front end collision-i want to repair it-pt. 2 detailed pics
12-23-07, 12:02 AM
#1
front end collision-i want to repair it-pt. 2 detailed pics
ok, well i went to the shop tonight and took some more detailed pics of my 85 GS. stilettoman has been helping me with his experience and advice regarding the matter of repair for the GS. i figured i'd post some more pics for everyone and see what everyone thinks is the best avenue of repair based on the updated pics. stilettoman, if you get to reading this, i think i am wanting to try and stick with the drilling of the spot welds and the cutting of just before the strut tower as you had suggested. the core support is bent all the way up to the left side of the body but not into the body. the pics will speak of the damage for themselves.
12-23-07, 12:29 AM
#3
the first thread explains why i want to save the car: https://www.rx7club.com/1st-generation-specific-1979-1985-18/front-end-collision-i-want-repair-714024/
12-23-07, 09:43 AM
#5
Talk to a frame shop first. A couple hundred bucks for time on a frame machine they will pull by grabbing on the damaged parts and probably straighten out more than you think can be saved. Then you cut out the really bad stuff and take whats needed from the donor car.
They will also have all the measurements you need to be shooting for to make it right.
They will also have all the measurements you need to be shooting for to make it right.
12-23-07, 11:28 AM
#7
^^^^thats correct. i have the unitbody measurements from my FSM that i am going to use as well as the advice given to me by peple in the first thread. i cant afford to have it straightened by a shop. that and i'd be losing the experience of doint the job myself if i sent it out.
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12-23-07, 11:44 AM
#9
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Same thing happened to be a few week back.. sorta.. not so much the whole front end but the entire front right side frame was warped bad and would require chopping it off and re-welding. So I just ended buying another 7 and swapping out most of my good stuff, easier that way, you WILL most likely spend more doing it the repair way. Unless you're doing the work all your self.
12-23-07, 02:42 PM
#11
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Talk to a frame shop first. A couple hundred bucks for time on a frame machine they will pull by grabbing on the damaged parts and probably straighten out more than you think can be saved. Then you cut out the really bad stuff and take whats needed from the donor car.
They will also have all the measurements you need to be shooting for to make it right.
They will also have all the measurements you need to be shooting for to make it right.
I am definetly interested on how well this goes as it will help me in the near future of repair some... not so straight parts of teh front.
12-24-07, 02:21 PM
#13
thank you! hopefully with the help of a friend or two i can lift the wrecked section out and weld the new section in. it'll take a lot of patience and time! i plan on documenting the whole process in pics and in a thread. i'm always open to advice on the repair. you just dont see many ocean blue metallic 85's around and to me this car is worth saving!
12-24-07, 02:36 PM
#14
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^^^^thats correct. i have the unitbody measurements from my FSM that i am going to use as well as the advice given to me by peple in the first thread. i cant afford to have it straightened by a shop. that and i'd be losing the experience of doint the job myself if i sent it out.
the frame straightening machine will straighten the lower main frame rail, however you'd still need the radiator support, and the right apron assembly
its fixable, but its also a pretty hard hit.
12-25-07, 01:29 AM
#15
"Someone reccomended that I stay away from the frame straighting machines because they will fatigue the metal and weaken the frame more. "
This is obviously a quote from someone who has no knowledge of automobile structural repair. I have been straightening bent metal since about 1958, and I have a couple of degrees in aero engineering, so I think I have a pretty good understanding of fatigue issues. The attached photo shows a 1964 Alpine which I repaired in 1966. I bought it thinking I could find a front end for it, but after searching for several months on the west coast, I decided to just repair what was there. None of the sheet metal was replaced - I straightened everything myself, including the frame rails, which were only slightly bent. I was still in college at the time, and had limited tools (not to mention limited funds).
Close examination of the photos at the top of this post shows that the right lower frame rail is buckled just aft of the crossmember forward attach bolt (see how the hole is distorted). That is very common on these frames. Unless there is damage aft of there which cannot be straightened, I would cut at the midpoint between the two crossmember bolts. But I think it is likely the crossmember is pushed to the left, meaning both frame rails are bent to the left. In any case this should be carefully measured and if they are, this MUST be straightened before the damaged parts are cut off, as I said previously. Get the car up in the air and take diagonal measurements from the aft crossmember bolt to some tooling holes or other features on the bottom of the frame rails further aft. Any sideways deformation may possibly be corrected by pushing diagonally with a Portapower from corner to corner in the engine bay (which you obviously cannot do once you cut off the front end). If you don't have a Portapower, or can't borrow one, I recommend you buy one or don't attempt this repair. You can buy a 4 ton Portapower set from Harbor Freight for about $120.
