IronMonkeyL255

Just as the title states, is anyone here successfully running a 13B-REW motor in their FB?

I read through the entire sticky, and learned MANY things, but almost all of them were pertaining to putting a TII engine in. After doing a bit more research, it looks like the main problem will be the motor mounts. On all the generations of motor, they are in different positions. To use the TII motor in an FB, you really just need to use the front cover from a GSL-SE, but for a REW they mounted the crank sensor in the cover.

Is there a way to modify the stock REW front cover to mimic the GSL-SE cover? Possibly drill a few holes and add studs for the mount to attach to? It looks like it will be FAR more work to modify a GSL-SE cover to accomodate all the various parts from the REW, but that's just going off of all the pics I can get my hands on.


The reason I'm asking is because my roommate and I are getting an '83 RX-7 (not sure of the exact trim, but it is a higher end one) for free (the 12A has a cracked rotor housing, but the car was running great intil then). We are using it as our play toy, and were initially going to throw a Chevy small block into it until we found a JDM 13BTT (assuming it's a 13B-REW until we see it) for really(!) cheap. I would prefer to stick with a rotary if at all possible, and since all the wiring harness and ECU and whatnot is there we were going to use that for now (it should still be more than enough HP for some fun). We haven't even gone to pick up the car yet, so I am taking my time to do as much research as possible.

I'm mainly a Subaru guy and my roommate's mainly a Corvette guy, but we have both been wanting to play around with a rotary engine.

steve84GS TII

Its been done,although its a rare site and one running on the stock ECU and turbos is rarer still.

The mounting and oilpan are biggest issue,although it can be overcome with money and fab skills.Wiring is probably similar to the TII except more complicated since its a far more complex engine.
Personally I like the 13B-REW, its an awesome engine with lots of lowend and cool factor.But for a basic,lightweight car like the 1st gen, the TII is a better choice for budget,simplicity and power delivery.Youll be pretty much on your own with an FD engine,wheras the TII has been covered to death in almost every aspect,both S4 and S5.

z-beater

Yes it can be done.

I prefer to use the 1st gen motor mount setup. Be sure to get banzai's motor mount setup, better suspension, brakes and driveline. You are looking at 10k to do it right.

Tobias

iTrader: (1)

And 10k is a lot of money!

yetterben

i love my fb.....but....for that kinda money i would like the 3rd gen more

Jeff20B

iTrader: (13)

It's no picnic to use the stock oil pan and motor mounts from an FD in an FB.











The project never materialized so we pulled it out and it went into an FD.

It's just as well. We decided to do a 4 rotor instead and leave the FD rear motor mount support in for strength.











The real engine will be built soon. I bet you can't wait for that.

IronMonkeyL255

How did you mount the REW using the 1G mount setup? Custom subframe? Got any pics of your setup?

I was already planning on poly motor mounts, and suspension was in the plans as well. Specifically, I was thinking maybe the stage 1 Mazdaspeed setup if it's still available. Definitely going to be doing all poly bushings. What would you recommend suspension-wise? We plan to track this, so it's not just for going fast in a straight line.

We are probably going to stick with the REW just because we have such a good start with cheap stuff. Besides, it will still be a pretty good bit of power for such a light car (I am used to Subarus which hover around 3000 lbs and the light ones are at least around 2500-2600)


Later I hope to find a S5 turbo to build the snot out of, but I can't seem to find any decent ones around here.

IronMonkeyL255

I saw your other thread documenting the 4-rotor build. You remind me of another crazy person I know

So you retrofitted the FD subframe into the FB and used the stock FD mounts? Would the steering linkages interfere any? Were there already mounting points available, or did you have to weld in plates/nuts to attach the crossmember to?

Jeff20B

iTrader: (13)

I didn't build the FD mount. A local rotary shop did. They tied it into the steering components. As I recall, the idler arm mounting holes were used on the passenger side.

IronMonkeyL255

Got any pics from underneath?

z-beater

If you use the FB front cover it will bolt right up. There will be one hole that will not match up. You will need to add a location for the stock twin oil drain since it is on the front cover and with this swap you are removing it. Your oil pan will also have the same problem. All the bolt holes will not match up. Stock turbos will fit in the engine bay. Use a T2 tranny with shortened shifter housing and a T2 slave, make a custom tranny mount(make sure that your angles are correct), Get a custom driveshaft made, Don't mess with the stock ecu, just throw a PFC in there. You will be maxing it out with a FMIC, and exhaust(or so they say). Custom oil lines, spark plugs, stock T2 coils, FD map sensor, modified throttle pedal. The list goes on and on.

Best picture of the motor mounts that I have.

