Nef003

First time 1st Gen User.. Dont know too much, but i read alot. ;p

Ok, to make things easy,The car was in no running condition when i got it, the engine was sealed shut. I swapped the block with a s4 motor with great compression and i can spin it with my hands freely. ect.

everything stayed the same other than a few minor removals of emissions garbage :p ect..

I changed the front housing and the oil pan (obviously)

The car is a Gsl-se Fuel Injected. (not carbed)

The car has spark and fuel, but one thing i noticed was that the second rotor is not getting any fuel at all at cranking.
i don't know if this is normal on a gsl-se efi setting since it only has 2 injectors;680's i believe ;p

The intake air temperature sensor (the wires are broken) but i don't think this is necessary since i removed the whole vacuum thing which it connects to ;p

The car sputters as if was almost about to start, but it does not. (i have a fuel cut off switch so that i would not flood the engine)

the L and T spark plugs from the front rotor are black from what it looks like oil and fuel. (plugs are new)

(as i mention before, back rotor has sighs of spark but no fuel at all on startup.) spark plugs are like new, no sigh of fuel at all.

AS for Timing. my friend which is really good with rotaries came to my place and adjusted it for me, but i think i might have messed it up again since i wanted to see if the timing was off. so i followed the book instructions on how to do it, and i believe i did it right. (will look on post about timing)

For battery power, im using a Optima with 850 CCA along with a 200amp shop start jumper. so its moving!

Nef003

I figured the problem out.. still trying to get closer but i managed to get the car started, with the help of a friend. The problem consisted of a few error.

1- huge vacuum in the back of the intake manifold (still trying to figure out where it goes to) but when closed off, it starts. ;p

2- the timing is off big time (bought a timing gun today)
*I believe when i changed the front housing, i threw off the Leading points

3- the mass flow sensor (the air door way was not closing all the way. (DW40) did the job. ';p

Will let you guys know when i get her running: have not idea how to use timing gun, so i'll do some reasearch ;p

blackdeath647

iTrader: (2)

hells yeah man, don't know much when it comes to fuel injection, but glad you got things sorta figured out

Nef003

It would not start before for because the 2nd rotor was not getting any fuel!

I removed the Upper Intake manifold and removed the fuel rail, the secondary injector was dry; as it had never spilled out a single drop of fuel!

I didn't have much time to test things because it was so cold out, so i grabbed 2 injectors from (i dont know what car) and it fit perfectly and it started right up!

but after being on for almost 2 mins at 4g it just turned off! as if some one had taken the key out!.. i got scared and thought it had blown an apex seal.

:p so i checked the for compression (1 rotor at a time with no spark nor fuel) while cranking and i heard the sweet sound of all my apex...

*I don't know if the injectors i put on where high or low imps.. this may be a problem right?
so im currently searching to see how to test for impedance. (i'll just take those injectors out tomorrow regardless)

The car when it was on.. was smoking alot!!! the entire time lol. (months sitting and full of fuel and oil and who knows what in there)

i'll check the voltage going to the injectors tomorrow..

(i bought a walbro brand but not the 225).
I also made a kill switch to the fuel pump.
but im sure i used another + wire to give power to the fuel pump, would that be a problem? since the pump is always running at full 12v capacity?

Nef003

searched for impedance and they are low also ;p but they are *BDL 360 INP 014*

360 cc/min
low resistance, 2-3 ohms,

Is it safe to have those there just to have the car started and idle for a while till it cleans?

Nef003

So i put the stock gslse injectors back, the car starts fine, and all. It stays on for about 2-3 most at 3-4k rpm there is hardly any blue smoke coming out now, as it seemed to have cleared all the insides..

After 3-4 mins the car began to miss fire and it turns off drasticly, as if some one turned the key off. i didnt try to turn it back on.

My friend said it may be the thermostat is not working right so it tells the computer to shut off when it gets too hot.. he says this because he turn the heater on to cool the engine and only cool air came out.

also, as stated before, the car starts and it stays at 3-4 rpms. I bought a timing gun but i dont know what to do with it. lol

blackdeath647

iTrader: (2)

well, i suppose they're just like the 12a engine, and on it you get your pick up for the gun from the first rotor. so to adjust the leading, you put it on the front rotor leading, then to adjust the trailing you put it on the first rotor trailing...someone else needs to chime in cuz i don't know **** about f.I. lol about the rpm i'd say it was a vacuum leak or the throttle cable being too tight.

Nef003

Thanks for the imput, it seems you are the only one who is aiding me. lol

as far as vacuum, there was a little one underneath the intake manifold; right next to the fuel injectors. Its a little nipple that comes up. i plugged it.. as far as the throttle cable being too tight; its not, its perfectly fit.

i had a friend adjust the timing. and the car turns on and all but as stated before, doesnt stay on for long, and its too high an rpm ;(

I believe is a TPS problem or thermostat problem.. as soon as it stops raining. (3 days in a row already) i'll get to it.

