I flooded my GSL-SE today....
03-30-08, 10:09 PM
#1
Senior Member
Thread Starter
I flooded my GSL-SE today....
...and it was my fault. I wanted to clean the garage today so I back the Rx out of the garage and shut it down. When I was done I fired it up and put it back in the garage. Well about 2 hours later we were getting ready to go to dinner and it wouldn't start. Dammit, I knew right away it was flooded as the car/garage smelled of gas.
So now it's sitting w/ the leading plugs pulled, I've not done anything else to it yet.
I had to laugh when I read the "background" on Rotary Performance. With the all the Rx-7's I've owned I should have known better.
EDIT.. what a pain in the ***... self-inflicted pain.. going to take the "complex" route of pulling all 4 plugs, removing the trailing blade connector and the ENGINE fuse, cranking the engine, then putting some ATF in the plug holes followed by buttoning it all and praying it'll start. I promise you I will never short start my RX again.
So now it's sitting w/ the leading plugs pulled, I've not done anything else to it yet.
I had to laugh when I read the "background" on Rotary Performance. With the all the Rx-7's I've owned I should have known better.
The RX-7 is well known for flooding problems. One of the most common is caused by a "short start" condition. The "short start" is when someone starts the vehicle and turns it off before it is allowed to reach full operating temperature. The typical situation is moving the vehicle from one parking spot to another(ex: from garage to driveway). Cooler weather, especially temperatures below 70 degrees, aggravate the situation. What has happened, is the engine is still in the cold-start warmup cycle. Due to a fluke in the engine management’s fuel injection computer, if the engine is shut off during this cycle, it is highly likely the engine will flood itself out the next time the engine is cranked. It does not matter whether you wait one hour or one week, the computer will wait for you the next time it’s started. Once again, this is not something that will present itself as a problem every time you short-start the car. If consistent starting problems are experienced outside of the short-start situation, service is probably needed to the vehicle.
03-30-08, 10:42 PM
#4
Senior Member
Thread Starter
This article referenced the use of ATF. I probably won't go with ATF, maybe just a bit of engine oil. http://www.rx-7.com/tech/unflood-se.html
03-30-08, 11:14 PM
#6
Senior Member
Thread Starter
03-31-08, 07:33 AM
#7
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Someone please answer my question above! ^
I forgot to add one thing. Of the 9 or so RX-7s I've owned not a single one of them ever flooded. For the record this is my first GSL-SE so maybe it's just more of a pain than the carb'd or Turbo II intake systems. Either way, I've learned my lesson.
I forgot to add one thing. Of the 9 or so RX-7s I've owned not a single one of them ever flooded. For the record this is my first GSL-SE so maybe it's just more of a pain than the carb'd or Turbo II intake systems. Either way, I've learned my lesson.
Trending Topics
03-31-08, 09:19 AM
#9
Junior Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Planet errrfffff via Ga.
Posts: 40
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I was thinking the same thing if the computer keeps dumping fuel how bout just cut the fuel until it cranks completely over.. sounds like a good idea.. can anyone else elaborate on this?
03-31-08, 10:38 AM
#12
Rotary Freak
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: SF BayArea
Posts: 2,815
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Locate the ENGINE fuse in the fusebox, pull it out, crank a few times, and replace. You can use the ENGINE fuse as a cutoff for when you park in a bad neighborhood, too.
My SE flooding problems ceased when I had been using MMO for a few months and I switched to Autolite 2626 plugs. That was 2 years ago.
My SE flooding problems ceased when I had been using MMO for a few months and I switched to Autolite 2626 plugs. That was 2 years ago.
03-31-08, 12:35 PM
#13
Who are you?
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: a
Posts: 264
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Never ever let off that key once you start turning it over or you're toast. I also have a hidden fuel pump cutoff switch that will come in handy when i flood it. 9 yrs now and haven't, but I've ALMOST done it a million times.
03-31-08, 03:00 PM
#15
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Good info fellas... Any links to write ups on the fuel pump cut? I'm sure I can figure it out with the FSM but I'd like to see some of your examples.
