V8kilr

i just started reading further into a site and the guy totally nocks the msd system,
just wandering what everyones thought on this is,

he says an msd doesnt have enough spark duration,
i though 20 degrees of crank revoulution was plenty

here is the link

more direct fire

mar3

iTrader: (8)

That would be the maniac "bloke" jeff20B...I'm going to try his idea but with a fresh twist. Instead of the magnetic trigger firing two little ignitors, they'll be firing two Accell 49320 300+ boxes with matching coils mounted horrendously close to the plugs!!

PEEJAY!!!...that's gotta be good for 15 HP all by itself, right?? For a grand total of 145HP at the flywheel with old oil, old plugs and a pathetic Nikki with a torn AP diaphragm...yes, sir.....yup....

REVHED

I wouldn't pay much attention to what he says about the MSD. It has been tried and proven to work where it counts... on the race track.

Another thing that ***** me is the fact the he proclaims this DLIDFIS as "his" idea. When in fact Sterling and I brought the idea up at Mazspeed and I was the first to try it.

V8kilr

what i dont get is if you did want to do it his way why wouldnt you just use the trailing setup from a 2nd gen sice it already has two independant coils and ignitors.,

it would be a whole lot cleaner and easier and probably more powerful,

plus you wouldnt need the heatsink.

personally i still think he is full of ****,

i couldnt imagine some one investing $300.00 + into an msd ignition setup just to rip it out and say it wasnt good enough.

like jeremy said
"for that money you make it work"

Sterling

Stop it! Just Stop It, mar3!!

Yeah, that's jeffy. Do a search on Mazspeed...lotz of info. I did it, and I took it out for a drive, and accidently buried my tach! It really works.
The whole MSD thing is explained fully on that site in the discussions. I think it was because it's designed for bangers...I really don't remember. The jury was still out I think. I think he was trying to say it got weaker with the high RPMs.
Jeff would'nt leave it alone, so I called him an *******. That's how we became friends. It's how I make most of my friends. (heh heh) But he had some points to make, and it just was'nt gonna ever get thru to someone who blew money on an MSD already; and that's who he was trying to convince.

Anyway, it costs nothing but another coil to do his PMDFDIS, and you can always switch it back.
...And "No.", mar3. That aint gonna do a damn thing for ya. Now change yer damn plugs and oil. We need "clean" dyno runs before n' after you fix up your carb!

peejay

You couldn't tear me away from my MSD setup. That's all I have to say

V8kilr

like me





it says one extra coil and one extra ignitor

Sterling

Yep. Forgot. And you should make aluminum brackets for everything, too.
Anyway, I never had an MSD to compare Jeffs set up to, but as compared to stock, it'll knock yer socks off. But ya know..."Results may vary." is always the case. Tune your carb up and put in fresh plugs, ect. It'll make a bigger difference. Just like the MSD, I imagine; If you slap on an MSD with a stock carb and exhaust, you'll be doing the engine real good, but you'll notice **** for improvement. Slap the MSD on a bored carbed, free exhaust car, and you'll really be able to feel the difference. Dig?

I would like to make the switch to the second gen ignition sometime.
We'll see. Just another thing on the list!

peejay

OK I'll say more.

I love the MSD not for any power gains it may or may not have. No, it rules because it makes cold starting, cold driveability, and low-RPM cruising TONS TONS TONS better. I never had problems with flooding out on cold days after going with the MSD.

V8kilr

well i will say with my msd system i have noticed excellent cold start capabilities,

also for the record i have no choke and i live in michigan so it gets really cold in the winter,

i also noticed a much smoother idle,
increase in gas milage,
it totally removed the stumble when i would peg the gas pedle when the engine is cold,
now if i peg it could it doesnt make that grrrdddrr noise

and for the record a ton more power above 3,000 rpm

yes thats right above not below,

once i hit 3,000 rpm the needle shoots to to redline,

when i hit 5,000 rpm if you blink i just hit redline and the buzzer is going off,

so to say that the system is not eficient above 3,000 rpm is pretty much bullshit.

anyone who has an msd system will tell you the gains above 3,000 rpm

thats where i noticed it the most.

honest to god,

ask jeremy how fast my car jumps from 5,000 to 8,000 rpm

Felix Wankel

Mine gave hardly **** for a gain in the upper RPMs. Did make it start better and idle smooth though.

Pretty much good for the **** factor of having the bright red MSD box and shiny coils underhood. (Too bad my coils are black).

V8kilr

by the way i hope all of you were running the msd wires with the msd setup,

if not then thats why you had the drop off in the upper rpm range,

the box will not work with solid core wires,

msd puts this everywhere on their site and in all their adds.


the box is very picky about the wires

jeremy

iTrader: (1)

i vouch for the go factor. spin, beep, shift, bark, whine beep, shift, whine, beep.......................

it scoots and with a partially crushed exhaust

etherhuffer

Just a thought as I have followed this for the past year. First, the setup Jeff has is legit, it works and outperforms a stock unit on the butt dyno. But I will throw this out: If you believe in science, you would get an oscilloscope and voltage meter and measure the output of the individual units. That would give you the readings to compare. Then dyno the car with both systems and compare. Everything else is conjecture. The reason people got po'd is that knocking an MSD does nothing to convince a user that your system is better. No science, no opinion from me.

peejay

MSD wires? No way, still using the crap Bosch parts-store wires. No high RPM power dropoff

V8kilr

your right this weekend i will do dyno runs on my dyno and compair,

we will even dyno jeremy's car,
hell come on by everyone free dyno day at my house,


oh thats right its broke so i will have to pay big bucks to use one thats 30 miles away

then sit in the parking lot switching the setups then pay alll over again for 2 more runs and compair

Felix Wankel

Uh, you usually get 2-3 runs on the dyno each time. Swapping it back stock takes all of 5 minutes. Whee.

V8kilr

he didnt say compair stock to msd,
he said compare msd to the other direct fire setup which requires three ignitors.

mar3

iTrader: (8)

If you actually do this, please, oh please, optimize your ignition tuning for each set-up. That way, once and for all, we'll know what the HP difference is between the two running at their best. Thank you! That is all...

etherhuffer

Well, test it or move on to the next topic! If you like to live in the world of opinion and shoot the breeze, then bring lots of Guiness stout and I will fill your heads with opinion all night, including a rant on how yellow spark plug wires give you 10 more HP! I think Jeff20b is a cool guy for thinking this up. But if you want to sell the idea as a better idea, test it. Is that not fair? Especially when theory often breaks down in practice for unforseen reasons. My guess is if Jeff painted the damn thing yellow and put "Super Volt" on the stock ignitor, half the people on the board would try to by a unit! hahahahahahahahahahahaa!

V8kilr

well jeff is the one that is saying his system is better,
not me.

he is the one going up against msd ,
not me.

i just dont understand how he can say "it is" instead of "it feels" especially since he is the one going up against all the people with msd systems,
chalanging the msd system,
not the other way around

etherhuffer

Agreed. Butt dynos don't count for much in my book.