Please any help is welcome ;p thanks.

blackdeath647

iTrader: (2)

man i wish i'd know what to tell you, but uh..you get another free bump. i know how you feel about the rain tho. it's been raining pretty much non stop for a month and a half now, well we get like a day or two day break every week lol.

Nef003

Ok, I figured out what the problem was!

One of the injector's grove was not in place correctly; thus creating a huge vacuum!

I took care of that, now the problem is back at timing.. lol
Managed to get it on quite nicely, but timing was quite off!

it would stay on at 1200 rmp but when acceleration would take place, it out respond but bucking alot.. so i know it has to be timing..

stupid me, trying to fix the timing.. ended up screwing it more; now my battery is almost dead and timings are way off the scale! lol

( i have read all of the timing settings back and forth.. *will read it again* and even bought myself a timing gun.) lets see if i get it this time around. ;p

Nef003

So i got the timing right this time.. my friend came over and helped me do it.

(didnt pay attention to what he was doing, now that i think of it ...

The new problem is..

1. The car starts but is so damn rich it doesnt iddle at all, and if i cut the fuel, it manages to stay on for about 5 more seconds!
( cleaned the sparkplugs with a metal brush ) they used to be new.

2. When it does stay on, its me accelerating it pass 4k.. anything below that doesnt respond..
like the spark is not working of something.

pressing on the gas pedal responds very well, but too fast!
if i press it lightly it feels as if i had pressed it for WOT. O.o.
The cable is not tighten, is nice and snug, but im not sure if it may be the buttleflies inside or the adjustment screw on top?


3. if i leave the can without pushing on the fuel pedal, it stays on for a little bit at 4-5k and then it shuts off as if some one turned the ignition off.

alot of fuel is being dumped, so to start it again, i have to cut the fuel off.

(the core, is an s4 core with the EFI from the GSL-SE if it may help with the procedure.)

Nef003

Ok, So today i managed to get the car idling at 2k for as long as i wanted!..

how did i do this?

1. i removed the TPS!
2. and block off the BAC valve all together!

this was the only way that my car wouldnt run at 5k+!

I noticed that the car's intake manifold sounded as if it was sucking air from outer space even.. so i began to compress the BAC house with my fingers and i noticed the car would start to decrease rmp.

I thought to myself, why not block the whole damn thing all together since it makes no difference if it was if the prong wire was connected or not.

After Idling for a while, when i went to accelerate, the car would stall and die. (FLOOd) and if i pressed the acceleration lighly it would respond the it would snap and reach 6k in no time ;p

since i have no emision vacuum, should i removed this things all together?

and what is with my TPS anyways? i tried mesuring the Oms and it was .954 and 4.748 at WOT meaning less than 1k and almost 5k at WOT.

74RX4

iTrader: (10)

I would reinstall the TPS and adjust it per the FSM. This is an excellent article on GSLSE idle issues.
http://mrmazda.no-ip.com/gslseidle.html
It also describes the TPS adjustment.

Are you sure the throttle cable is not too tight? It should have a slight amount of slack. Push down on the throttle linkage. If RPMs decrease, your cable is probably a little too tight.

Be sure the big black hose from the AFM to the throttle body has no leaks. There is a joint half way up this hose that tends to leak air. Often the leak is on the bottom of the hose where it is difficult to see. You can check for vacuum leaks by spraying a little carb cleaner near possible leaks. If the RPMs increase the area has a vacuum leak.

I'm guessing you have more than one problem contributing to your high idle.

Nef003

you right.. i do have more than one problem.. AI have already adjusted the tps with the 2 lamps, and i have it so that only 1 stays on.. ;p but the car seems to run better without it.. but i'll make sure to put it on this time.

i'll check for leaks at the AFM if that may be the case.. but has anyone an oppinion on blocking off the BAC valve all together? car seems to respond better with it block off all together.. any ideas on this?

also, i did replace the fuel pump if an after market one, do i need to get a pump regulator? i kind of doubt it.
The fuel pump, i had to rewire since it was not getting any power, now it gets constant 12V + is that a problem down at idle?

Skidtron

iTrader: (1)

Its never a problem as long as your fuel pressure regulator works. And to a degree it doesn't matter what amount of fuel comes from the tank or how fast because the regulator should if it works return all the fuel to the tank that doen't need to be there. I briefly read your posting and it sounds like you need to go through all the checks in the factory manual step by step and check every electrical device and every mechanical device and also calibrate everything according to the factory manual. The factory manual can be found for free at foxed.ca website or something like that. Guessing and turning ***** and blocking off functional parts of the engine is not how to figure out whats wrong. It seems you should make it run right like a stock =engine before you go removing parts from something you don't understand the workings of in the first place. Not trying to be a dick I'm just saying do it by the book then and you will quickly find out whats wrong with the car. Buy a digital multimeter you will need it. If you don't know how to use it find someone that does or do a seach on the internet to find out how to use it properly. Its time to learn so approach it like your going to school. Besides school is more fun when its about something you like. Someone just giving you an answer isn't going to help you the next time somethings wrong. Your car is old and probably has 4-5 things wrong with it at least

Nef003

Thanks for the input really appreciate it.

