I always hear that you need to spend the $ for the accuracy of a wideband a/f ratio guage. What is it that makes them so wonderful? Could one not just use a plain old narrow band guage that you can buy from the local speed shop to help you tune up the carb? I know that rotary exhaust heat is an issue, but what are the reasons that it is worth it to spend the extra $ for a wideband?

 

The narrow band tells you wether its too rich, or too lean.

The wideband tells you by how much.

Ask anybody with a wideband on here, and they'll tell you its one of the best investments they've ever made for tuning their car.

 

Oh really? And in real time too? Thats really cool. But a narrowband could still be helpful in tuning and jetting a carb, right? Or is it a waste of $? Anyone use one here?

 

Is the www.rx7.com O2 sensor a wideband? I want their gauge, but I wasn't sure about the O2 sensor.

 

A good wideband will log your A/F at a high sampling rate and can be downloaded to your computer for analysis. With the LM-1 you can add up to 5 other inputs, in real time, to compare your A/F to such things as rpm, iac, temp, and tps, etc.

While they seem pricey on initial investment, you can tune for max power. or fuel milage. Just tuning for better fuel milage could pay for itself within a year, at todays gas prices.

It will also show if you have any lean spikes, critical on boosted engines, that a narrow band may not even register. Easily offsets the price of a rebuild and can save many hours of dyno time to get your engine dialed in.

 

But is really getting a LM-1 really neccessary for a N/A engine. I can totally understand for getting one with a boosted setup to prevent leaning out the engine. But in all honesty wouldn't a LC-1 be sufficient? And on that note what other things does the LM-1 offer that the LC-1 doesn't... The more I think about it the more I think I should just go for the LC-1 with my N/A carb setup..

 

Honestly, I am not that familiar with the different models in the Innovative line. Mine is a borrowed LM-1 for tuning the Mikuni on the bp. I really need the rpm add-on to match my A/F's with the rpms to see where the A/Fs are running, before I start changing jets.

Once tuned, I would like to have the on board A/F gauge, just not in the budget at the moment. And yes, if you want to tune a modded Nikki or aftermarket carb on an NA, a wideband will make it quicker, simpler and more exact than change the jets and go test drive, come back and try a different set.

 

Look at it this way.....
If you select larger main jets,then install them,you already KNOW your going to be richening the mixture.The narrow band A/F gauge will tell you your richer than before too,but not how much richer.Say its now 2 lights or hash marks higher than before...OK now what percentage does each light or hash indicate!?it doesnt say!If you dont know how much richer you made it,how do you know if it was too much or not enough?
The butt-dyno and sparkplug reading will tell you more about ACTUAL air fuel ratio than a narrow band.The only thing a narrow band will tell you precisely is when you are at stoich.

 

one reason its so much more accurate is a wideband reads from 0v-5v a narrow band reads from 0v-1v thats a big difference

 

thanks for the info guys. Anyone have trouble burning up an o2 sensor with our extreme rotary heat? Any ways to prevent this?

 

it should be just fine. the gsl-se sensor mounts less than 1 foot away from the manifold

 

Nope,not yet.My downpipe glows pretty bright and my O2 sensor looked/works just fine after 30K miles. Just a regular old universal Bosch or Denso should work fine,thats what I run.

 

The sensors themselves use different elements, the single wire type tolerates higher heat ranges, from what I understand. Because of their accuracy, widebands becomes more sensitive to high heat. They also need recalibration every so often as well, for optimum results.
Innovate recommends using a heatsink for the wideband o2 sensor with rotaries. It will give inaccurate readings if the sensor goes outside its operating range, it's up to the controller to determine if it's reading inaccurately. The LC-1 and LM-1 both give errors if it does go out of it's range, though.
$200 for a good wideband setup like the LC-1 is a really good deal, I think.
Innovate has some really good videos on their site about their products and tuning with EFI. They are worth a watch.