Nubby

I've got a 12A with auto tranny that I've been trying to get on the road. It will start more than half of the time, but it takes a whole lot of cranking. Have new battery and plugs. When it does start it sounds good.

I'm sure it needs carb adjusting. I tried a bit but that's kind of tricky when it's hard to get started, and hasn't seemed to make it any easier to start so far. It just cranks and cranks with the odd sputter that may eventually catch.

What would be the common things that may cause hard starting?

jay85gs

Replace your fuel filter, check your distributor cap,rotor, and plug wires, seems simple but sometimes it's the easy stuff we overlook...........good luck.

rolfs_7

i just got mine the first time i flooded her out check and see if ur plugs are wet on the next hard start

Nubby

Thanks guys. Here's a little more info.

It's not flooding out. Plugs are dry and a little brown, but look fine otherwise. I'll try a different set of cables. Don't know how old the fuel filter is, but I tipped it and fuel flowed nicely thru. Always half full of gas on the float glass, at least on the front one that I can see.

Was just out playing with it. Started it up twice, but took a lot of cranking. Here's how it went:
-First of all it didn't start at all the last time I tried the other day, so I gave up before killing the battery.
-Tried today. No choke at first, sputtered immediately, then soon stopped sputtering and was only cranking. Stopped cranking. Pulled choke out while cranking. Noticed that with the choke out only a hair it started to sputter and want to catch. If I pulled out more than a hair, the cranking speed slowed noticeably. If I held the peddle to the floor the cranking speed also slowed. Basically a little choke and no gas had the strongest cranking with some hope of firing. Did this and after a long crank it started catching and firing, so I gave a bit of gas to encourage it and it fired up. Had to open choke a little more to keep revs up and from dying, without having my foot on the gas.
- Running nice now. Warmed up and can push choke back in and still running nicely. Idles about 1000 rpm, but sometimes goes to 750 when I blip the gas peddle. I can put it in gear, but the revs drop to about 500 rpm. If I accelerate very gently while in gear, it will keep running. If I goose it, it immediately dies.
- I tried goosing it. It died on me. Same trick to start, but this time it nearly didn't before the battery was out of juice. Did a lot of cranking then it very gradually started popping and catching. Can hear the engine running and igniting very consistently by only the starter alone, still not self sustaining. Had to continue cranking like this at least another ten seconds before she came fully to life.

Nubby

Tried some more today. Adjusted the carb so it is now at 750 rpm when it is idling in drive. I figured this was part of my problem and would probably solve how it stalls when in drive and the gas is goosed. It was at 500 rpm in drive before.

Seems to be that it's always harder to start when the engine is hot. After the adjustment it seems even harder to start (at least now that it's warm). Couldn't get it going again after it was good and warm.

Any ideas?

bliffle

I had a similar problem, the plugs looked good but car started hard. I replaced plugs and it started fine.

I'm guessing that there's something else marginal in the ignition system and that marginal plugs aggravate the situation causing the car to not start. Replacing the plugs leaves just the original marginal function, so the car starts again. The trick is to find and solve the underlying marginal problem. Could be anything from a lifted ground to a cracked distcap, bad hightension wire, bad coil, etc.

I just don't know. Yet. But i track all the hard-start threads and some day, some way, I hope to solve it. One thing that would help is a spark-strength meter of some kind that would show the voltage delivered to the plug. Maybe even a time-trace of the voltage. Maybe that 'carputer' is what we need.

ziig

iTrader: (1)

try some 2 stroke into the carb if it starts right up , it will smoke, then you have compression issues making your situation more difficult. Also try idle screw turn in a few turns and see if that helps keep idle up....on a auto you may want about 1300 rpm so when u engage the drive it will drop to 1000. some models came with a modulated idle control, not sure which ones though

Jeff20B

iTrader: (13)

Try a little regular oil down the carb (I doubt you have 2 stroke within easy reach). If it starts right up with a little puff of smoke, it means your starter is spinning too slow. Get another one.

Nubby

I did the oil down the carb trick a few months ago to try to get it started. It didn't make a difference until I got a new battery and plugs. Once I got these I was able to start it.

Nubby

Had zero luck starting it last three times I tried. I pulled the plugs out and they were now black. Cleaned them up using gas and a tooth brush. It got some of the black off but a decent amount would not come off. Is there a more effective way to clean spark plugs? Don't want to have to buy new one's just to blacken them too. I haven't even driven around the block with these ones yet. I put them back in and tried a different set of plug wires. Still no start or popping. I wonder if to battery is now too low or if the plugs still are too dirty.

Does this sound like a good theory? Some thing isn't quite right, which is gumming up my plugs, so I get a weaker spark the more it is run. Once i figure why the plugs are getting dirty I may be in the clear. What could be causing this?

The starter not spinning fast enough may also be a good theory. It sounds okay to me seems to spin about as fast as the starter in most other cars, but maybe it needs more?

bliffle

Starter is prolly OK. Car should start even with a slow battery.

Guys here like to clean plug insulators with Brake Cleaner. It's powerful stuff. You can also get a gadget that cleans with Air Compressor powered fine grit. It's a little box with a rubber diaghram with a hole to stick the plug in. Turn on the air and it scours the electrodes and insulator with fine grit. Some guys complain that it takes the vitrified glaze off the insulator, compromizing it's performance. I think HarborFreight has it. But the brake cleaner option is easy, cheap and safe to try.

Jeff20B

iTrader: (13)

A wire brush works ok. Or a wire wheel.

jshiz

iTrader: (4)

Mine did that for a while, but a have a 5 speed. I just had my ignition box taken out, cleaned, and re-oiled. The engine always starts on the first crank now.

But check you ignition, your promblem could lay there.

Kentetsu

Sounds like you either have no spark on the leading side, or your timing is way off. Of course, you'll have to get it running before you can set the timing...

bliffle

So there's no way to static time the 7?

Nubby

Took some brake fluid to the plugs. It got them cleaner. Much easier to start once cleaned up, but I doubt they will stay that way. I think this is the majority of my problems. The black coating is preventing the plugs from firing as strongly as they should. Any ideas on what causes the plugs to crust up with black crap? Would it simply be an out of adjustment carb, or could there be other culprits like timing or even something else?