I am heavily considering on purchasing a S5 TII. I currentyl own a 13b 85 GSL-SE and am looking for something with a little more power and style and just something different overall, yet with the RX7 quality. I have read that the cars are pretty well built, i do not know how they compare with the GSL-SE(all i can say is that my baby is a marvel) but they are nice quality cars. I was wondering to those who have driven both, what do you find as the main differences? How about the power?, can you tell the difference substantially? I know that the standard is around 200hp along with a beutifully ugly body...i prefer the body of the original, but i would probably plan on getting a body kit or just have a good friend of mine make something.

Anyways, i guess the post here is to just get your opinions on those cars. I would probably get a 90 or 91 model. Like i said, i posted here because, as i have found, this forum (1st gen) seems to be the most helpful, and also i would like to get a take on those who also own a first gen as myself. Thank you for any input.

 

they're bigger cars and definitely feel like it. faster, too, though. i like the tossability of my little gsl-se. the TII is certainly a different beast.

 

I love my GSL-SE but I will always be at home in a 2nd gen. If I had my pick between the 2, I'd still choose the 2nd gen.

 

What is it that attracts you so much to the sec. gen?

 

fc's are notorious for electrical problems, they are very good cars though
alot better ride than a first gen
but i sold my fc to get my gsl-se so thats says something right there

 

The FC is better but a totally different car from the bean. Handles better, and is also tossable, but heavier and bigger. It has more power, and more modern looks but the SA/FB is a timeless classic. The big difference to me is that it hurts a lot less when you crash in an FC. You should put a TurboII engine in your 1st gen. and a wide body kit maybe

 

I was thinking about that, but i think that it would be just a cheaper route to go ahead and just buy a TII instead. If i were to do it, I would probably pay RotaryPerformance which would probably be several thousand. I had a friend(once friend) that was going to do it for me, but something happened with him and his family and our family, so now he does the grown up thing and doesnt talk to me anymore. So i really am just throwing out some possabilities.

 

Im doing the TII swap into my GSL-SE because the TII engine is badass but the car is just plain ugly. Its only costed about 3K and that includes all kinds of stuff(rebuild and streetport, haltech E6K, full exhuast, ACT 4 puck clutch, ect.). What I did was go to the junkyard and bought an S4 TII for 300$ so I had all of the parts. Took everything I needed and then called another junkyard to come pick it up and they payed me 50$ for it.
I think that if your not going to do the swap yourself than you should definetely no do it because it will be expensive especially from RP who I really doubt will do it because everytime i call them or go down and see them they say that they dont "deal with first or second gens anymore".
So go with the TII because it is faster and you can definetely feel it, especialy with some mods on it.


Where are you at in texas

 

i traded my GSL-SE for my 1987 turboII. the way the -SE handles, well the 2ed gens nailed it. it's bigger, heavier, and of coarse theres more power 182 hp for the s4 t2.
the -SE's are limited but do make better power and torque then anything 12a and any 2ed gen turbo and non-turbo make better power the the -SE's. i've found the 2ed gens to be pretty well balanced, mazda crammed alot into the driver controls
and the wiring could become a nightmare while a 1st gen (-SE) is very simple.IMO
i'm very happy i traded my $150.00 dollor (i paided) -SE straight across for my 87 t2.
everything i've learned about both 12a and 13b-egi 1st gens doesn't really carry over to the 2ed gens. it's a different car .

 

I live by Denton

 

i have driven both, and i like the feel of the gsl-se better. the 2nd gens feel big and numb to me. i also dont like the turbos power curve as well, stock ones feel dead and unresponsive, and they have no power over 5000, the t2 is faster, but with the stock exhaust it doesnt feel faster, especially the 86-88's.

gsl-se to me feels like home, maybe i've been driving them too long =)

 

My friend's 87 SE compared to my 85 GS...well my car drifts way easier, and my car is easier to drive fast. I do like the feel of the 2nd gen though, much better ride to me. Not to mention my 12a is a little weak yet still fun in my opinion. Also the FC seems to get more attention, but I have emotional attachment with my car even in it's good running but painfull asthetic condition. I am also actually trying to get a black S4 TII.

