apexwarrior

I am in the process of makeing a plan and budget to do a certain swap. I was wondering what kind of rear end is everyone who has done the swap useing. My brother and I were haveing a discussion and came up with I either need to get a ford or chevy. I am not sure about this. What would be most apporpriet? My bro think he knows everything about rotaries.. he even has the cockyness to tell me that a machanic told him. He told me that if I have keep my gls locked rear end that when I put the engine in.. something was going to break on the first attemp to drive the car. Is that true?

What is the best tranny, rear end combo for a 13B-REW in a 1st gen?

cptpain

iTrader: (1)

i prefer a turbo 2 tranny(cheaper than a 3rd gen), and a ford 8.8, but i dont know what gears. my 2 friends have 9 sec cars with mickey thompson slicks on their toyota starlets with those drivetrain components except they have ford 9in. they told me the 8.8 is better for the street, and good use for the track.

apexwarrior

off of what car would i get a 8.8?

I have been hearing about 9 for a while even before i started driveing. If getting a 8.8 is good for a '93 13btt, then i will get it. I am not going to rush after this blinded with the intent to buy it and be done with it.

Anyone else know something? anything?.. PLEASE. and thanks for input

kevinbtz

iTrader: (4)

in my 13b rew 1st gen i used the stock rearend and it holds up fine exept when I turned up the boost to 14 psi and I expoded the diff (4.10). I have sense put the 3.9 in it and it hasent given me any problems. I also used the 3rd gen trany... replaced the 5th gear sincro and it has been butter

Siraniko

iTrader: (13)

For the price of mazda parts, you should consider the non-mazda rear end and avaialbility of parts. thats if you want to drag and street.

d0 Luck

the GSL's 3.9?? or some aftermarket unit??

RotaryRevn

Were you running slicks when you exploded the rear end?

apexwarrior

The best set up for the 13B-rew in a -se is the stock tranny that came with the engine and a Ford 8.8? I plan on doing some street and some weekend raceing(drag).

I also plan on rolling around in a set of 17's.

I wonder what everyone is useing for the exhaust?

13btnos

iTrader: (1)

Are you planning to do any mods to the motor or are you keeping it stock? A good rearend to use is a Ford 8.8 out of a Explorer they came from the factory with 31 spline axles here is a good read http://www.therangerstation.com/tech...plorer8_8.html And the 95+ Explorers came with disk brakes. You are going to have to get the rearend cut or get some front wheel drive offset to get the tires to tuck if you don't want to get the rearend cut. I'd go the route of cutting the rearend. Gearing wise dragracing and some street use look into something around the 4.11 - 4.56 range if you don't care about topend and long cruises I'd run 4.88's and that's what I run on the streets and the track.

apexwarrior

I think of getting a good sized street port and bigger injectors.. but i think thats going to be a lil high up on the budget. I was hopeing to find a shop in NE to do that hard work.. install the engine and tranny and then maybe when its back at my house i could do the rest. That way I could say I did the rest of the work once .. so and soo installed the engine.

z-beater

I am in the process of doing the swap as we speak...got a JDM front clip with all extras. How much are you willing to spend? Right now I am looking into teh 4-5k price range and that is without a re-built motor and me doing all the work(minus drivline work).

I am using the SE rear end with a modified fd driveline. If you are looking to produce more hp I would go with a 3rd gen rear end or just put a 9" in it. There is a shop in concrete called "Granny's speed shop" that sell the conversion. Supposidly makes it real simple. Or just run the stock rear end until it blows up(like me) and you have more money to do the fix or a swap.

I hope that you are ready for a fairly extensive swap, I am sure that others that have already finished the project can attest to this. I did a lot lot lot of research before I even decided this was the route that I wanted to go. As for the tranny I believe that you will need to re-adjust the shifter. As I said before I have not mocked up the engine yet however there is a guy here locally that has completed the project and he had to re-position the shifter. Maybe the guy that has been posting on this thread can enlighten us.

If you are really interested, and there are others I might be able to do a write up on the complete swap.

Interested? Let me know.

~Z

Bukwild

what are you going to use for engine management? Or are you going to carb this setup. I would not suggest to use the rew engine for the swap. I would use the 13bt from a 89-91. Easy to get cheap and all other parts are cheaper. Also is this your daily driver?