What a pain in the ***.... in all my years I never had an Rx NOT start due to flooding. Now I know the GSL-SE is prone to do this I'll make sure I have the necessary tools and/or tricks to ensure I can get it started again if it were to stall out or something in an unfortunate place.
What a pain in the ***.... in all my years I never had an Rx NOT start due to flooding. Now I know the GSL-SE is prone to do this I'll make sure I have the necessary tools and/or tricks to ensure I can get it started again if it were to stall out or something in an unfortunate place.
03-31-08, 03:49 PM
#16
TT 1st gen ? We'll see !
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Ottawa, Canada
Posts: 328
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Well, although I don't own an SE, I've got a GSL but deflooding should be rather similar. As posted previously, just cut off gas to the engine, remove the plugs, crank it a few times to get the excess gas out, then put plugs back it, crank it. It should "try" and start then run out of gas. You've just emptied whatever fuel was left. Turn gas back on and you should be good to go. On 12As, you sometimes have to repeat these steps a few times to get her going. Might be a bit different on FI engine.
Take care!
Eric.
Take care!
Eric.
03-31-08, 04:13 PM
#17
Senior Member
Thread Starter
I take it the GSL-SE does NOT close the fuel circuit when the pedal is pushed to the floor. I know this is the case on the newer FI cars (FC's), but the SE apparently doesn't. Good to know.. When I cranked it with the plugs out there was a cloud of fuel, I was waiting for the fire ball.
03-31-08, 07:12 PM
#18
Full Member
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Corvallis, Oregon
Posts: 84
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
03-31-08, 10:41 PM
#19
Rotary Freak
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: SF BayArea
Posts: 2,815
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Pulling the ENGINE fuse kills the fuel pump as well as the FI system. That's the method I used when my SE flooded occasionally (about once a week) 3 years ago.
But then the salubrious effect of MMO started to work it's magic (dissolving varnish and other sticky deposits in the fuel system and the injectors, I suspect) and my flooding problems disappeared. As if by magic. And before I got desperate and replaced the injectors (which was next on my to-do list). It may have helped that I switched to Autolite 2626 plugs, as recommended by another rx7club person.
This morning I went out and started the SE for about 15 seconds before I realized I had forgotten something, so I turned it off. Then I started the SE again and drove around in back to the garage. I stopped it again, lifted the hood, checked the coolant level in the radiator (which was OK, and the coolant was clean), checked the oil, added a little brake fluid, and restarted the SE. All within 10 minutes. 3 starts on a cold engine. No problems. Not unusual.
Oh, then I drove 2 blocks and parked, went into the coffee shop for a latte, came out and restarted without any problem. It's been that way for at least two years.
This SE has 170k on the odometer and was terribly neglected when I adopted it 3-4 years ago with 130k+. It was very sad looking with it's powdering checked paint and sun-faded and torn interior. It barely ran. Now it's the envy of everyone who sees it. It purrs like a kitten (barely noticeable that it's even running) when I'm waiting at a stop sign and roars satisfactorily when I accelerate away.
Give me your tired RX-7, your poor SE, Your faded 13Bs yearning to breathe free, The wretched refuse of your neglected care. Send these, the homeless, to Olde Bliffle.
But then the salubrious effect of MMO started to work it's magic (dissolving varnish and other sticky deposits in the fuel system and the injectors, I suspect) and my flooding problems disappeared. As if by magic. And before I got desperate and replaced the injectors (which was next on my to-do list). It may have helped that I switched to Autolite 2626 plugs, as recommended by another rx7club person.
This morning I went out and started the SE for about 15 seconds before I realized I had forgotten something, so I turned it off. Then I started the SE again and drove around in back to the garage. I stopped it again, lifted the hood, checked the coolant level in the radiator (which was OK, and the coolant was clean), checked the oil, added a little brake fluid, and restarted the SE. All within 10 minutes. 3 starts on a cold engine. No problems. Not unusual.
Oh, then I drove 2 blocks and parked, went into the coffee shop for a latte, came out and restarted without any problem. It's been that way for at least two years.