 

well i got some plans that are now in the future...I wanted to keep my 85 SE with me very badly but i must get money to get a FC...so this is the deal..

My baby has over 225k on it and i know it is going to go soon..i mean things dont last forever. So i live about an hr away from garland so i am taking the car to Rotary Performance and going to have them rebuild the engine. After that i am selling the car...to my dad He really likes the car. Well, i know that the 85 will be in good hands then i will be looking to purchase a 91 S5TII. After i purchase the car I will give it a Racing Beat Exhaust and upgrade the fuel system as i have read those are the two main things that need to be done.Aswell as getting gauges. Ok so after i have that settled, i am going to take that one to rotary performance and have them rebuild the engine on that car to get everything in tip top shape for after all that is finished i am going to put a bigger turbo onto the car,(maybe a HKS t40) something big and nice. Along with 720cc and all that good stuff to make it work.

After my car is running nice and smooth, i would like to be able to handle GTs easy, i am going to take it to mexico to my good friend who has people all over mexico go to him for his work. He is going to do a custom paintjob, custom leather interior and fabrication, and a custom body kit. I hope to have all of this done within a year to year and a half.

The funds should be ok. I live at home, the college i attend is only a 30 min drive, I got a new job working for vista(work 40hrs aweek),only allowed to take 6hrs a semester of college at most, and got promoted at my other job at SEARS which i will only be working 25 hrs a week after I start working for VISTA.

but anyways, those are my plans for now, and i am really getting excited. Anyone have any comments?

 

Alot of it probably has to do with the fact that it was my first RX-7. That car is long dead and I have the GSL-SE now. The 2nd gen to me handled much better. There are so many flaws in the 1st gen suspension design. The steering was perfect in the 2nd gen. I felt no loss of power above 5000 in it and would regularly take it up near 8000. In contrast, the GSL-SE falls on it's face after 6500 rpm stock. After I ported mine, it still isn't good above 7000 rpm. This has to do with the smaller air flow meter. The 2nd gen was a more refined car. Yes it had electrical issues and mine had to be fixed just like everyone elses. I had all of the normal problems. The car stopped better and turned better than the first gen. The exception was turning when it comes to an auto-x track. The 1st gen is king there. I also like the styling of the 2nd gen interior more. The 1st gen rattles and shakes more. It does feel more like an old time sports car. For nostalgia reasons that makes it cool but it doesn't mean it is a better car in any respect.

The 2nd gen is a car that you can slide around and predict exactly where it is going to go. The first gen is different. Just because it is pointing there doesn't mean it is going to go that way. The sloppy steering really makes this difficult. Everyone complains that the 2nd gen is heavy. This isn't true at all. Yes, it is heavier than the other generation RX-7's but it is still lighter than every single competing sports car against it by a fair margin. Any car under 3000 lbs isn't heavy. The car doesn't feel heavy in corners unless your suspension was worn out. I had Tokico Illuminas and Eibach springs. That car was rock steady in a corner. I haven't ridden in a 1st gen that felt like that.

There are alot of things that make me like my 2nd gen better than my 1st gen. It is just a more refined car overall. There are also many things I like about my 1st gen. While I wouldn't trade one for the other, if I could own only one, it would be the 2nd gen. My 1st gen is fun though and I've got big plans for it.

 

[QUOTE=LaRazaUnida]well i got some plans that are now in the future...I wanted to keep my 85 SE with me very badly but i must get money to get a FC...so this is the deal..

My baby has over 225k on it and i know it is going to go soon..i mean things dont last forever. So i live about an hr away from garland so i am taking the car to Rotary Performance and going to have them rebuild the engine.


