13bturborx7

iTrader: (34)

Hi guys. I bought a gsl se and I am about to take the motor out to do some upgrades to it. here is a list of things want to do with the motor

racing beat street port full ex system
street ex port
mild/large street port
front cover shim/ port front plate for oil flow upgrade
exedy stage 2 clutch
atkins actuator sleeves
throttle body and intake porting and polishing


im looking to make a streetable car as close to 185 wheel horsepower as possible.

does anybody know what ecu options I have? or will the stock ecu make up for the difference? also will the stock injectors work well for the setup? any help will be greatfully accepted.. thanks guys!!!

MRGSL-SE

You should just drop a Renesis into the SE save you trouble from picking what aftermarket ECU to chose from.

flight_of_pain

I am a big proponent of megasquirt, I have a 4-port 13 using -se rotating bits, a tallport center iron, and r5 endplates, with a big streetport. I love it.

Isaac

13bturborx7

iTrader: (34)

See the thing is is that I want to keep the stock injection system. Will I be able to do so and keep all function?

diabolical1

iTrader: (3)

i don't know about your budget, but I think a Megasquirt 2 or 3 would be great. i'm not the biggest fan of the SE engine, but you can make decent power with it. however, I also think you should probably throw a flywheel, Gen II intake setup and some better injectors in the mix.

13bturborx7

iTrader: (34)

Money is not the problem. Just want the right setup with reliability. What injectors are you thinking?. And what setup you think? From an s5?

diabolical1

iTrader: (3)

from what I've read, the S5 intake system is "better". how much so? i have no idea and to be honest, i never had a real reason to seek an answer to that particular question. i have a long term 6 port project and i will eventually get around to trying to answer it, but maybe you can find out first.

for injectors, i'd try 4 Rx-8 secondaries.

MazdaMike02

iTrader: (4)

S5 intake has air pump actuated 6pt actuators, tuned runners and a VDI system. Its good for at least 5-10 hp over an S4 setup. Makes the powerband smoother as well, you'd have to rig up an air pump with rpm switches for them but it'll sure give you a nice driving car. I would go with an MS or Haltech. I would also check out The Adaptronin units Turblown is selling, reasonably priced.

Starfox07

The S3 intake manifold is a big power killer. Switching to the Dellorto gave me big gains and that's mostly due to the higher flowing intake manifold and twin 48mm throttle plates. If money isn't an issue, I would look into an IDA-style intake with ITBs and a standalone, probably haltech.

flight_of_pain

The megasquirt plays nice with all of your stock intake/electrics, but as was mentioned, the -se intake is not the most conducive to making HP. The s4 intake swaps with minimal fuss, the s5 with more fuss, but better gains. I am running a TII intake with a pair of 1000cc bosch ev-14s in essentially the stock -se location.

13bturborx7

iTrader: (34)

So from the looks of it. Im looking twards the s5 upper nd lower intake and s4 tb to mantain thd omp. Rx8 secondaries on all 4 and a megasquirt. Id there anything else I should jnow b4 I go ahead with this project?. It would be nice if sombody has dond this b4 and wants to chime in.

ioTus

iTrader: (5)

Without swapping the intake manifold I doubt you'd be able to get 185 at the wheels out of the setup. The s4 intake is better, the s5 even more so.

How much better? Well s4 was rated from the factory at 145 and the s5 at 165, all with a similar-enough 1.3L keg. Those power gains are largely facilitated by the optimization of the intake manifold.

Stock -SE injectors are 680cc x 2. You COULD use the stock ECU and injection on an S4/S5 intake, however the benefit of the optimized intake is partially negated by the ECU's reliance on the Air Flow Meter. You'd be able to make noticable increase in power with that setup, but there'd be more to unlock.

A standalone will work great for your goals. I'm using a Haltech F9 fuel-only computer, which basically replaces the stock computer, leaving the distributor ignition in-tact (or whatever other ignition you'd like to use).

I've read several success stories with a Super AFC, but its grey area for me as it seems more like a hack than a solution.

There's a few caches of info on the S4 intake manifold swap. Then there's also a 2nd-gen-specific writeup on S4 to S5 intake swap. Between reading those you can start to get an idea. There will be slight fitment issues but its workable.

