nuredbaron

any help would be much appreciated. i have a 1985 gsl. The problem with the car is that will start fine sometimes after a couple of cranks on the starter and will then drive fine for a couple of miles or so. it will then start to die all by its self. like someone killed all the spark or cut the fuel. At this point two methods fix it but only for a couple more miles first is you push the clutch in and step on the gas all the way. sometimes this helps and the car gains its power back and you can continue on your way. if that doesn't work i slowly pop start it in which ever gear i'm in and it then refires the engine. either method works and the engine normally fires up after one or the other.

Things that i have changed:
fuel filter
fuel pump(the old wasn't working even when problem existed)
distributor rotor and cap
wires
plugs(got the good ngks)

i was thinking that it was maybe the accerator pump or the throttle sensor.

anyways any help will be appreciated greatly and if i can't figure it out in about a week i'm sending it to rob at pinnapple to fix or diagnose it for me i just thought i would try to do it my self. thanks

cdrad51

Well, next time it wants to die kil the ignition switch and pull to the side of the road. Look at the gas level in the float bowls and if they're empty, or even less than half full, there's your problem. Then it's either fuel pump (I don't know which one you put there), gas lines clogged, or the carb itself.

If not, it's something else, but in any case it sounds to me like a fuel delivery problem rather than an ignition one.

Kentetsu

Pull your leading plugs and take a look at them, let us know what they look like... Does the exhaust smell very rich?

drunkclever

might want to make sure all your connections are correct and that all your wires in the cap are going to the right plug. I mixed mine up once and car didn't run at idle.

Manntis

under what specific conditions does it start to die? I've had cars that otherwise run fine die on me when rolling to a stop due to a dirty EGR valve

cdrad51

.

trochoid

iTrader: (6)

I know I posted here the other day and now I don't see it.

Sounds to me like you have a fuel delivery issue. Check the fuel filter again. If it is dirty already, drain the tank and install a new filter. There is an intank filter on the end of the pickup tube that fails/splits, allowing the crap in the tank to be pulled up, blocking the fuel pickup tube and/or filter.

nuredbaron

when i pulled the plugs before i replaced them they had the normal look of having cheap gas. that light tan to brown look. they were also autolights. i replaced with ngk breqx 14 or something of that order. i double checked to make sure that the cap was on right and that the coil and plug wires were all in the right place everything checked out. the external in line fuel filter is still clear but what is odd when i checked the filter when the car was running the filter was full but when the car was off it seemed as if it was half full i even had my friend check and he agreed.

two things i forgot to mention earlier is that after a while the car at idle will just die if left idling. also when at idle if i mash the throttle the car hesitates and dies. it literally falls flat on its face. but if i roll smoothly on to the gas it runs normal.??

i haven't gotten a chance yet to drive her but i plan on doing that before the weekend and do as cdrad51 has suggested along with checking on the intank pick up filter that trochid suggested.

manntis the car seems to either die at idle or constant throttle driving. i haven't had a chance to see if it would die if it would die at stop and go type driving.

thank you cdrad51, kentetsu, drunkclever, manntis, trohoid for the replys all the help is appreciated. i really want to get her going good or at least know what is wrong before i start throwing more money at her.

frisbeedog

I did not see any mention of a bad ignitor. My leading went out two weeks ago and the car acted the same way you are describing. Good luck.

cdrad51

He said the car drives fine for a couple of miles. How did your car act the same way without leading ignition?

frisbeedog

It drove 2 miles home. Had to ride the gas the whole way and the damn thing would backfire every two minutes. When i got home there was no leading spark and everything else is new. Have not gone through all the troubleshooting yet, but that seems to be the most obvious at this time.

cdrad51

I know what no leading ignition feels like, believe me. No need to describe it. But the fact remains, that's far from driving fine for any number of miles. My point is that usually no leading ignition caused by a bad ignitor, is not intermitent. It happens and it stays that way until fixed. What Nuredbaron is experiencing seems to be intermitent, thus looks more like a fuel delivery issue.

nuredbaron

i plan on going for a drive sometime soon. but i was woundering that if i hook up my fuel pressure guage either right after the fuel pump or right before the carb couldn't i may be localize my search for a block or problem in the fuel system. about the ignitors just to check them out any advice or a thread to help me understand how to test them. i have a haynes manual but it talks about a 12 volt batery, a switch, and a test light and to hook it all up and then to turn the switch on and off rapidly. Is this correct?

ZeusFace

How well liked are you? because a pretty common prank in these parts is to stick a condom in the gas tank. It floats around then gets stuck against the feul pickup then when the car stops it floats away and will start again. it was rather annoying for me

trochoid

iTrader: (6)

LOL, that's cold. At least they didn't fill the condom with comet.

I had a fuel problem with a GSL when I first bought it. The po had replaced the filter and pump. Car started fine and idled near perfect. As soon as one touched the throttle, it died.

