MeCalledEvan

iTrader: (2)

I'm relatively new to the RX7 world and need some advice:

I'm looking at the sway bars and strut braces advertised by both Racing Beat and ReSpeed.
Stated bluntly, which brand is better? They look pretty equivalent and I have no experience driving with either setup. Or is a hybrid setup better with some parts from one company and other parts from another.
Suggestions? Anyone?

Also, to adjust camber, what is a better idea? Camber plates from ReSpeed or Adjustable Front Lower Control arms from Racing Beat? And all I see are parts to adjust front camber, where would I find parts to be able to adjust rear camber?

Finally, what would I have to buy/do to adjust the caster on my car as well?

Kentetsu

I could make a long blog here, but all of the information is already available through a quick search and I'm really short on time.

Short answer, Respeed is far superior. There is no comparison between the two at all.

I started out with full Racing Beat suspension, but quickly realized that it wasn't going to meet my performance needs. Not even close.

I started talking with Billy from Respeed, told him what I was looking for out of the car, and he gave me exactly that. Unbelievable difference.

RB camber adjustment is a pain in the ****, and also messes up your toe alignemt.

Respeed camber plates are very easy to use, and also add caster at the same time without messing the your toe alignment.

Racing Beat front swaybar weighs a ton and a half. The Respeed bar is hollow, and (in my opinion) very much better performing.

Racing Beat springs usually result in a higher ride height.

Respeed coilovers allow you to set the ride height exactly where you want it. You also choose the spring rate that you want, so you get exactly the ride/performance quality that you want.

Okay, I'm out of time. Check out some of the videos linked in my signature line to help you make your decision.



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MeCalledEvan

iTrader: (2)

I've seen your videos, Kentetsu. I was hoping that you would respond since I've noticed that you know a whole lot about suspension from browsing this forum and Sterlingmetalworks' forum.

I was also looking at Eibach ground control coilovers. Would you still recommend ReSpeed coilovers over the Eibach? And why?

Keith13b

iTrader: (6)

What are your intentions for the car? That plays a role as well.

MeCalledEvan

iTrader: (2)

Spirited road driving, Autocross, and time attack (racetracks like Pacific Grand Prix, etc etc). For now it serves as my daily driver until my commuter gets a new engine.

zephyr07

iTrader: (2)

I bought racing beat springs last spring. When I finished installing them, 3 corners of the car were higher than stock, while the driver side front sat so low that the tire would bump the fender on hard right turns or even slight bumps (such as pulling into a parking lot). Yesterday, I finished intalling the re-speed coilover kit, the car no longer feels like a 26 year old, $3,000 coupe. The re-speed setup is a HUGE improvement over stock and the racing beat stuff, I was amazed at how well the car handled on its first run yesterday, it corners with zero body roll while still having a decent ride quality. Save your loot a little longer and buy the good stuff..

vipernicus42

iTrader: (4)

I've been running RB springs and KYB shocks for years now and never had any complaints. It's a great upgrade if you're looking for a bit of performance for the street but don't want to spend a lot or spend a lot of time adjusting it.

The Coilover set from ReSpeed is something we've never had before for the FB and offers a huge amount of adjustability/tweakability for the track, allowing different spring rates and ride heights, and it's an amazing value for the money considering what you get. Billy's stuff is always high quality, top-notch stuff (not that Racing Beat's isn't, but we're talking the difference between straight-up springs and adjustable coil-overs here!).

I may consider switching in the future, but for now my RB/KYB setup will do just fine.

The long and short of it is that it comes down to your budget and your goals for the car. I autocross the RB/KYB setup fine, but you can't go wrong with the ReSpeed coilovers

For price comparison, the coilover kit and 4 springs would be about $350 from Billy (and you'd still likely want to buy shocks/struts). The RB springs are $184 (also without shocks/struts). IMHO, worth the extra for the coilovers, though I haven't had experience with them.

The RB lists their spring rates at 145/112 and the lowest spring available for the ReSpeed kit is 200... Though I can't assume that these numbers are interchangeable, I don't know that much about the science behind springs.. If they are equivalent numbers, your ride will get MUCH stiffer with even the "softest" coilovers, which may be something to consider for daily driving. Personally I went RB instead of Eibach at the time for exactly that reason - I wanted a balance between performance and something that wouldn't jar my internal organs when driving on the horrible roads around here.

Jon

jgrewe

iTrader: (1)

Think evolution. RB has been selling the same stuff for years as far as I can tell. When they first offered the set up the bar wasn't very high. Now with the companies like RE Speed and G-Force Engineering that have gone over this chassis with a fine tooth comb the RB stuff is dated.

Street car that will see some track time etc., RE Speed. Track car that might get driven on the road once in a while, G Force. Look at those two companies and you can't go wrong. Both will give you more personal help than RB.

martinhickey

iTrader: (3)

I'm running RB springs purchased from Billy. Actually lowered the car on all 4 corners about 1/2". Didn't know Re Speed had their own.!? Tokico blues all around too. Nice and tight. Good for "spirited road driving." Don't forget new bushings all around! Respeed all the way.

orion84gsl

iTrader: (5)

I, like Kentetsu started off with RB springs and sways. I got the Tokico HP's (blues) whereas he was smart and sprung for the Illuminas up front. The RB parts served me well on the street, but as soon as I got on the autocross course they started showing their limitations. The springs simply aren't stiff enough for any type of competition use and the lack of adjustability means you have to drive around the problems instead of adjusting the issue out altogether.

