BigPimpin'

iTrader: (5)

I want to get my A/C up and running. I have RB intake setup and everything removed. What do I need to do to get it working? I'm gonna charge it up tomorrow, should it just kick in when I press the a/c bitton and turn the fan on? I know withe rats nest installed a solenoid kicked the idle up. Will that be a factor on whether it will work or not? Does anybody tunning a holley have A/C? Thanks!

jays83gsl

You should have kept the little white solenoid from the nest removal, that is your AC solenoid.

Be SURE to charge it with R12 or FREEZE 12. If you charge it with 134A, you will DESTROY YOUR ENTIRE SYSTEM!

Stevan

iTrader: (17)

If your system still has pressure in it, charge it with the same refrigerant.
If you are changeing refrigerant(do more research), or your system has been opened, you need to at least pull a vacuum, and charge into the vacuum.

Freeze 12 is 80% 134a.

http://www.epa.gov/ozone/snap/refrig.../refblend.html

jays83gsl

Yes, but Freeze 12 is a direct drop in for R12.

The vacuum, I figured would be common sense, lol. Guess not

BigPimpin'

iTrader: (5)

Thanks guys! I still have the rats nest so I'll look for the white solenoid and reconnect it.

Stevan

iTrader: (17)

[QUOTE=jays83gsl
The vacuum, I figured would be common sense, lol. Guess not [/QUOTE]

Well, I didn't want to assume, guess everyone has a vacuum pump now.

BigPimpin, you will need the throttle bumper from the carb also, thats what the solenoid controls.

I guess the freeze-12 aint so bad, I've never tried it, just didn't like it because it's a blend.
Heres an interesting read on it.

http://www.autoacforum.com/messagevi...threadid=13315

mckinneyml

FYI For those thinking of converting to R134a you may want to wait. Europe is going to ban the 134a refrigerant and U.S. could follow. So we are going to go through this all over again. Systems using CO2 are likely to be the successor.

Keith13b

iTrader: (6)

I'm running Dellorto and have A/C. I just pull the choke (fuel enrichener in my case) out a hair to pop up the idle. Runs fine. My A/C switch has a bad contact somewhere and sometimes causes the compressor to kick off. Annoying. I just need to clean all the contacts (just don't have the rime, damnit). Hard wiring a new switch is another option too if the compressor works but the A/C doesn't kick it on due to no 12 V trigger.

Keith

jays83gsl

McKinnyml, I hadn't heard of this yet. Could you give me a link to this information?

I've NEVER advised changing a system over to 134, as it's too costly for LESS cooling power.
This could be bad for people like me who are in the A/C business

mckinneyml

I heard that R134a was going to be replaced from Teagarden Auto Air in Phoenix, AZ. I heard about the CO2 from a Google Groups search. I will look for further information in the mean time here is some information that I have found so far.


"A European regulation is currently in the stages of finalisation that will lead to a ban on the use of HFC R134a in 2011 model passenger cars sold in Europe. The introduction of the R744 system will enable car manufacturers to comply with this regulation for air conditioning systems. " http://www.ae-plus.com/Key%20topics/...iors-news2.htm

Here is something that may have more information but you have to pay to download: "Life Cycle Analysis Framework: A Comparison of HFC-134a, HFC-134a Enhanced, HFC-152a, R744, R744 Enhanced, and R290 Automotive Refrigerant Systems" http://www.sae.org/servlets/productD...D=2005-01-1511

Here is something else that I found:
"There is a worldwide shortage of R134a, the non-flammable refrigerant used in almost all original equipment automotive A/C systems. The shortage is caused by limited production and increasing world demand, as countries such as India switch from R12. That switch was made in the U.S. and most other countries from 1991 to 1995. R134a prices have risen from as little as $80 for a 30-lb tank to up to $300 and more. Small cans, containing 12 oz, have more than doubled or tripled in price. Small cans of flammable refrigerant, typically propane, are often not labeled as such, explained ICCC Chair Ward Atkinson, adding that motorists with leaking systems who install the product create danger for themselves, passengers, and unknowing technicians to whom they eventually may go for service." http://www.sae.org/congress/2005/thuextra.htm

mckinneyml

I'm looking for more info on the exact date.

May 30, 2004,
"Looks like our friends at the Fed Gov and Dupont are at it again. The Kyoto
Protocol has set a tentative date 8 years from now to ban production of
R134a refrigerants at "member" countries (does not include China and most of
Asia, Mexico/South America and the Middle East/Africa).
That means our current vehicles that use R134a will see refrigerant prices
jump from $5/lb (typical retail) to over $25/lb and be removed from retail
availability directly to the consumer as R12 is now. Typical repair shop
price for R12 is now over $55/lb and $18/lb for R134a."
http://www.aircondition.com/wwwboard/2003Q1/3685.html

LongDuck

I converted my 84SE from R12 to R134a last summer and didn't notice decreased capacity for cooling - in fact, it now works much better than it ever did before since I bypassed my heater core (was allowing slight flow from the radiator), and having professional window tint installed.