This was on an 85, so the tank and fuel pick up is slightly different than your's. What the eventual problem was, the pickup screen had split and rust from the tank plugged the pickup tube. Allowing just enough fuel for idle, but no more.

Since the S3 tanks have a removable pickup, return and vent assembly, I took it out and shot sand from the sandblaster down through the tube. Solved that part of the problem. I then went through several fuel filters and dropping the tank 3 times to clean it out.

There was a suggestion posted that one could use a guitar string, chucked in a drill and that was used to clean out the pickup tube. Iirc the 83 fuel hardlines are soldered to the tank, so use whatever you think may work best.

cdrad51

I wouldn't worry about the ignitors. If you have spark in the leading plugs, you have a good leading ignitor. If your tach works and your fuel pump works, which it obviously does, at least to some degree, you have a good trailing ignitor.

Manntis

precisely the symptoms my car exibited with a dirty EGR - except it'd also die when rolling to a stop.

nuredbaron

so here is what is going on now i let the car idle when i went to work on it after about 4 to 5 mins it died. so i checked the float windows on the front of the carb and it was practically empty.

ok so at that point obviusly something with a fuel issue. so i pullled off the fuel line at the carb nothing came out. ok maybe i have a block somewhere so i got under the car and pulled off the fuel line off the other side of the hard line and out came a whole bunch of fuel so when both ends were unhooked we blew low pressure air through the hard line out came a rush of fuel ok weird hooked the hard line back up but left of the line at the carb.

turned the ignition key to the on position ok should have fuel flowing nope ok so we turned the ignition key to the start the car was turning over and finally we r getting fuel in the required psi and gph. ok so it has something to do with power not begin transfered to the pump when in the on position.

my theory is that when the key is cranking the engine it is able to fill the bowl but when the key is in the run position it not powering the pump and thus the engine is only able to run on the fuel in the bowl. i have a friend with a 85 gs and when he bought his car and even to this day he has a togle switch for his fuel pump. so obviously his car has the same problem the po used a switch to solve his problem i would like to find the problem instead of jeryrigging the car any ideas?

i did find a fuel cut off relay on a schematic but i cant seem to find it could it cause the problem i have right now? thanks for the help guys

trochoid

iTrader: (6)

Does the pump run at all when the ignition switch is in the on position, before you start the engine? A couple of things together don't make sense. If the pump is not running in the on position, the engine could not idle for 4-5 minutes, there is not enough fuel in the lines or fuel bowls for that.

If the pump is running in the on position, I suspect your problem is in the carb. There is a filter screen aorund the banjo bolt where the fuel lines come into the carb. Another possibility is the needle and seat for the floats are sticking. did the rear fuel bowl show empty like the front one did?

cdrad51

Told ya. Fuel delivery.

So for an '85, with the key in the "on" position, the fuel pump will work only for a few seconds and then, if there is no ignition - especifically if there is no trailing ignition, the fuel pump relay will shut the fuel pump down. A mechanism to help prevent flooding I guess. At any rate, you might want to look into the trailing ignitor but first let me ask you, is your tachometer working?

Independently of the trailing ignition (and even though I recommend you make sure it is working properly) if you choose to get rid of the relay and install a switch like many do, do a search for "fuel pump relay trick" and you'll find the thread that explains where to find the relay and how to bypass it. From there it is pretty obvious how to install a switch instead.

nuredbaron

when the switch is in the on position i dont hear it click or buzz or anything it seems to only work when the key is cranking the engine. when i checked the voltage at the pump with the key at the on position it onle had .28 volts any idea what it should have. the banjo bolt is it the bolt that goes through where the fuel lines go into the carb? rob at pinnaple also suggersted checking it. i just couldn't understand where it was. so trochoid u don't think it has anything to do with the pump not working?

trochoid

iTrader: (6)

Yes, the banjo bolt is on the top of the carb. I'm not that up on the relay, but .28 volts won't do any good at all. If the relay is kicking off the voltage to the pump as cdrad51 says, then the voltage test needs to be done the instant the key is turned on.

If you are getting full voltage when the key is turned to the on position, then it's dropping out, it is an electrical issue.

nuredbaron

my tach is working fine once she gets warmed up a bit there is a little gallop in the rpms but not more than 50 rpms. i was going to check for the voltage when the engine is cranking but i got busy helping my friend change a tranny that is the next thing i do to diagnose the problem. thanks trochoid and cdrad51. i'll check for that trick.

cdrad51

Well yeah that's what should normally happen. The test would be if the voltage is dropping while the engine is on, then there's a problem.

To do a proper gph and psi test, the relay needs to be bypassed so the pump can be tested and yet the engine doesn't need to be running. I hope I'm making sense.

trochoid

iTrader: (6)

If the flow test fails with the pump drawing fuel from the tank, disconnect the in line to the pump, add a length of hose and drop it into a gas can. If the pump passes this test, the pre-pump lines are restricted.

That will save you buying a new pump, only to find out the old one was good. Don't ask how I learned this trick.