As for getting the experience, if you have someone align the frame rails and you do the cutting and welding of the new front end, you will still be doing 95% of the work.
This is obviously a quote from someone who has no knowledge of automobile structural repair. I have been straightening bent metal since about 1958, and I have a couple of degrees in aero engineering, so I think I have a pretty good understanding of fatigue issues. The attached photo shows a 1964 Alpine which I repaired in 1966. I bought it thinking I could find a front end for it, but after searching for several months on the west coast, I decided to just repair what was there. None of the sheet metal was replaced - I straightened everything myself, including the frame rails, which were only slightly bent. I was still in college at the time, and had limited tools (not to mention limited funds).
Close examination of the photos at the top of this post shows that the right lower frame rail is buckled just aft of the crossmember forward attach bolt (see how the hole is distorted). That is very common on these frames. Unless there is damage aft of there which cannot be straightened, I would cut at the midpoint between the two crossmember bolts. But I think it is likely the crossmember is pushed to the left, meaning both frame rails are bent to the left. In any case this should be carefully measured and if they are, this MUST be straightened before the damaged parts are cut off, as I said previously. Get the car up in the air and take diagonal measurements from the aft crossmember bolt to some tooling holes or other features on the bottom of the frame rails further aft. Any sideways deformation may possibly be corrected by pushing diagonally with a Portapower from corner to corner in the engine bay (which you obviously cannot do once you cut off the front end). If you don't have a Portapower, or can't borrow one, I recommend you buy one or don't attempt this repair. You can buy a 4 ton Portapower set from Harbor Freight for about $120.
As for getting the experience, if you have someone align the frame rails and you do the cutting and welding of the new front end, you will still be doing 95% of the work.
Last edited by stilettoman; 12-25-07 at 01:35 AM.
12-26-07, 09:18 AM
#16
thats an impressive rebuild on that Alpine!! i can try a Portapower. my father has something similar. i believe its hydraulic. i will take some measurements as soon as i can and post them up for reccomendations. i will try and go with the measurement areas from the fsm. i really appreciate the advice. the lower frame rail doesnt look buckled to me, but i'm going to take your word for it and measure as you've done this typr of repair and i have not and dont know what to look for when making this type of repair.
12-26-07, 11:10 PM
#17
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Thanks Stiletto for clearing that up...
I just took what advice was given to me in this thread with any grain of salt.
(Never went to check on the validity of what people told me.
)
But yeah this is what I was told on the whole frame straightening thing;https://www.rx7club.com/1st-generation-specific-1979-1985-18/straightening-unibody-702864/
Thanks for the post though Stiletto, makes me wanna go see if I should just have the frame straightened professionally.
I just took what advice was given to me in this thread with any grain of salt.
(Never went to check on the validity of what people told me.
)But yeah this is what I was told on the whole frame straightening thing;https://www.rx7club.com/1st-generation-specific-1979-1985-18/straightening-unibody-702864/
Thanks for the post though Stiletto, makes me wanna go see if I should just have the frame straightened professionally.
12-27-07, 10:28 AM
#18
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thats an impressive rebuild on that Alpine!! i can try a Portapower. my father has something similar. i believe its hydraulic. i will take some measurements as soon as i can and post them up for reccomendations. i will try and go with the measurement areas from the fsm. i really appreciate the advice. the lower frame rail doesnt look buckled to me, but i'm going to take your word for it and measure as you've done this typr of repair and i have not and dont know what to look for when making this type of repair.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=47TJnad-sx8
thats us fixing the race car.... impact bent the rollcage, and tweaked the body all the way back to the rear hatch
we broke the 10,000lbs tow strap right after the vid ends, and thats AFTER we pie cut the frame rail, just to give you an idea of how much force it takes to bend this stuff
oh and dont use the 2 truck method, its not very smart
12-31-07, 10:20 AM
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ohhhhh yeah. here's the link for the post i made right after: https://www.rx7club.com/1st-generation-specific-1979-1985-18/couple-random-questions-dead-fb-698560/
but despite how it looks, everything under the hood is still fine with the exception that the stock air filter box is kinda bent... even the radiator is still intact!
but despite how it looks, everything under the hood is still fine with the exception that the stock air filter box is kinda bent... even the radiator is still intact!