The problem is I don't have all the vacuums and pieces to make it run stock.. the rats nest which came with the motor is an s4 engine core which im using.. so the upper intake manifold and everything els which is from the s4 is not being used. because i do not have the pieces.

I have to work with what i have.. At first the car wouldn't even turn ;p

I have every necessary tool to get the job done, i.e. Multimeter, Compression Tester, you name it i might have it. ;p

Most of the forum users are carburetor user, so my options are limited; most of the post i have found in regards to GSLSE are mainly carburetor articles.

74RX4

iTrader: (10)

The BAC valve adds air when the AC or several other large electrical items are turned on. The extra air makes the car idle a little higher to compensate for the extra drag from the AC or alternator which is lowering the idle speed. It and the hose leading to it can be blocked off, but I would rather have mine working.

Constant 12v to the pump should not cause a problem, but again I would rather have mine working correctly or at least know why it isn't. A signal from the trailing coil and a switch on the door in the AFM are what allow power flow to the pump in the stock configuration.

If you haven't yet, the FSM can be downloaded here.
http://foxed.ca/foxed/index.php?page=rx7manual

Nef003

I checked the cable and loosen it up a little to see if that was the case, also removed the hose from the AFM and re attached everything.. there seemed to be some oil leak underneath at the bottom where it came together.. so i cleaned it and placed it the correct way. (might have been that) ;p tried to start the car, but started to rain and i stopped.


I dont have any power steering or a/c.

also on the fuel pump issue, i tried to jam the afm door open and check with a volts meter to see if it would send a 12v signal to it, and nothing. i even tried jumping the plug which states in the FSM.

damn.. i wish some of the rotary gurus in this forum lived in East side close to me or something..

Nef003

reading up on some of the previous archive post, I noticed that i don't have the "Vent Solenoid Valve" known also as V&V.

damn.. i wish i could just put the damn car back to original state! but since i don't have the pieces

Nef003

Is there any other way to go about making my car run? It starts and idles real high, 4-6k but when i press on the gas, it bogs from all the fuel. Already Adjusted the tps, The Bac, i dont know if there is working correctly since i dont have any emission.

The timing is right since i got a timing light and all.

vacuums, i don't believe i have any since i have checked over and over using the manuals..

the cold start assist is plugged so i don't have it working. or should i plug that back up?

Nef003

UPDATE: (im also following the guides which are on archives) but they its done on an FC and i have an FB but with an S4 motor ;p (i know complicated)

I bought an s5 UIM and LIM which im going to swap on my engine at my fb..

at the moment i have the the FB fuel injected TB which is not really doing it for me on the idle because i don't have the V&V Solenoid. I'm swapping it with all the s5 sensors and see if its better..

question is,

1) Do I keep my TPS since the prongs are different and there is two on the s5? or would it work?


I'm just going to use the primaries injectors since they are gslse 680cc and i'll leave the ones for the 2nd fuel rail intact. (i dont have calbe going there as yet) will soon get Microtec.


Pictures will come soon.

RXnos1200

iTrader: (24)

I think your intake manifold is not matching up to the block. The FB (SE) and the FC intake manifolds are different.

There's a difference where the middle intake ports are and also where the 6 ports are......

Here's a picture so you can see the difference. I think this where your vaccum leak is........ Hope this helps.....Good luck.

Nef003

Wow.. that makes so much sense!. I did not notice such thing.

thanks so much..

So by using the S5 manifold Upper and Lower, i shall get things straight?

how about the TPS which do i use since the prongs are different and it has 2?

and would there be anything els i should keep in mind?

RXnos1200

iTrader: (24)

I would try to compare the s4 gasket to the SE LIM and see if you can make that work first since you're running the SE ecu and harness. You can get gasket material at most auto parts store and tracing the gasket isn't all that hard. Cutting it out takes alittle patience. I'd also use some silicone around the gasket. S4 and S5 use 4 injectors where the SE uses only 2. I think you can get the SE LIM to work with a new gasket and some silicone.

Just make sure the holes are covered with the gasket material especially by the middle cast iron.

Get it running good first then you can use the FC intake manifold to upgrade for better flow. There's a good write up about how that was done. Check the 1st gen archive and also the FAQ section. Good info there.

RXnos1200

iTrader: (24)

Actually make sure you block the bottom hole on the middle port of the SE LIM and the 2 outer cast irons......