nn20b

iTrader: (5)

I put a timing light to the leading coils and the light flashes very strong. With each flash, the engine sounded like it wanted to start. However, it still doesn't start. I can smell fuel in the muffler, so the injectors are working. I have not tried putting fuel in the intake as you suggested, but I'll give it a try.

My engine has been sitting around for 4 years. I checked the apex seals through the exhaust and they seem ok a year ago. Although I have not checked the compression recently, it huffs and puffs pretty strong when I crank it.

so how do I set TDC on rotor 1? Do I simply find TDC and adjust the CAS accordingly? I don't see any markings on the teeth though. I'll attach a pic of my CAS.

There's a mark on the main pulley, and I believe that's 5 degrees BTDC.

I have not done that. Maybe that's why it won't start. Minor details.

Michael Smith

Basically you need determine TDC for Number 1 usually to check on a S4 TII the keyway is at 9 O'clock. You need to measure the circumference of the of your pulley mine was 360 mm which makes it easy. divide by 360 degrees = 1 mm per degree therefore if you measure clockwise from the 5 deg BTDC 5 mm you have TDC for Number 1 then after that my GUESS having not worked on a 20B before is that every 120 degrees it fires. To set your Timing you need to measure past TDC clockwise 49.2 mm and make it with chalk. Now rotate you engine until the needle points to the chalk mark. OK to the CAS the TOP 2 point reluctor should be lined up with the TOP pickup. Bolt it down and start it up


Cheers
Michael Smith

nn20b

iTrader: (5)

I need to put the 20b crank pulley with it's markings back on the engine to do this right.

I'll let you know what happens.

nn20b

iTrader: (5)

ok, when I set the top sync gear to the magnet, the leading notch on the pulley is about 20 degrees off. Shouldn't the notch be about 5 degrees before or after TDC (I'm not so sure which)? What do you think about this scenario? See pics.

I started the engine in the as-is condition, I can smell exhaust!

I am going to try to start the engine a little later with the timing advanced to about 30 (to make up for 20).

BTW, should the trailings work during starting?

An

Michael Smith

A picture = 1000 Words

nn20b

iTrader: (5)

agh, problems

The CAS can be rotated in its slot completely one way (to advance), but not the other way (retard), which is what I need to set the trigger angle at 60 degrees BTDC. When I rotate the CAS to retard, it stops with a small gap in the slot. There is nothing stopping it that I can see from the outside. I can clearly hear it bottoms out on something though.

Anyway, I retarded as much as I could, which is about 43 degrees. So I set the trigger ref at 43. Of course, the car still won't start. The timing light flashes strong though.

What is the purpose of this setting anyway? I think it tells the ecu a sync event in relation to BTDC. So 2 teeth passes the magnets at the same time in the CAS and signals are sent to the ecu. The ecu then knows that TDC is coming up by the value set in the ref trigger angle, by however many degrees. In this case, 60 degrees. So my question is, does the ecu need a larger angle than 43 to work right (e.g 60)? I've seen haltech with 60 degrees ref trigger angle also.

Michael Smith

It's all easy to sort out don't panic, I realise you are not happy but it will all work out. It should have started ok. We need to check the physical timing of the engine. Pull the 2nd and 3rd rotor plugs out. With a rachet on the front pulley turn the engine clockwise untill you feel a little back pressure(a harder spot) then stop and remove one of the plugs place you finger over the hole and turn the engine slowly until it starts to suck your finger. Mark that point with chaulk to get a idea of where it is on the pulley it should be near the TDC mark. My guess is that it is but the CAS is 180 degrees out.
If the TDC is close on the pulley and the CAS is out by 180 degrees The 2 tooth will be at 90 degrees to the pickup.
To solve is simple, set the engine to 49 degrees(or 60 if you change the MAP) before TDC (FROM THE MAP CURRENTLY)on the pulley, remove the nut off the retainer for the CAS carefully remove the CAS (I like chaulk ->)before you lift the CAS mark the positon of the 2 tooth on the CAS and then mark it again when you lift it out. This gives you a idea of how far to place the 2 tooth around. Place the 2 tooth pointing towards the pickup and adjust as required and secure.