For the $60 cost in parts to have the nozzle caps switched over, and then the reduced cost for charging of the R134a, I saved over $200 from the first charge up - and this savings will continue to grow over time as R12 gets more and more expensive.

Based on those articles that you posted from Europe, the 2011 date for R134a phase-out is really far out there and we've got some time.

I'd recommend switching over to R134a - it will ALWAYS be easier to find and cheaper to use than R12 going forward,

mckinneyml

Newsletter, 14. December 2004,
"CO2 filling of air conditioning systems

The ban on the refrigerant R134a which is currently used in automobile AC systems is decided, the substitution by the ecologically neutral carbon dioxide is being prepared. The specific characteristics of CO2 not only make other demands on the AC system, e. g. because of the necessary higher pressures, but also on the equipment filling these AC systems. Dürr Somac therefore developed a filling equipment which meets these requirements.

When filling CO2 within the assembly line some new aspects emerge which make this filling process different from the one for R134a and must be considered:

thermic stabilisation of the filling process to reach the desired filling accuracy
higher filling pressure (approximately 60 to 70 bars) and industrial safety measures resulting from this, e. g. protection covers, body protection, gas sensors in the working zone
Thus we are very well prepared to support our customers with the changeover to the new, ecologically friendlier AC systems. "
http://www.durr.com/e/auto/newsletter.htm

mckinneyml

My understanding from Teagarden was that it won't be very long before the new systems are available and from the other articles that I have quoted, from the Society of Automotive Engineers who more than 84,000 members - engineers, business executives, educators, and students from more than 97 countries - who share information and exchange ideas for advancing the engineering of mobility systems, there is a world wide shortage of R134a and the prices are going up. Repeat of R12.

My personal opinion is if you have already converted to R134a stock up. If not hold out a little longer and get in on the next trend. Besides CO2 would be very environmentally friendly. Just my 2 cents. A previous owner gutted out the AC on my SA and I have accomulated the parts to put it back but I'm waiting for the next wave.

cosmicbang

Your experience is unique because you have a smaller cabin area, tinting, and no rear hatch glass.

I owned an RX-7 that had been converted to R-134a and the cooling performance was much worse--completely unacceptable. I actually converted it BACK to R-12. I would not recommend switching to HFC-134a unless the entire system (including evaporator and compressor) was retrofitted to one proplerly sized and designed for R-134a.

The regulations are politically driven, but why let facts get in the way?

Check this out:

http://members.***.net/jamesmcalmpub...NCGG4-2005.pdf

Stevan

iTrader: (17)

I don't think we will be using co2 in our cars, the pressures would be too high.
The change to co2 would be for new cars, with a system designed for it.
From what I've been reading, 152a may be chosen to retrofit r12, and 134a vehicles.
I'm keeping my 7 r12, but my pu is 134a, and cools well, but I think I'll try the freeze12 to see if gets colder/faster.

Keith13b, your compressor clutch is supposed to cycle on/off to keep the evaporator coil from freezeing.

Keith13b

iTrader: (6)

Its been cycled off for a week now! The Florida heat is killing me. I know it cycles, but I have a bad contact somewhere. The compressor works fine when you hit it with 12V. The dash swith works (swithces to a closed circuit). But somewhere the trigger leaves the switch and never makes it out of the fire wall to the compressor.

My car has been sitting for a while. The brake lights stopped working. After over an hour of electrical tracking, I found an oxidized contact on my brake switch off the pedal. Annoying. My radio fader had the same problem as well as my pass. window regulator. All fixed w/ a little emory paper and as few colorful words. So I'm hopoing the A/C shares the same fate.

The a/c will not work but will randomly kick in for a few seconds because the trigger is ~4v and should be 12v.

Stevan

iTrader: (17)

There's the thermostatic switch on the evap coil houseing, might be there.
Sounds like you've got a handle on the troubleshooting, sorry if I'm stateing the obvious.
Good luck.

And yeah, I hear ya about the heat, I'm not a morning person so I mowed my lawn around noon, with a pushmower. Had to beat the afternoon thundershowers, I looked like that guy in airplane when he was landing the jet.

Keith13b

iTrader: (6)

Sweet-

Great tip, thanks. I forgot to check there.