clayne

Heh, yet another example of a young person having their parent's do the dirty work.

Just assert your concerns in the situation and tell them how it is unacceptable to you. You simply tell him there is no way this engine should have failed and you are sending it back. Your dad knows you are getting jerked around - and will continue to be jerked around until either a statute of limitations runs out or you finally demand resolution.

The entire thing sounds like an oil starvation/oil delivery failure to me.

93BlackFD

i'm a little confused as to why you think you have the authority to state this, i guess nobody on these forums can attest to how meticulous i am with my car, i always let it warm up before i drive it, i check the oil levels before each drive, i also have more gauges and sensors than you can imagine, this isn't my daily driver, it's my weekend toy...some of you have a hard time grasping someone doing all that i have mentioned, but i do have a routine, and my girlfriend hates waiting on me, but be that as it may....

my parents loaned me the money, i refuse to use a credit card for that amount, they did not purchase it for me, it was not a gift, etc, so if that's what you're going to contribute to this conversation, i'd rather you just refrain from posting

both my parents and I have a vested interest in this matter, my original car was a graduation present for me and i sold it, used the money to purchase the 7, so having a broken car 6months of the 12 that i've owned it sorta concerns them, and that's why they were so willing to help me financially get it on the road

with that being said, it is a shame that this warranty is so losely discussed with the builder, but ultimately the customer has the right to a working engine

if the engine builder has to figure out the hard way that liability insurance is necessary when issuing warranties (as well as hard copies of warranties and receipts, signatures, etc) then so be it- this is not an aftermarket warranty to me, that's a different situation, this is an integrity issue to me

clayne

93blackFD,

"Letting the oil level run too low, consistently"

That was in reference to MY car's previous engine, not yours.

93BlackFD

ahh, well sorry...read it from my initial perspective, it sounds diff

also to add: i have two friends (3isacharm and r71) that were going to send their motors to pineapple based on my satisfaction with the motor's performance/appearance, but have now decided to seek other builders....not to mention the potential impact of all of you reading this, it really is in rob's best interest to make this right...

pomanferrari

iTrader: (1)

That is bullshit with a capital B. Bad business practice. I was worried with this kind of **** happening and the 5 year guarantee is too good to be true. Might as well make it a lifetime warranty.


First off, you don't need to go through prelube procedures as mr rx7tt said, the whole motor is filled with assembly lube. Second, if the oil level were low, then you would have seen something within a few hundred miles- for god's sake these are plain bearings not ball bearing assemblies and will fail very rapidly.
Third, if Rob has a brain, it's better to chalk this up as education and pay for another motor. What is his out of pocket costs $1000?
Fourth, I have seen something similar with a friend who sued Chrysler for a 10 year old engine with a latent defect. He filed suit in local court and subpoenaed everyone who had a finger into assembling and designing the engine to this local court in Md. They paid $5000 for a new motor.

pomanferrari

iTrader: (1)

On another thought, may be I should stop using that Evans NPG+ based on the recommendation of Pineapple.

This coolant has weird heat transfer characteristics: the temp at the filler neck rises from 180 to 240 within 10 minutes of shutdown even in 55 deg weather. This concerned me to the point that i installed an aux electric water pump to keep the temp from rising.

93BlackFD

he's also suggesting that i could have snagged an oil line on road debris, or an oil cooler could have been wounded from road debris, and that would not be his fault.....

that's sorta offending me when i am running braided stainless lines, i think the oil cooler would be ripped out of the front end before the line broke...and at any rate, i think it'd be blantently obvious to everyone if that were the case, not a "maybe you didn't notice this was puncutred or that was ripped, etc"

and just to further disprove that, we pressure checked the oil cooler lines/assemblies....while they were submerged in water....no room for error

banzaitoyota

I am having SERIOUS second-thoughts on sending my Pineapple back to Rob to fix the loss of coolant/blown coolant seal issue with it.
I can see it now:"You didn't have the right tidal conditions when you fired it up, deprieving the engine of coolant "
WHAT A BUNCH OF BS!

banzaitoyota

Instead of an edit, I will continue my thoughts.