I live in plano(about 20 min away from rotary performance and i already talked to them about rebuilding my GSL-SE 13b and a 12a and they told me that they dont deal with first gens anymore. They were real ******** to me. There are places around here that are alot cheaper and willing to do the work besides RP. I know of a couple in Fort worth that ill post tommoro if you are serious about getting it rebuilt.

 

That sucks! A rotary is a rotary. Maybe they don't know how to work on first gens.

 

Yeah they have changed alot in the last 10 years. They used to work on all 7's and even on miatas. I have a key chain that I got when I bought my first car and its from RP and it says " RX-7 and miata specialists"

 

i just sold my TII car.
I like some things about it. i like the fact that the interior is a little larger and sculpted. I like the additional power it came with stock and great brakes.
the steering is great, Nice seats.


I didnt like the seating position.
the 16mpg of premium gas and only 200hp (Pathetic!)
it weights to much and the rear steer is awfull and not super cheep to get rid of.
its less reliable by far than a first gen.

All in all I do not miss my 2nd gen. I like the styling my the first gen better, it feels much more sporty and definately has a better seating postion for agressive driving.


Oh also..and no TII guy will admit this....a Gen 1 car 12a or 13b tuned to about 150hp...which is easy...intake exhaust ignition combined with a little lightening
can out accelerate a stock Turbo II.

 

The restrictive stock turbos on those cars was the reason for the poor gas mileage. There is nothing efficient about those thurbos at all which is funny since every one wrongly claims that a turbo is always the most efficient form of forced induction.

The rear steer does suck. You are correct. It is absolutely cheap to fix. The rear steer eliminators are $40 new. You don't need a press to install them. Just a hammer and a socket that is the same size. Fantastic upgrade.

The last part you are absolutely correct. No 2nd gen guy will admit that because it is wrong. Everyone thinks that the Turbo II is a slouch off the line. It isn't the fastest thing admittedly but it will beat even a modded 1st gen. If by a little lightening you mean removal of the carpet and spare tire, that's not enough to make you noticably faster. My GSL-SE when it was stock ran perfect. Everything worked. It had the Racing Beat Streetport exhaust. The car felt fast so I raced my friend's T-II thinking I'd win. Nope. It wasn't bad though. The 1st gen just feels faster than the 2nd gen. I've owned both, I know. Even if you get a 1st gen up to a T-II speed, all they have to do is 1 simple cheap mod to go faster and you're stuck. You could port it and mod it all you want but that T-II will always be able to out accelerate you for little money. He'll kill you on the freeway.

The reliability part is true. When there's less to go wrong on a car, it is generally more reliable. If you get a 12A 1st gen, it'll go forever. The 2nd gen does have many small problems over time.

I like both cars but you can't compare them to each other in performance terms by the way they drive. The 1st gen just feels quick and agile. The 2nd gen may feel heavy and slow but it is still faster than the 1st gen on the street. The small slow auto-x track is where the 1st gen shines. Faster than that and you've got alot of work ahead of you. Performance is what matters to me. I love my 1st gen but really want a 2nd gen again.

 

With a carb and exh the 1st gen will accelerate quicker. I had a 13B 4 port with a Mikuni. I would be quicker off the line but Tii's would catch up at the 2nd or beg of 3rd and pull away from there.

 

whats a s5 quarter stock?? its around 14.9 right?

a gen 1 can run a 14.9 with a msd carb header and exhaust.
take out the ac crap and a little of the junk in the rear..specially that heavy rubber mat and your there.
thats about all your gonna get from the stock motor.
the SE motor does have a little more potetial but the cars also a bit heavier.
ive been in really fast stock port SE cars that are professionally tuned. their quick.
stand alone efi does wonders.


the TII is a nice refined car and definatley has BIG potention...which is why i have a s5 motor in my gen 1! best of both worlds..

bang for the buck the TII wins. you can get a nice TII for 3k..maybe an s4 but its still a good start.

the s5 turbo with a 60 upgrade is an awsome turbo...its just in stock form that it sucks alot.