This year I decided it was time for an overhaul and went with RE-Speed adjustable spring perches all around, RE-Speed race version front Illuminas and regular rears Illuminas. Also got the hollow front sway bar and the R&P kit. I have had the 3 point strut brace for a year now. The brace works well. When I jack the car up it doesn't seem to flex nearly as much. The big thing is, if you go with RE-Speed now, you probably will never have a reason to change anything aside from spring rates, however if you get the RB springs you will likely want to change them after a while. Save some money, time and effort and just go with the RE-Speed parts.

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

the rears probably are, the fronts maybe not.... the difference is preload.

a stock SA/FB front spring is something like 10" long off the car, and its something like 100lbs/in (these numbers are off the top, if you REALLY want the details its in the FSM) the respeed spring is 200lbs but its, well we'll say 6" long.

ON the car its a little different, the stock spring gets compressed down to something like 8" which is 4" of preload.

the respeed spring is NOT preloaded, we'll say it compresses an inch when the weight of the car is on it.

the stock spring is @400lbs for the next inch, 500 for the inch after that and 600 for the inch after that (6")

the 200lbs spring is @200lbs, the next step is 400, then 800 (3")

so the preload puts the two springs on a different curves.

when you have sticky tires and thus traction, you need the stiffer suspension (generally) to control the body movements. more force = more spring.

rwatson5651

iTrader: (5)

Actually, if you look in a different part of his catalogue, Billy offers springs rates lower than 200, as low as 150 in the 7 inch springs which is what comes in the kit.

http://mrcmfg.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=143_145&products_id=421&osC sid=f19d747b5d79d6e976da14f1daa79390[/URL]

MeCalledEvan

iTrader: (2)

Ok so overall I'm seeing that going ReSpeed all the way when it comes to suspension is the best bet for my car. So now the broke college student has his information and has to start saving his pennies...
Thank you for the input everyone. Anyone else with words of wisdom? The more I know the happier I am.

Kentetsu

Sounds like you're getting all the info you need to make an informed decision. Good luck with your project, drink less beer and save more money.

MeCalledEvan

iTrader: (2)

Drink less beer? What kind of blasphemy is this?! Hahaha
Thanks Kentetsu and everybody else for your advice. I will be sure to keep everyone interested updated on my project and my experiences with the ReSpeed products.

EvilWankel

iTrader: (2)

Why do people remove the rear swaybar?

Viich

iTrader: (1)

1 question that I think got forgotten in the mess from the OP, how can you adjust rear camber / castor.

It's not really applicable to the live axel. It just kind of sits there. Some guys have tried heating to get some negative castor by bending the axel housing, but I'm honestly not sure what benefit that's giving, or what cost to reliability / longevity to the rear end.

Re removing the rear swaybar: It's one of those balance issues. Reduce (removing is reducing) bar on the rear to reduce oversteer and help put down power. Downside for Auto-slalom is that the transitions are slower.

I was in the middle of changing springs and shocks, and had started with the rear, when a local autoslalom event came up. With stiffer shocks (illumina's) and springs (150lbs) on the rear than the front (stock & original), I removed the rear bar, and the car was surprisingly drivable.

Anyone can feel free to call me an idiot.

thunkrd

iTrader: (1)

did it as well and yes it is drivable.. but finishing it is even better

MeCalledEvan

iTrader: (2)

No the question was front camber/castor. But Kentetsu answered it with his response that the camber plates that ReSpeed provides allow for adjusting both.

Viich

iTrader: (1)

Just had a nice big 3 days solid of autoslalom for the long weekend, and yes, you are 100% correct. It was awsome. Now, I just need to do 4 things:

1. Brake bias adjuster. I'm not sure how this happened, but the rears will lock up very easily now. I actually think I'm practically using rears only, just because the rears lock up so fast.

2. Actually install the R&P kit. I've been so busy this summer it hasn't happened yet. Must happen before January.

3. Learn how to drive.

4. Think about sticky tires. Old BF Goodrich Comp T/A's are pretty good for a street tire, but no match for hoosiers on concrete.

Kentetsu

Road racers tend to remove the rear bar, while autocrossers seem to prefer having it on the car.

My personal take on this; if using stock bars front and rear, remove the rear only if you are having oversteer issues or if you need some help in reducing rear wheel spin coming off a corner.

If using an aftermarket front bar (RB, ST, etc.), then definitely put the rear bar back on.

If using a Respeed front bar, keep the stock rear or even better, find a stiffer aftermarket bar for the rear. The Respeed front bar is so stiff that it allows you to run a very stiff rear bar along with it, so you end up with nearly zero lean in even the hardest of corners. The rear bar I'm using has three settings for stiffest, and I usually run it on the stiffest setting just fine.

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

sort of. camber is adjustable and by far the more important.

the plate adds a little caster, but the amount it adds (or takes away if you flip it around) is fixed.

not that this is bad, generally castor is a pretty subtle adjustment

the ground control plates DO adjust castor, but probably like 1/2 a degree

MeCalledEvan

iTrader: (2)

Ok so how would I go about adjusting castor?

jgrewe

iTrader: (1)

Move the tension rod hardware/bushing stack forward or backward on the rod.

drive_4_thrills

iv had this in my head for a while now what is better? having camber plates up top for adjustment or having the lower control arm adjust the camber?
Having adjustment up top maybe better with wheel fitment issues?