1. I will document the engine running(again ) and blowing coolant out the exhaust.
2. I will presuurize the Combustion chambers via the spark plug holes and video document the bubbles in the coolant.
3. Pull engine and place on stand.
4. Disaasssemble engine with all the rotorheads present who care to look at the cracking of one of theses "Miracle 5 yr warrenty" Pineapple engines. Again with the video camera running


I can see me shipping the engine out there, and ROB saying its my fault and having to pay to have it fixed. Plus I won't have a chance to see whats wrong with it. I think more than a couple of people are curious to see one of Pineapples engines.

pomanferrari

iTrader: (1)

Did Pineapple got bought out from Hayes and running under new management?

A year ago, Pineapple could do no wrong.
businesses forget: it takes 100s of people to build your rep but only one or two to ruin it. Ask PFS.

3isacharm

He is right. My car has already been down for a year, I can't take any risks with my enigne rebuild. going wrong. I was initially drawn to pineapple for a rebuild because of the 5yr warranty, and I figured I could pay a little extra for that. Now it looks like the whole warranty process is just bs.

I can't imagine it being 99Blackfd's fault. The enigne ran for 1500 miles. I may be stupid but it would have to be installed right to do this. I am so confident in 99Blackfd that I hope he can find time to help me install my engine and other goodies I have. There should be no question about it pineapple should replace the engine. If pineapple only knew how much business they are going to loose and what is happening to their reputation because of this thread.

93BlackFD

so while i'm waiting on the motor, since i can't powdercoat and prep the car for this (already did that last time), i'm taking a different approach to passing the time

oregon state law:

{ - (2) If a consumer brings an action under ORS 646.315 to
646.375 against a manufacturer who has not established informal
dispute settlement procedures and the consumer is granted one of
the remedies specified in ORS 646.335 (1), the consumer shall
also be awarded three times the amount of the damages. - }

georgia state consumer protection act:

10-1-391. Purpose and construction of part.

(a) The purpose of this part shall be to protect consumers and legitimate business enterprises from unfair or deceptive practices in the conduct of any trade or commerce in part or wholly in the state.

Mazderati

iTrader: (3)

I think that is only going to apply within GA, though. Interstate matters are usually a federally governed thing.

Still, something good to note.

93BlackFD

true, good point...i'm just amusing myself by reading some of my rights, should it get to that point

here's an FTC related clip

"Deceptive Warranty Terms
Obviously, warranties must not contain deceptive or misleading terms. You cannot offer a warranty that appears to provide coverage but, in fact, provides none. For example, a warranty covering only "moving parts" on an electronic product that has no moving parts would be deceptive and unlawful. Similarly, a warranty that promised service that the warrantor had no intention of providing or could not provide would be deceptive and unlawful."

http://www.mlmlaw.com/library/guides...s/undermag.htm

vosko

iTrader: (4)

i paid $6k and motor never had one problem...... but i don't have a pineapple motor. my motor outlasted the car. how many times does that happen in a FD

anyway. stick to your guns! it just takes time

93BlackFD

found my savior:

For the purposes of this subsection, the term ''deceptive warranty'' means

(A)

a written warranty which

(i)

contains an affirmation, promise, description, or representation which is either false or fraudulent, or which, in light of all of the circumstances, would mislead a reasonable individual exercising due care; or

(ii)

fails to contain information which is necessary in light of all of the circumstances, to make the warranty not misleading to a reasonable individual exercising due care; or

(B)

a written warranty created by the use of such terms as ''guaranty'' or ''warranty'', if the terms and conditions of such warranty so limit its scope and application as to deceive a reasonable individual.


http://www4.law.cornell.edu/uscode/15/2310.html

banzaitoyota

Just to put it down, my engine was installed with a professionally flushed oil cooler, new SS oil cooler lines, new hoses, flushed radiator.

pomanferrari

iTrader: (1)

Dude, what the hell are you doing reading the federal code. You can't sue in federal court unless you can show damage of at least $75,000.00 or some specific provision of the code that waives this jurisdictional requirement.

