lazlong

Hi Guys,

New guy here. I got my hands on an 84 GSL, 12a, a few weeks ago. What a great ride! It runs and drives well, but it's not without its issues.

I've noticed that on the extremely hot days the car seems to run smoother. Especially the idle. It also 'surges' less when coasting. My tach also seems to only work on those occasions.

When it's cooler out, I get no tach, surging while coasting, and my charging system goes a bit flaky. Driving home the other night, I had my high beams on, the casette player blaring the fan blowing air (no a/c) and when I went to roll my windows up/down, my voltmeter dropped to 11v. This doesn't happen when it's hot out.

I've done lots of reading here and came across the Lesabre Alt upgrade. Since I figure my problem is either my alt or my battery, I figured I'd start with the alt. $35 for one at the wrecker's. Can't go wrong.

Now for the oops! My stock alt does not have a fan behind the pulley like the lesabre one. No problem. Just re-use the old one. Second problem: The stock alt has a 1/2" shaft. Lesabre has a 5/8" shaft. This wasn't mentioned in the how-to.

I plan on going to the wrecker's tomorrow to pick up a pully that will fit, but as I tried test fitting the alt, it looks like I may have to grind 1/4" or more off the ear. The grind job in the pics of the how-to did not look that drastic.

Did I miss something? Pretty sure I have the right alt. Maybe I have the wrong car? Should I back away from this upgrade? I'd like to be able to put in an amp and upgrade the radio. So I figured why not boost the alt now.

Has anyone else run into this (or other) problems? Any thoughts are appreciated.

Thanks!

jfachner72

I did this swap a few years ago.

Try searching for "CS130" I think that is what it is called.

I reused the old pulley, I just opened up the hole 1/8 th of an inch

Rx-7Doctor

iTrader: (13)

Before you go off and spend money on something you may not need. Check your battery cables. Especially the grounds. More issues are caused by corroded cables than anything else. :-)

Also make sure the posts and cables are clean at the battery and that the belt is tight!

KansasCityREPU

iTrader: (9)

I'm not sure about up north, but down south here almost any auto parts store will check an alternator for free. If your after more output amps that's one thing, but it will save money if you start at the cables like Doc suggest then start testing parts next.

lazlong

Ok that makes me feel a bit better. I thought about just opening up the hole, but I'd prefer to keep the original intact in case this turns out to be a horrendous mistake. I figure for a couple bucks I can pick up what I need.

Thanks for the search tip. Didn't think of looking for 'cs130'. Got a few more good ideas!

lazlong

I'll double check all my grounds. I know the one off the battery is good.

Cables, unless hidden under the sheathing are in good shape. I replaced the negative terminal clamp last week and had a look at the wire. No corrosion. The car was never winter driven and there is no rust anywhere. Doesn't exclude it, but should be less likely.

I don't know if any shops around here test alts for free. Never heard of it to be honest. I'll check. A little extra juice would be nice for a stereo, but to be honest the current Alt would probably be fine. I just decided to upgrade because it *is* the original alt. I'd rather not throw a whole whack of cash at the car yet. $40, easy fix. Worst case, go back to the original.

Right now the battery isn't charging up, or not holding a full charge. Once I put the new alt in we'll see if battery performance improves. If not, I'll spend the money I save on the alt for a new battery.

As an aside, this is a great forum. I look forward to contributing where I can.

Thanks!

Rx-7Doctor

iTrader: (13)

It sounds like you need to have your battery tested also. If you have a failing battery with a weak cell it will not matter if you put in a brand new alternator, it still will not take a charge.

Do you have any Napa Auto parts stores there? They test alternators, batteries, and starters for free.

So does Auto zone and CSK/O'reilly stores and just about most Auto parts stores.

As far as replacing just the Terminal end that is just a emergency fix. You need to replace the whole cable. Corrosion gets inside the cable where you cannot see it and there is a voltage drop test that is performed to determine if you have cable issues.

Also the negative cable has 2 connecting points. Right below the driver side strut tower (it is famous for corroding there)and the factory mounting point which is usually at the back side of the long starter bolt.

My advice for maintenance purposes it to replace both cables with larger cables such as a 1/0 or 2 gauge for the negative and a 4 gauge cable for the positive. Makes a world of difference.

lazlong

Well after lots of grinding and pulley hunting, the alt is installed. The car is back together.

Turn the key, and the only lights on the dash that come on are Brake and seat belt. The whole dash use to light up. Does anyone know if this is a normal side effect of the swap? Or did I connect the wrong wire to the new alt? I haven't tried to start her yet. (It's a bit late here), but I figured I'd ask for opinions before I do.

Thanks!

lazlong

In response to my last reply, I went out this morning and tried it again. Everything lit up. I'm guessing the plug was probably loose. She started right up and everything is as it should be.

My volt meter needle still moves around like it did before, and nothing seems to work any better/stronger. But everything works.

One curiosity though; My choke didn't automatically pop off when the car got up to temp. It was well in the range where it normally does, but perhaps I didn't wait long enough. Once I restarted the car (still warm) the choke wouldn't engage (it shouldn't) so at least that part is working. I'll have to keep an eye on that. Looking at the wiring diagrams it looks like the alt wires run through the choke relay, so maybe using only one wire from the old harness effects how the choke works?

The new alt makes a slightly higher pitched whine sound too. Here's to hoping my belt is tensioned properly and aligned well enough that it doesn't explode on me.