This SE has 170k on the odometer and was terribly neglected when I adopted it 3-4 years ago with 130k+. It was very sad looking with it's powdering checked paint and sun-faded and torn interior. It barely ran. Now it's the envy of everyone who sees it. It purrs like a kitten (barely noticeable that it's even running) when I'm waiting at a stop sign and roars satisfactorily when I accelerate away.
Give me your tired RX-7, your poor SE, Your faded 13Bs yearning to breathe free, The wretched refuse of your neglected care. Send these, the homeless, to Olde Bliffle.
04-01-08, 07:39 AM
#20
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Pulling the ENGINE fuse kills the fuel pump as well as the FI system. That's the method I used when my SE flooded occasionally (about once a week) 3 years ago.
But then the salubrious effect of MMO started to work it's magic (dissolving varnish and other sticky deposits in the fuel system and the injectors, I suspect) and my flooding problems disappeared. As if by magic. And before I got desperate and replaced the injectors (which was next on my to-do list). It may have helped that I switched to Autolite 2626 plugs, as recommended by another rx7club person.
This morning I went out and started the SE for about 15 seconds before I realized I had forgotten something, so I turned it off. Then I started the SE again and drove around in back to the garage. I stopped it again, lifted the hood, checked the coolant level in the radiator (which was OK, and the coolant was clean), checked the oil, added a little brake fluid, and restarted the SE. All within 10 minutes. 3 starts on a cold engine. No problems. Not unusual.
Oh, then I drove 2 blocks and parked, went into the coffee shop for a latte, came out and restarted without any problem. It's been that way for at least two years.
This SE has 170k on the odometer and was terribly neglected when I adopted it 3-4 years ago with 130k+. It was very sad looking with it's powdering checked paint and sun-faded and torn interior. It barely ran. Now it's the envy of everyone who sees it. It purrs like a kitten (barely noticeable that it's even running) when I'm waiting at a stop sign and roars satisfactorily when I accelerate away.
Give me your tired RX-7, your poor SE, Your faded 13Bs yearning to breathe free, The wretched refuse of your neglected care. Send these, the homeless, to Olde Bliffle.
But then the salubrious effect of MMO started to work it's magic (dissolving varnish and other sticky deposits in the fuel system and the injectors, I suspect) and my flooding problems disappeared. As if by magic. And before I got desperate and replaced the injectors (which was next on my to-do list). It may have helped that I switched to Autolite 2626 plugs, as recommended by another rx7club person.
This morning I went out and started the SE for about 15 seconds before I realized I had forgotten something, so I turned it off. Then I started the SE again and drove around in back to the garage. I stopped it again, lifted the hood, checked the coolant level in the radiator (which was OK, and the coolant was clean), checked the oil, added a little brake fluid, and restarted the SE. All within 10 minutes. 3 starts on a cold engine. No problems. Not unusual.
Oh, then I drove 2 blocks and parked, went into the coffee shop for a latte, came out and restarted without any problem. It's been that way for at least two years.
This SE has 170k on the odometer and was terribly neglected when I adopted it 3-4 years ago with 130k+. It was very sad looking with it's powdering checked paint and sun-faded and torn interior. It barely ran. Now it's the envy of everyone who sees it. It purrs like a kitten (barely noticeable that it's even running) when I'm waiting at a stop sign and roars satisfactorily when I accelerate away.
Give me your tired RX-7, your poor SE, Your faded 13Bs yearning to breathe free, The wretched refuse of your neglected care. Send these, the homeless, to Olde Bliffle.
In the short time I've had my SE it's fired right up even after short starts. It must have been something I did this time cause it to flood. I want to swap out some injectors serviced by KG parts, well I guess I should say injector, I still need another one. If this happened often honestly I won't the car very long. My first car in high school as an 81 GS, I abused that car in every way you'd expect a 16 y/o to do, but one thing was for sure, it always started no matter what. In fact, owning it for 5 years the only thing that went out was the water pump.
