Matras book listed above. I do have a Matras book titled "Illustrated Mazda Buyers Guide". I believe it has every model of Mazda made thru 94. Tells all the model changes in detail. Very nice paperback from Motorbooks International Publishers & Wholesalers.