IronMonkeyL255

What are you doing about the crank sensor?

Even if you don't use the stock ECU, you still need a crank reference signal......

Any suggestion for the oil cooler? I'm not sure if the motor I'm getting will have one or not, and the factory pieces are quite expensive. Are there any aftermarket ones worth using?

Slammed_GSL

iTrader: (14)

Z, you and I have got to get together sometime.
I'm in Carnation, Wa.

IronMonkeyL255

What if I went with an ReSpeed rack and pinion conversion kit. Would that make things fit any better?

Jeff20B

iTrader: (13)

IronMonkeyL255, if I had to install an FD engine in an FB, I would grab a 12A front cover and a GSL-SE oil pan. I'd use 12A because the OMP has only two oil outputs, and the FD engine only has two oil injectors. I would probably trash the stock ECU and use a standalone. Therefor no need to worry about limp mode when not using the stock electrically actuated OMP. Or I'd avoid the whole mess and run premix.

z-beater

Billy should really comment on this. But IIRC correctly the ReSpeed unit does not change the motor mount locations. That being said there will be no advantage motor mount wise to getting his kit. That being said: I am very impressed with his work, and it is a great modification for a car that is going to see a lot of track time. Everyone that I have talked to about his kit loves it.

You will need a 2nd gen CAS. It will drop into the stock location on the 13b cover. Not 100% sure on the 12A cover.

If you have the FMOC that is more than adequate. Spend the money and get the AN fittings for the lines. Banjo fittings are less than optimal. I think that the total cost was somewhere around $70.

Great input on the front cover Jeff. 12a's are more abundant. My car is a GSL-SE so I used that.

If you run a stock ECU you will still need to have a OMP. The ECU needs to see a signal. As Jeff mentioned when the ECU does not see the OMP it goes into limp mode. Steve knows a lot more about the OMP's than myself. A standalone was required for my build so I just did not even bother with messing with the OMP.

Jeff20B

iTrader: (13)

A 2nd gen CAS will bolt right into a 12A front cover. I stuck one on the 20B.

I'll have to run premix or figure out some way to turn two OMP lines into three equally flowing lines.

dayton

i think there is some info. in the archives about what to do with the stock ecu... i read it somewhere before... do a search it is out there somewhere.. i looked into this a couple of years ago and changed my mind about stock vs standalone.. do yourselves a favor go standalone! g/l

IronMonkeyL255

I am half tempted to wire in my Autronic I got for my Subaru.

IronMonkeyL255

Would I be able to leave the stock FD OMP hooked up electrically, but not metering anything?

Would the FC CAS still send the same signal to the ECU?

steve84GS TII

12A front cover,CAS,standalone,big single turbo.........its really no longer a 13B-REW anymore.The quick spooling twins,crank fired ignition and factory speed density EFI are what makes it an REW.

Sure,if you get rid of all the obstacles it will make the install easier,but youll be losing the essence of the engine......Its like guys that drop in the 2nd gen 13B,then slap a carb on it!

IronMonkeyL255

So..... Will the ECU accept the signal from the FC CAS?

I looked through the FSMs, but they only have service procedures and not sensor definitions (so I could compare the signals and where in the revolution each sensor send the signal).



Also, I have a new goal. I am going to try to do this on the cheap at first to try to compete in the GRM $2008 challenge. After the challenge, though, the car will be seeing MUCH more upgrades.

diabolical1

iTrader: (3)

use a standalone - the Autronic that you mentioned. contact Enzo on this board.

IronMonkeyL255

Just got the car this morning.

It's a 1983 GSL (though the date code of the VIN indicates it's an 84. I still have yet to see it.... ). My roommate got finished tearing out most of the interior. The carpet and padding and whatnot was trashed and not worth keeping. Besides, we aren't really going to need an interior anyway.

slayerx7

iTrader: (4)

Damn both you guys also live close right on!

I have the same project going on, this is a good thread for sure.
I already have my complete REW motor (minus intercooler piping) and just bought like 4/5ths of another REW.

I am planning on ordering the BNR stage3 Twins, and a haltech e8 for my fb, what are your thoughts on this?
Im very relieved to hear the the 12A front cover will bolt on, as Ill be putting in a fresh rebuild.

Is the main issue with the REW drain pan that it conflicts with the steering linkage? If I ordered the rack&pinion kit, could I retain the REW oil pan? A bold (expensive) move for sure, but I hear the feel of the steering is incredible.

Just out of curiosity, did one of you call me in regards to a gsl rear end you have for sale? If so, my last final is on Tuesday Ill be happy to come look after then. If not then I guess I sound like a fool