Bukwild

I say a good ball park number with someone else installing this and rebuilding the motor +shipping of all the parts you should be looking at 7500-8500 easy.

z-beater

If you have someone else do the work then yes you can easily be in the 7-8k catagory. Especially if you are having someone do the rebuild. If you are going to do the work yourself and not rebuild it at minimum look at the 4k price range. I have run the numbers time and time again and expect my setup to be around 4-5k. And that is partly because I picked up the complete(ic and everthing) for a little less than $2800
I agree with bukwild if you are looking for an affordable swap this might not be the best. Also from the reading that I have gathered, and talking to Rotary mechanics the life on the 3rd gen engines are about 75-95k(and that is completely stock). Some manage to get more than 100k but supposidly those are few and far between.
If you are looking to be cost effective go with a s4/s5 turbo engine. The parts are a lot easier to find. If you have the know how/money then go for the rew engine. That is just my 2 cents.
Personally I went with a 3rd gen because I got a killer deal on the clip and because there is someone in the NW that already has the TII in a first gen. Wanted to be a little more unique!
The numbers that I crunched for the S5 swap would have equated to about 3k.

Not sure if you are talking to me but I will be going with 3rd gen ecu. I decided to go with this for a few readons; 1. full wiring harness came with the clip, 2. I would be able to see all connections before I pulled the engine hence (hopefully) making it easier than an aftermarket ecu 3. You are looking at about 1200 for a mirco-tech 4. no tuning required(in a sense a plug and play) 5. oh did I mention no tuning!
You may get quite a few hp with an aftermarket ECU but I did not want to be pulling my hairs out all summer trying to get it tuned.

I say if you got the cash got for it! If not a 13bt might fit you better.

R×7

Toyota Hilux diff. Just pulled it out the other day to put some brakes on the rear and after seeing the size of the axle I have a lot of confidence in it. I'll try and get a pic up. (This is a popular swap here in Aus.)

apexwarrior

thanks for the suggestion guys. I really don't know of anyone thats got a 13BT in there 1st gens around here. I was thinking of doing a swap for a while, since i bought a 12A to replace the one that went boom last year. My brother has a T2 and a 3rd gen. I was rideing with him the other day, he blew away a few cars. His car is stock; then I saw that his car weights alot more than mine. I figuered that if I can get a hold of one of those engines and toss it in.. that I could whip the pants off him. As of late he doesn't know what I am planning. At first I was going to try and find a 3 rotor engine and see whats up with that.. but it got expensive real fast. And a rebuild is costly. So I went a step back. to the 13B-REW. I found a few places that have front clips for about 3.5 to 4. Z-beater, where did you get yours for 2.8? I was talking to this shop in mass and they said they can do it.. its going to be a 35 to 40 hr job. So the cost of the swap through them was estimated at about $2600. All most the cost of the front clip. I wonder if I will have to drop down to a lower engine. by next year all the guys around me will have 3rd gens and they will be looking awsome as hell. I don't want to be left behind. As of now my plans haven't changed and I plan on keeping everything stock untill i get enough money together so that I can hit it all in one shot.


I found this on ebay

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...983489316&rd=1

anyone know anything about it? say.. will it fit into a stock bell houseing of the 1gen that I have?

z-beater

13b-rew is the way to go. Since they are so popular to mod there are way more performance parts for the vehicle. Downside though(like I mentioned before) is that they do not tend to last as long. I picked mine up from an importer here in washington. I know right now they are out of engines since I picked up their last one I do know for a fact that they have a 3-rotor. I think it comes with just the engine and it is around $3500. Personally I do not se the need to go to a 3-rotor due to the price. Even though it is way cool and extremely unique the swap is extremely complex and patrs are more expensive than the 13b-rew. Not to mention that you have to mound up a 3rd gen tranny if you want a stick since they did not come with one. Like I said I would rather put the same money into a 13b-rew and be pushing 400hp.

If you want details PM me I will have to dig them up but I think I have their information somewhere. As noted before they are out but I might be able to talk to the guy and see what he can do for you. I am not sure if he will ship to the east coast, but it is worth a try.

2,800 seems like a reasonable price for someone else to do the swap. Is that a turn key job? I was working on my car last night and I pulled the engine and my dash. I spent about 8 hours in the garage and it was a huge headache.

One thing worth noting as well. Since you have a 12a you will also have to get a front cover from a gsl-se so that the engine will drop in. Depending on what tranny you rung you might need a rear cover as well.

What is your price range? When are you doing the swap?

z-beater

Oh yeah according to your numbers...

3,500 front clip
2,600 swap
1,500 additional material pieces
--------
7,100 total

That is a pretty penny Almost the cost of a 3rd gen!

apexwarrior

humm details would be nice. Theres a guy on the forums that I pmed about a subframe. He said him and his buddys could build me a subframe to mount the engine. It would land where the 12A goes. I hope then can recreate it.