Start the engine

Michael Smith
P.S> I can smell burning oil already don't forget to clean your plugs while they are out, oil will reduce the spark.

Chaos Performance

Hi

I have installed a v500 ecu in my 93 rx7 twin turbo and can't get the thing to start. It just give a pop and a fart every now and again. The problem is that the new software are so complicated and comprehensive that I don't know where to set what. The South African importer emigrated 2 weeks after he supplied the ecu, so no support here anymore.

I have emailing Robbie at Wolf and yes, don't seem as if they them selves now whats really going on. He send me this map that does not work at all.

Stock 13 BTT engine
twin reluctor crank trigger 12 teeth ref, 1 sync, stock setup
750cc primary injectors, rotor 1 on output 1, rotor 2 on output 3
1600cc secondary injectors, rotor1 on output 2, rotor 2 on output 4
coils standard setup, uses stock igniter. Leading coil on output 1, rotor 1 trailing pin 2, rotor 2 trailing on pin 3.
injectors are RC engineering top fed ones with custom fuel rails
2 x T61 turbo's
2 x xcell external waste gates
greddy boost controller
Fuel pressure 3 bar

If any one can help to set the map up correctly. I would really appreciate it.
I only need to get the engine to fire, after that I will be able to sort out the fuel and ignition mapping.

I tried to attach the file, but nothing happens when I click the attach button.
So pm me and I will email you the file I got from wolf

Chaos Performance

here is the file

nyt

iTrader: (1)

2 t61s with only enough injectors for 1 of them? lol

hookup a battery boost and jump start to the car.. make sure its seeing over 12 volts when trying to start it. Adjust your starting fuel pulse until it starts. try around 5-8ms.

I don't have the wolf v500 software, so I cant view your map.

I would contact wolf for an S6 base map and copy the ignition settings out of there.

being that its a fixed trigger, the ref/sync settings will be the same for everyone +/- a degree or 2.

nn20b

iTrader: (5)

Michael,
What is the purpose of the REF/SYNC offset and REF/SYNC skip parameters?
Thanks.

nyt

iTrader: (1)

I don't remember this, but I explained it all in one of my posts. search for cas in the title

nn20b

iTrader: (5)

no thanks, I'd rather hear from someone who knows.

Chaos Performance

Thanks for your help.
I just got another map from wolf, will try that now.
Wolf aussie don't have startup or base maps for the V500 yet, thats where the biggest problem lies.

nyt

iTrader: (1)

Lol, you must be retarded. I didn't remember which was which off the top of my head. <g> Wonder where this info originally came from.

https://www.rx7club.com/wolf-3d-125/howto-wolf-v4-stock-cas-377388/

skip is the count of the teeth between ghost pulses, offset is the count of the teeth before the "first" ghost pulse.


I'm glad I took the time to figure out and make a writeup on this so I can be insulted by people without running cars that are too lazy to search.

Chaos Performance

Tried the new map from Robbie. want's to start , but not yet.

I think the sequencing is out. I tried to look for something in the forums about the relation of every rotor to the specific tooth number on the trigger wheel.
Which tooth after the sync is the first real reference where your leading should be triggered off, same for the second rotor?

nn20b

iTrader: (5)

Michael Smith;
ok, I checked the timing mark against the front rotor, and find that it is about 60 degrees BTDC.
is it standard practice to check the timing mark against the front rotor?
since the ignition/fuel sequence is 012, the front rotor is the "reference" rotor isn't it?
I think my timing is way off as I do have sparks and fuel, just not near TDC.

Chaos Performance;
yeah it does suck that there's no tech support from wolf here in the states. Keep trying man.
poke around the efi101 forums too, there's good info there also.

Node

iTrader: (1)

is that a custom lower intake mani? doesnt look like the stock type cast piece, dunno the 20b well enough though.

looks awesome, sorry to hear about the v500 frying up on you I was wanting a v500 for my 13bt project, not enough people w/ them.....

nn20b

iTrader: (5)

no, stock LIM but trimmed around the runners.

There's a reason why not many people are w/ them.

Wolf said that there are many rotaries running V500. I asked for some references and Wolf provided 0.

hwnd

iTrader: (4)

nn20B:

how did your car turn out? still having issues? you can have my 20B base map;