It's better to sue in your state: the expenses, downtime and other hassles are enough to get an out of stater to think twice about proceeding with the suit in your state.

Like I said several pages earlier, I would give Rob one opportunity may be two opportunities and then it's letting loose the dogs of war. I submit to you that Rob has already lost the profits from at least two motors that he could have made b/c of this bullshit.

Kento

Make that three...

gcthree

For the record, Chris Rogers (aka Mr rx7tt) knows of what he speaks. Chris built my motor, and it has been great. Take Rob to small claims court already (he's obviously stalling), and bring the car up to Virginia Beach to Chris, and have him set it right. I'm sure Chris will do you right.

93BlackFD

well, hopefully this will not become a lawsuit, but i am not dropping it, so be that as it may, i appreciate your advice/counsel pomanferrari

at this point all I really want is a copy of the warranty and a receipt/invoice, both of which i never got, and the other four customers of his that i personally know also do not recall receiving...i've encouraged them to call and request a copy- perhaps that will communicate my message and influence on customer base....

93BlackFD

preface: i am gimp2x, chronos is on the forums, he received his pineapple LSP shortly after i did....we've been staying in touch to share tuning tips and dyno results

Chronos619: yeah
g i mp2 x: just warning you
g i mp2 x: my motor went south
Chronos619: yeah, mine might have too
g i mp2 x: they can't figure out why so they're saying it must be my fault
Chronos619: are you getting a new one?
Chronos619: OMG
g i mp2 x: they're claiming it had no oil in it
g i mp2 x: no, they're not covering it
Chronos619: sue them
g i mp2 x: now i'm trying to get an invoice/copy of written warranty
g i mp2 x: what's up with your motor
Chronos619: it vibrates like crazy
g i mp2 x: looks like there's 4 motors so far that are undetermined
Chronos619: did yours do that too?
g i mp2 x: well i went with the urethane motor mounts, so i thought it was because of that...but yes it was bad
g i mp2 x: i even took my torque brace off
Chronos619: did it vibrate more at various rpms?
g i mp2 x: yeah
Chronos619: holy ****
g i mp2 x: check this
Chronos619: I think we got the same ****
g i mp2 x: i am getting contacted by unsolicited people
g i mp2 x: meaning, i didn't ask for them to contact me
g i mp2 x: but major tuning shops (the big ones...)
Chronos619: right
g i mp2 x: they're all counseling me, they looked at the damage pics, they all said hands down, bad bearings or out of balance assembly
g i mp2 x: they're also all saying rob's theory of "not enough oil when i first cranked it"
Chronos619: yes, I beleive the bearing are bad in mine too
g i mp2 x: is totally inaccurate, seeing as to all the prelube they put in the motors
Chronos619: I think I have the same exact ******* thing going
Chronos619: ******* Pineapple
g i mp2 x: yeah
g i mp2 x: did you put the motor in yourself?
g i mp2 x: or did you pay someone
Chronos619: no
g i mp2 x: oh ****
Chronos619: payed someone an exhorbant fee
g i mp2 x: how much
Chronos619: $1800
g i mp2 x: yeah
g i mp2 x: figured as much
g i mp2 x: can i post this conversation on the thread?
g i mp2 x: do you mind?
g i mp2 x: what's your milage at
Chronos619: sure...I want to get to the bottom of this
g i mp2 x: on the motor
Chronos619: 2000

banzaitoyota

Another one??? JHFC!!!!!!!. And guess what: I too never received an invoice or copy of the warrenty.

vosko

iTrader: (4)

wow that sucks and i didn't know you were gimp 2x on aim lol

Chronos

Luckily my motor has not "gone" yet. However, it has not run properly ever since I first drove it out of the mechanic's shop (intense vibration at idle). After I put on 1500 or so miles, I tried bringing the rpms up to 6000, only to discover that whole car rattled and a horrendous vibration was coming from the motor...something is definately wrong with my $6000 motor.