They also said that depending on how much prep work they will have to do that will drop the price down. So I guess I will rip the 12A and all its componnents out and give them a clean bay and chassis to work with, that should drop the price about 1g i hope. If I could only get the clip deliverd someware close. I could work on it and get it ready to have them rip it out and replace everything. then I am guessing that the price will drop even more. Thats why I am going to do as much prep work as I can and figure out where I can drop the thing so I can work on it safely. maybe the scrap yard will help. If I gave them some 'rent money' I will hvae to see.. the swap will occur when I have finaliized every aspect. far as i can tell maybe next year sometime during summer.


my buget is to stay around 8000. but If luck turns it out for less. i will be extream happy and will endorse them on my car when i roll off to car shows.

z-beater

There really is no hug differences between the 12a to 13b when it comes to size. If I were you I would not get a whole new subframe, to me that is a waste of time and money. Go read the swap chronicles found in the FAQ and come back. I am more than happy to help you out as well as others on this forum but there is a lot to understand. It will take a while to read and understand but just keep reading.

As far as prep work I cannot see the shop subtracting 2600 for the removal of the engine. It took me 4 hours tops to remove the engine and all the extras(with an extra hand from kettleman). IMO the most tedious time consuming work comes in when you are trying to install the new wiring harness. The JDM harness will enter on the left side as opposed to the right, along with that there are a few other complications.

Since you live on the coast it will be easier to get a clip. I know that there is a fairly large importer in new york. Google it and you will find them. They had tons of engine for decent prices.

Personally I would not want my engine sitting in a scrap yard while I ripped it apart. Maybe partly because I am **** but also because I do not like the thought that I will have an open engine subject to the harsh weather.

8k is a fair amount and you should enough to do the work. But keep in mind if you want to have a re-build you are looking at another 1500-2000 depending on parts and service charges.

My reccomendation is do some research, then do more research and when your head is completely full consider doing most of the work yourself. The concepts of the swap are not too hard to grasp. You will save about 2-3k depending on the work that you have done.

Think about it this way with that extra 2-3k you can upgrade the existing engine to pump out a few extra horsies!

Let me know if you get hung up. Good luck!

13btnos

iTrader: (1)

Bro you can do this swap for under $8000 if you do some of the work yourself. My suggestion to you is get a good motor and transmission say $3000. All you need to do to mount it is use an early style front mount cover like the one you have in your car right now and mount it on the 13brew motor. You will need an oilpan from a 13b gslse and the oil pickup tube. The transmission mount is easy all you need is to add a piece of flat stock steel on the backside because the lenght of the 13b is going to move the transmission approxiamately 2in further back drill holes and your done. Regardless of what you do for a rearend you will need to get a driveshaft cut because the splines on the output for the transmission are more/bigger than an n/a transmission. Go aftermarket efi Microtech lt10s would probably be simplest or an lt8s same difference or even the older Haltech F9A's would work. With all the neccesities/accesories you can get an efi system for well under $1200. I'd go a simple single turbo setup look around you can find a "good" used setup from someone pretty inexpensive. Like I said you can do it yourself and save yourself some money but if your going to have to pay someone it's going to cost you. If your not in a rush do it yourself and learn as you go. But a beater to get around while you build your monster. Don't even port/open the motor if it shows good compression mild single turbo will net an easy 300+hp reliable motor. In an FB you will be smoking alot of cars.

z-beater

^^^I got a big second on that one! Also in the future you will be able to work on your car b/c you know where it all is and what it all does. And that alone will save you money because it is inevitable that 13b-rew will break down. The question is when!

apexwarrior

The only reason I would a shop to do it for me is because.. I don't have access to a forktruck or something to move the clip around.

Other wise. I got some parts from a se engine, and i think I got that oil pan.

time for some more research!!!

apexwarrior

heres what i'm looking at as far as prices that I have found:

13B-rew..
engine and tranny 2700 + shipping 250 = 3000 delivered + tailgate
I have a 12A and my friend gave me his blown 13B from an 85. One of those front covers would work? The oil pan and oil pickup tube are in good condition. I am looking for a -se gas tank. Fuel pump is going to be $100.oo. I am still looking for the fuel lines. How many I will need to make the engine work with the -se tank that I am looking for? I will need to buy a engine hoist so thats about $200.00.

engine management will be handled by Microtech lt10 or 8 depending how much, give or take right now.. $1000 buks.

..cooling..
what about the oil cooler.. can i use the one form the -se? Will I have to buy a after market one? I have an electric fan for the radiator.


so far i have planned on spending 3000 for the engine, 1000 for the stand alone engine system. 400 for the fuel pump, lines and gas tank. 120 for the engine hoist.
I need to figure out how to weld and make some tranny mounts. total so far is clost to 5000.. (may be I should just buy someones built up t2)


What did I leave out?

I plan on selling the parts from the 12A and the 13B so thats going to get more cash.