Time to go for a drive!

Jeezus

iTrader: (4)

Needle still bounces because of bad grounds. I ran a relay to power my fuel pump
and redid my battery grounds. I can feel more power going where it needs to go,
and fuel pump is quieter. Stopped the cycling when the turn signal was on too.

KansasCityREPU

iTrader: (9)

^ Bad ground is the correct answer. Buy a new ground cable at the very least. It cost under $10. If it does not have two grounding points add a smaller one that connects to the shock tower like Doc pointed out.

jfachner72

I read somewhere that you should ground the block...

I ran a ground from the Chassis to a stud on the Block with some nice meaty copper terminals.....

It stopped my dim idle and blinker drops........

DivinDriver

iTrader: (15)

Temperature sensitivity is a common symptom of a failing battery. Being chemical, their output is affected by temperature. Hotter temps = more vigorous chemical reaction = more available output.

Bad grounds can act the same way, since the metal expands and contracts with temperature. Hotter temps = expansion of metal = slightly tighter fitment.

Most parts stores will test your battery for you for free, in hopes of being able to sell you a new one.

lazlong

Thanks for all the suggestions. I'll double check all my grounds just to eliminate that as a possibility. Currently testing the ground from the negative terminal to the body produces a nice strong beep from my multimeter.

Near as I can tell the 12a chassis has 5 ground circuit points. Right and left side of the engine compartment. One under dash (inaccessible?), one behind the center console and one at the hatch. I have the wiring diagrams and that's all I can find. Rx7Doctor mentioned one on the long starter bolt. I'll take a look there.

I took the car for a rip yesterday, and she ran nice. I'm going to replace the battery later this week. As for replacing the cables, I'll wait and see what a new battery does for me. Replacing those cables doesn't look like fun. I think I came across a how-to, and will look it up.

Oh, the choke still works normally. Released on its own when I took it for a spin. It was a short spin however. My $5 wiring harness doesn't lock in place and as I drove down the street hitting bumps, all the lights on the dash flashed on and off once. Happened a few times. Have to pick up a better harness later this week. Hopefully it's not a bad voltage regulator on the Alt. Will the scrap yard take the alt back after I grind the ears down?

DivinDriver

iTrader: (15)

Does your voltage show up as low on your tach/voltmeter, after you switch ignition on but before you start?

Does the reading depend on how hot the temp is?

Rx-7Doctor

iTrader: (13)

The factory mounting point for the end of the ground cable from the battery is at the front side of the long bolt that holds the starter in place.

If these are the original battery cables just replace them. :-)

lazlong

Sorry for the delay in replying/reviving the thread, I've been busy working on the car


So I bought a new battery, and replaced both my pos and neg cables. While under the car I noticed the hose from my #2aabv to my intake manifold (I believe that's what it's called) had a hole/melt spot in it identical to the pics I've seen on the forum. I cut it out and spliced together a fix.

I also changed the tranny and diff oil and did a rad flush. Phew.

Back to the topic. First start after the new cables installed my voltage meter in the car read just under 14! Great success. Didn't stay there though. d'oh!

Took it for a spin and the needle seems to hover around 13v. Operating the headlights or the passenger window seems to have no effect. Turning on the blower and the needle drops to 12.5. If I operate the driver's window the needle won't move till I reach the end (up or down) then the needle drops down to 12. When I let go of the switch it will jump back up to 13-14. Then settle back down slowly to 12.5-13. Headlights don't move the needle.

I made a quick stop at the parts store (to show off my ride) and when I restarted the car the needle hovered around 12.5. Move the drivers window and back to 13. Sigh

Everything is working. Though I'm sure the passenger window isn't as peppy as it could be and sometimes is. I'm wondering if I have a bad ground on one of the cabin harnesses? Or the voltmeter is just tired and no displaying accurately.

Lastly, I didn't change the wire going to my fusible links. It wasn't spliced into my cable (as per the how-to) rather it's connected at the terminal. It's copper and looks good, but I'll replace it anyhow. Power from the alt to the battery is run through there. Right? It seems unlikely that this wire is the source of all my headaches. The box seems rather dirty, I guess I'll remove the box and blast it with contact cleaner. It looks like the wire to the battery is 8 gauge? Any benefit to going to a bigger gauge?

The worst part about this whole thing is that the car runs, drives and handles great. I probably didn't have to touch anything, but I love to tinker, explore and learn. I want to be able to make this machine run perfectly.

I appreciate all the replies and advice offered. This newb heeds your advice.

Cheers!

74RX4

iTrader: (10)

Your voltage readings are good. Sounds like the new cables fixed the problem. Since you like to tinker, try this to make your power windows work better.

http://intertron.com/ron/pw.html

lazlong

Thanks for the reply. My voltage readings are good? I was hoping for the rock steady voltmeter that others have posted about. Just seems weird to me. Although to be honest I haven't had any problems with dimming headlights etc.

I've got my window switch in pieces in front of me. Rubber covers disintegrated in my hands. I've been meaning to pull that panel to clean the speaker controller anyhow.

I'll report back with results. A rock steady voltmeter would make me feel better about all the money I'm throwing at this ghost of a 'problem'.

Oh and for anyone considering doing your battery cables, I found the how-to very helpful in every respect, except cost. I made my own cables, which turned out to be only a few dollars cheaper then buying pre-made ones, and it still cost me $70.

Cheers.