I've read a few cryptic threads about how best to remove the oil pan to change the gasket on a 12A. No two are in agreement - or contain all of the information needed. I am looking for the definitive answer, as I am about to attempt this. First of all, I do not have a lift or a hydraulic jack. I am limited to the OEM jack, a pair of jackstands and ramps. I am hoping that the thread saying that all I have to do is un-bolt the center link from the frame rail on the passenger side and then lower it down to get the pan out is correct. Does anybody have any hands-on experience with this technique? If so, what tools are required and is there more to it than meets the eye? Do I unbolt the centerlink before jacking up the car...or after? If at all possible, I would like to avoid jacking-up the engine or using an engine hoist. As usual, any pointers or hot tips will be greatly appreciated. THANKS!

 

well, i am going to be ripping mine off here in a bit so i can tap it for an oil return from the turbo. when i do it, i will let you know the best route that i achieved success with. hahahah, dunno how soon your needing to do this.

 

Well, I was going to do it this morning...until I crawled under there. I can wait until I have the best info. I want to keep this as simple as possible. Thanks!

 

I just removed the idler arm from the body and dropped it down out of the way. That will give you enough clearance to remove the pan. Getting the bolts at the front are a pain because of the crossmember but it can be done without jacking up the motor.

 

If you find that you can't get to the ones in the front of the pan, try this.

Remove the engine mount bolts.

Jack up the engine/tranny about 1-2 inches using a jack. May have to check or remove items on top of the engine to allow this much movement. If you don't have a jack that will work I suggest you buy one--you know, a floor jack, the kind to lift up the car real easy.

That should give you enough room to pull all the bolts on the oil pan.

I did this on a T2 engine to replace engine mounts and noticed that I could remove the pan easily if I wanted to.

Good luck.

Scott

 

CrazyJoe12A - should I un-bolt the idler arm from the frame rail before I jack the car up...or after? Rex4Life - thanks for the tip. Those bolts do look near-impossible to get at without moving the engine - but I am going to give it a good try, first.

 

You can get to the bolts after jacking the car up, wthout jacking the engine. You can also unbolt the idler arm after jacking the car up.

 

Do you have to totally remove the pan to change the gasket or just get it to drop enough to scrape the old one off and slide a new one in?

I'll grab my Haynes tomorrow and let you know what they say in that.

 

I'm with REX4Life on this one. Any time i do engine work i unbolt the mounts and jack up the block from right in front of the tranny bell housing. PLENTY of room to do anything you need down there, from the water system to the oil pan, all is right there and easy to use. This is an excellent technique.

 

Isn't there a serous risk of breaking something when you jack the engine up while it is still in the engine bay and connected to everything but the mounts - especially on a car this old?

 

A floor jack or an engine crane (or both) would be nice to use.

Watch for things like the slave cylinder getting crushed and wires, hoses, cables etc getting stretched. I'd be more worried about a newer car with their full engine bays.

 

I have had my gasket for the pan sitting around for a year! Finally I am making time for my Sevens.

Why would anyone loosen bolts from the engine and lift it up if you can get to it just by removing the idler arm? I am only asking this because time is always an issue. If I can jack up my car high enough for me to get under it,then remove the idler arm from its body mount,that seems like the way to go.

Are the front bolts that hard to get to? If it was'nt raining I would go out and look.

 

Yea I bet someone could get the bolts off and scrape off the old gasket without jacking up the engine--but IMHO it will be a major PITA. And if you mess it up you'll be right back there doing it again.

Maybe the 12a's are easier, I can't remember what they looked like up at the front of the pan. But on my 13b it is definitely a tight squeeze--so I'd opt to jack up the engine and have the room to properly scrape off the gasket and r/r the bolts.

Scott

 

Where would be the proper points on the engine to lift it up and out?? I have a 2-ton chain lift that i think i could use, or i could just use the floorjack approach.

 

When you jack up the engine using the floor jack .. I guess the car is what .. up on ramps or candles ? Cuz I DEFINATLY CANNOT see myself under that car without it being jacked ... Tryied it, failed :P lol

 

Eric,

The word is "jackstands" for the rest of us Anglais here.. "candles" is the french term You're giving away your *true* location. (but hey, we love living here don't we?)

Yeah, I'd assume they'd put it up on ramps or jackstands, then use the jack to jack the engine up. With my ramps we can practically *walk* under the car to do it

As long as mine isn't leaking, I'm going to leave it be until I get my engine out for a rebuild or something major. If I take it out for a flywheel replacement or something, I'll do the oilpan at the same time.

Jon

 

OK guys, I finished the job today. I appreciate all of the input. I went the idler arm route. Drain the oil. Loosen the two 14mm nuts attaching it to the passenger-side frame rail before jacking up the car. Jack up the car and put a pair of jack stands (candles?) under the frame rails just ahead of the front wheels. Loosen all of the 10mm bolts around the oil pan. A 1/4" drive works best for the ones above the cross-member. I actually got my 3/8 stuck in there for a while (no fun). You CAN get to all of the bolts without jacking up the engine - NO PROBLEM. After the bolts are removed, remove the idler arm bracket nuts completely and lower the idler arm as far down as it will go. Turn the wheel to get it down all the way. Now, there is PLENTY of room to remove the oil pan and install a new gasket (mine was completely missing??) with Permatex sealant (hot) on both surfaces. After that, just put everything back together in reverse order. Do NOT overtighten the oil pan bolts. There's not really enough room to get a torque wrench in there - so just don't over do it. Gotta go change the filter and fill her up with oil now. Good luck to all and thanks again!

 

Good to know.