Then you could bump up to 4 injectors. I'm using S5 460cc x 4. My understanding is that that will flow enough for mid 200's hp to the wheels, no need to go much larger unless you'll be bridge or peripheral port

I'm using an S5 intake with 6 ports and VDI. I will be doing a write-up on a standalone 6 port / VDI system that does not require an air pump. That is, supposing it works. Final parts arriving today or tomorrow. Testing begins shortly thereafter.

From reading a bunch of threads on ppl porting out their intake manifolds, there seems to be little benefit to be had by this - even just port matching at the flanges. I've heard some suggest NOT polishing / porting as it smooths out the surface of the intake, which was specifically engineered to have a surface that does not condense the air / fuel mixture.

I have heard good things about modifying the throttle body though... no power increase but "much better throttle response". I don't know, I think I'd have to take a test ride in one first before I could vouch for that. I also read one person's experience that it isnt worth the trouble, and its possible you end up with a ruined part thats increasingly harder to find.

here's some links:
https://www.rx7club.com/1st-gen-arch...mplete-750214/

This is what remains of the s4-to-s5 swap site:
89 Intake Swap Introduction
(the actual site: http://homepage.mac.com/carldavis/intake.html)


https://www.rx7club.com/1st-generati...ake-se-367313/

https://www.rx7club.com/1st-generati...gsl-se-638030/

my $0.02

~Geoff

ioTus

iTrader: (5)

Oh and also check this dood out

https://www.rx7club.com/build-thread...-heart-992949/

Edit: and also note that the S5 VDI intake will hit the -SE block, which will need to be ground down.

13bturborx7

iTrader: (34)

Im debating on weather yo just go full s5 swap or s5 intakes. I have the chance to get either or right now just debating on what to do.

Starfox07

I know this proposal won't be popular around here, but have you thought about a carb? Truth be told I've had issues with mine, but that was actually not due to the carb itself and the issue had been there even when it was EFI. I feel my car is around 160whp or perhaps even more with my Dellorto 48 on a stockport S3 13B. With your porting and exhaust, I think you could hit 185whp or maybe even higher with a Holley or DHLA/DCOE. It will sound better (well it does to me at least) than EFI too. Hard to beat the sound of a twin choke (Weber/Dell'Orto) carb on a 13b. I'm not there yet, but I'm confident my Dell will be just as civil on the street as my EFI was, although the fuel mileage is worse. Best of all, it's cheap. I'm about $600 in for the Carb, Intake and everything else I needed for the swap. An S5 long block with a Holley or Weber would be very strong in a first gen.

ioTus

iTrader: (5)

$10-20 per jet, there's 10 jets total (Two primary jets, 3 piece @ $10-20 a piece, two idle jets, 2 piece, $10-20 a piece, plus try actually finding a source stateside).

Thats $200 on top of cost of carb, just to attempt to tune it. Wrong emulsion tubes? $40 MORE. wrong jets? $40 MORE.

Boom, cost of EFI standalone reached. Plus each change you make you have to wait 1 week for the parts to ship. Go visit a racetrack at a lower altitude? Don't pop your engine from leaning out too much!

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

exactly, i have gotten really good results from my weber IDA, and i'm really glad i did it, but i easily have $1000 into it.

plus you can change EFI with a button, and the carb jet takes two days to arrive....

ioTus

iTrader: (5)

Granted a Weber is FAR easier to source jets than a Dellorto - still its not as "cheap" and "easy" as a lot of people make it out to be.

I suggest studying Wicca or African Voodoo to learn the more esoteric arts of carb tuning.

13bturborx7

iTrader: (34)

Thanks for the suggestion but im 100% goin with fuel injection. Not only is it more efficienct but il save money in the long run on fuel regardless. Im not a fan of carb at all..

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

while there is some complex physics going on in the Etube, actually tuning the carb is so simple everyone over thinks it

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

if you're starting with a GSL-SE i kind of like Iotus's proposed setup, fuel only haltech, stock ignition, your choice of intake manifolds (S3,4 or 5), either the 2x680 or 4x460 injector.

so you have a couple of choices, but its pretty basic.

a full ECU needs ignition too, which is ok, but you have to buy it, and wire it. i do like the new haltech platinums, they are so much better than the older ecus i actually wonder how we ever got our cars running back in the day.

13bturborx7

iTrader: (34)

think im leaning tward the full s5 swap.... just debating on weather to go with the fuel only computer and keep the distributor or go to the crank sensor and just get one of haltechs new engine management systems..... hmmmmm

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

i like the newer haltechs, they work really well and are easier than the older ones.