82streetracer

iTrader: (1)

Okay, Ive been reading through a lot of the old threads on rear suspension setups, and my options for upgrading.

my car, although rediculously powerfull for its size, is not a drag car, its a track car.

300 hp and the stock watts linkage doesnt sound like a good idea. it sounds like a whole lot of oversteer

sooooo.... heres what I see as my options

1. switch to a 3 link and panhard bar. I do not know how a panhard bar affects the weight transfer and how it will act with 300+ horses going through it.

2. keep the watts and 4 link setup, but change all the bushings to adjustable helm joints or whatever there called.
I work at a shop that does a lot of work with a hick racer shop (circle track stuff) and have access to discounts on this kind of stuff,

sooo... the question is, which one should I go with??

680RWHP12A

well i would say #2......
the adjustable links are the way to go, 4 link is the best suspension all around... not too sure about the watts link for track use, i read it binds up so a panhard bar might work better for you...

85rotarypower

I would suggest the stock 4 link with the panhard bar to replace the watts link.

DriveFast7

iTrader: (1)

my bridgeport has 245 at the fly, car weighs mabye 2150, dot r's on front, 10" slicks on rear, tri link and panhard rod. handles like a dream. none of the rear suspension brackets are cracking.

as far as weight transfer i don't honestly pay attention to that but can say i can adjust the pinion angle and upper tri link angle at will to do what i want it to. the car certainly scoots when i floor it.

overall a well designed watts link will handle better than any panhard rod. unfortunately the watts that mazda made was done all wrong and it's gonna cost you Several Hundred Dollars to have a custom correctly made watts link fabricated and installed.

g force engineering makes a great panhard that is simple weld in and well designed that should meet your needs. i must say when i switched from watts to panhard rod (ground control one) the car noticeably handled better and had less oversteer. i could get on the gas earlier when exiting a corner, which means faster lap times.

S2-13BT

I'd go the Panhard... In fact I will be going Panhard eventually, and my power level will be similar eventually!

At the moment it's about 220rwhp, and is used for track days. Oversteer is not a problem, even using Falken Azenis R semi-slicks. The car is lowered (a fair bit, which probably doesn't help in terms of roll centers and all that jazz). The panhard will help a lot in this respect as I understand it.

DriveFast7

iTrader: (1)

if a stock rear suspension geometry 1st gen is not oversteering.....you're not driving it fast enough!

Rx7carl

DEFINATELY 1. Get Jims book dammit! All this $ you spent on building a serious track monster and your too cheap to buy it? Cmon man, get with it. 3 link (the four link will be nothing but trouble, totally sucky geometry [technical term]) and a track bar. If you bought his book youd see it was a no brainer. Doesnt matter how much hp you got. The track bar controls lateral loads, nothing actually goes thru it.

31rx7

I am with RX7Carl. Buy Jim's book.

Going to Heim joints will make handling worse as the rear suspension will bind sooner in its travel.

Go to the Tri Link and Panhard.

RotaryRevn

Um, where can one purchase this book?

Jon_Valjean

I think it really depends how much you're going to abuse it. For track use, and even up to 400hp the stock system (perhaps with Rx7carl's nifty nyloc conversion) will still perform admirably. If in doubt, reinforce the hanger brackets?

Of course, if you can go panhard at minimal cost and you don't mind the extra noise, and don't intend it to be driven on the road (legalities applying in whatever state you're from) then sure, give that a shot.

Rx7carl

www.gforceengineering.net Revn

elwood

iTrader: (1)

If you don't believe Carl, go ahead and try working with the stock geometry, then when the Neons and Miatas that have a fraction of the HP run around you on the carousels, you'll be calling Jim Susko anyway. I know -- it happened to me.

Rx7carl

Embassasing to get by a girlie Miata aint it?

82streetracer

iTrader: (1)

GOOD GOD $75 FOR A BOOK.

I dont think so,

I would really like to have that book, and I would gladly pay like $35, but $75 is way too much.

elwood

iTrader: (1)

Man, you don't know the half of it -- I'd have rather been violated in jail by a cellmate named Bruno. Not only do I work with this guy, but he thinks he's God's gift to drivers on top of it all. He is good, but not better than me

Rx7carl

If it makes you feel better, part of what your getting is lifetime phone support from Jim. You can call him from the garage or the track and ask for advice. Lets see, whats an engineer go for these day by the hour? And one who is a 1st gen suspension specialist and genius and whiz? Re think your priorities my man.

Rx7carl

LOL, I had 3 of dem bastards gang up and draft by me one time at a track day. *******!

Sorry, meant to quote you, but I hit edit by accident. Damn moderator power.

RotaryRevn

Thanks for the info Carl! I've heard Jim's name thrown around quite a bit but now I finally know how to get a hold of him!

82streetracer

iTrader: (1)

yeh, I forgot that he does that, doesnt seam that bad.

Ill probably just get the panhard bar and trilink, and then when I get really hardcore with racing Ill get the book and start to really get into suspension tuning

RotaryRevn

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