04-01-08, 10:35 AM
#21
Rotary Freak
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: SF BayArea
Posts: 2,815
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
My conclusion from my experience with this orphan SE is that the injectors get a little bit of varnish from the fuel and sometimes stick and that causes leakage, sometimes. So the owner puts in new injectors and it solves the problem. But persistent use of any good solvent, such as advertised "injector cleaners", MMO, 2-cycle oil, or just about any oil added to the fuel will eventually clean the varnish off. The OMP won't do the job because it's too late in the airflow. Even ordinary motor oil makes a pretty good solvent: try it next time there's a lot of ugly dirty car crap on your hands, just a couple tablespoons of motor oil on your hands and work them together like it was soap, then remove with a cloth rag. It leaves a little residue film that's a little dark, but removes the horrible stuff and the rest responds to a little dishwasher detergent.
Tolerances in the FI are tighter than in a carb, so that's the first place that varnish buildup will cause problems. But even in the poor orphaned 85GSL I adopted it had a predictable miss when stepping on the gas at highway speeds, that could be overcome by pumping the accelerator pedal. A couple years use of MMO or 2-cycle cleared that up. I just added 6-8 oz. to each fillup.
It was another guy here at the rx7club who put me on to the Autolite 2626 plugs, which he suggested for rx-7s after they flooded. I just left them in. Seem to work good. They have an annular ground electrode which provides a lot more paths for the spark. Of course there's no way to gap them, but who cares? Plugs are properly gapped at the factory.
And don't try to use the 2526 or 2625 or whatever autolite says: they don't have that annular electrode.
But the important thing is to add a little of that helpful additive to your gas. It'll make your 7 hummmmmmmm - just like in the ad.
Tolerances in the FI are tighter than in a carb, so that's the first place that varnish buildup will cause problems. But even in the poor orphaned 85GSL I adopted it had a predictable miss when stepping on the gas at highway speeds, that could be overcome by pumping the accelerator pedal. A couple years use of MMO or 2-cycle cleared that up. I just added 6-8 oz. to each fillup.
It was another guy here at the rx7club who put me on to the Autolite 2626 plugs, which he suggested for rx-7s after they flooded. I just left them in. Seem to work good. They have an annular ground electrode which provides a lot more paths for the spark. Of course there's no way to gap them, but who cares? Plugs are properly gapped at the factory.
And don't try to use the 2526 or 2625 or whatever autolite says: they don't have that annular electrode.
But the important thing is to add a little of that helpful additive to your gas. It'll make your 7 hummmmmmmm - just like in the ad.
04-01-08, 05:44 PM
#23
Senior Member
Thread Starter
This damn POS....
So I pulled all 4 plugs, removed the ENGINE fuse and cranked it over a for a bit. No more fuel vapor was coming out. So I put the plugs back in and cranked it with the ENGINE fuse back in. NOTHING.... So removed the ENGINE fuse and gave it a few short blasts. Of course it wouldn't start. So now this flooding thing has turned into more than I bargained for. I reckon the plugs must be fouled, I don't know what else it could be.
All this over a damn short start, I can't say I'm impressed with my first GSL-SE, if this was to happen again I'd venture to say I won't be a GSL-SE owner for long. I have new plugs coming in the mail. Amazon used to have the 8's for $6/each, now they're $11.95.. damn I should have stocked up.
I'm going to recharge the battery and wait for my new plugs to arrive then run through the whole damn process again. ... What a POS.
So I pulled all 4 plugs, removed the ENGINE fuse and cranked it over a for a bit. No more fuel vapor was coming out. So I put the plugs back in and cranked it with the ENGINE fuse back in. NOTHING.... So removed the ENGINE fuse and gave it a few short blasts. Of course it wouldn't start. So now this flooding thing has turned into more than I bargained for. I reckon the plugs must be fouled, I don't know what else it could be.
All this over a damn short start, I can't say I'm impressed with my first GSL-SE, if this was to happen again I'd venture to say I won't be a GSL-SE owner for long. I have new plugs coming in the mail. Amazon used to have the 8's for $6/each, now they're $11.95.. damn I should have stocked up.
I'm going to recharge the battery and wait for my new plugs to arrive then run through the whole damn process again. ... What a POS.
) when your turning ur engine over to deflood it dude.