gerbraldy

Some people just like v8's. Why not use a v8, thats my question. An ls1 can easily reach as much horsepower as a 13b but without using a turbo. Just think if you installed a turbo on an ls1?; it would be crazy fast. This guy here in tampa is running a HUGE single turbo setup on his 96' cobra, putting down 1180rwhp, 1020ft.lbs at 32psi. You would get what like 500hp from a giant streetported 13b-rew running the same boost. I LOVE rotaries but v8's can pump out just as much power for 2/3rd's the price.

gnx7

iTrader: (10)

R1- I don't know about easily run 10's with 450hp... but with a drag race suspension it can be done.

I have a friend that has been thru 3 motors in 1 year and had one of the best tuners in the country tune the motor. 13B turbo making 375rwhp on pump gas.

Some people are die hard rotary guys.... I'm too poor to have to rebuild my motor every few months when wanting 500fwhp... I switched to a boinger setup for that very reason as well as paying $3/gallon vs. $8/gallon to make 500hp.

Different strokes for differnt folks. One thing V8 and rotary guys agree on is that the RX-7 is a great chassis that is lightweight and with upgrades can handle very very well. I think the FD is one of the best looking cars out and it has truly classic lines. I don't want to be one of the other 100 Vettes I see driving around everyday...

Hellspawn

Besides the better torque, better reliability, better gas mileage, better emissions, simplicity of being all-motor with the capacity to do 10's, lack of apex seals... ehh not much really. Maybe it's a west coast thing

tidbit

I want an LS7

13btnos

iTrader: (1)

"Some people just like v8's. Why not use a v8, thats my question. An ls1 can easily reach as much horsepower as a 13b but without using a turbo. Just think if you installed a turbo on an ls1?; it would be crazy fast. This guy here in tampa is running a HUGE single turbo setup on his 96' cobra, putting down 1180rwhp, 1020ft.lbs at 32psi. You would get what like 500hp from a giant streetported 13b-rew running the same boost. I LOVE rotaries but v8's can pump out just as much power for 2/3rd's the price."

What would it cost to put that 1180rwhp Cobra together? To make over 500rwhp from a rotary will cost me a lot less than that Cobra motor. I love V8's on boost they are very impressive to say the least. But a rotary can run with a V8 it all depends on your setup. A light car like under 2000lbs with the driver in it with 580rwhp will run with a lot of cars out there. Whether it be a V8 or anything else.

snub disphenoid

HOLY GOD, YEAH, did you see the freaking dyno results? 441rwhp, 412 lb.-ft. of torque, STOCK. Then they added JUST LONGTUBES - 483.5rwhp, 460lb.-ft. of torque! HOLY CRAP! STOCK CATS, STOCK CATBACK, JUST LONGTUBES. JESUS ****, MY *****.

WolfAmongSheep

I did not read the rules for this forum and all I got was an edited post by a moderator.

gerbraldy

^Your pretty retarded. WTF are you talking about I can't compare them, we are talking about v8's and rotaries. You do know that rotaries don't have pistons right? Please someone ban this guy, he is obviously going to contribute more harm then good to this forum, has only 4posts and is already acting up a storm.

owen is fat

lol

hey if I'm gonna drive my rx7 with ANY motor pushing over 400 hp, I would rather have a beefy T56 transmission behind it instead of any rotary tranny.

thats half the reason I did the swap instead of a turbo rotary setup.

the T56 can handle most anything you throw at it... I can do without the lightweight shifter feel of the rotary trannies since the T56 is gonna last forever even with 350+ lb/ft of torque every day to and from work and on deliveries, life is GOOD

Mr.Hatch

Quoted for truth.

It's a South coast thing too.

Pat McGroin

450whp or crank???

It only takes about 2 grand or the cost of heads and a cam setup to achieve well over 400 plus whp in an LS1, which is good for tens in an RX7. It takes a lot more money then that to achieve the same in a 13b thats for sure.

If you notice the V8 RX7 guys making 400+ plus whp are trapping over 120mph, which is good for tens, especially with a torquey NA motor which will get you out of the hole damn quick.

DrunkenGimp

iTrader: (3)

I dont understand the money debate unless you started with an empty chassis. It costs 13k+ from hinson to get the ls1 stock put in, that puts you at 330rwhp right? Well, for around 10k you can get a rebuilt and ported engine with a single turbo put in, and that can push you past 400rwhp.

I'm trying to consider the LS1 for my FD as well, and I see a huge difference low end, as well as reliablility and gas mileage, but is the LS1 really cheaper to get to higher HP #'s?

Heads and Cams come around to about a price of 3k installed correct? That will put you at around 430-450 hp if I'm not mistaken. Thats a little less than the price of a turbo setup if you already have fuel management etc. , which will also put a rotary at around 450 with the right turbo. The difference is all of the other things you need to do to get the LS1 in, such as the motor mounts, electrical mods, tranny etc, which come out to more than the cost of the full turbo setup (intercooler, fuel management, injectors, turbo).

Is what you're paying for the reliability and the gas mileage? or is it really the performance as well? If the performance is truely easier and cheaper on the LS1 swap I myself will go for it.

wingsfan

A bit. Those are just bonuses. You can flog the **** out of the car and not have to worry about the motor letting go (in most cases)...or worry about getting a bad tank of gas, etc.





People get too hung up in peak numbers. I see far too many people say "well you can make 400rwhp with a rotary" when in reality peak numbers don't mean all that much. Check out the torque curve of two equivalent peak HP cars, one ls1 powered, the other 13brew with a single turbo (pretty much what it will take to hit 400rwhp). The 13brew will lag (no getting around that with a motor that makes low torque without boost). The LS1 will give you 300+ lbs ft of torque right off idle and keep it for ~90% of your rpm range.

Personally I think my car handles/performs better with the added torque. It is heavier (not by much), and feels heavier (part of that is the GM PS pump), but it's easier to get out of corners, and the car pulls regardless of what RPMs you're turning, so you don't have to worry about downshifting as much (comes in handy for passing on the highway).

With the LS1 you'll end up with more area under the curve, better/more predictable throttle response, better MPG, etc. It's not for everyone, some people just flat out love their rotaries. I can respect that. I'm happy with my choice.

mazdized

I like my LS1 FC so far. Handling changed a little but it is perfect for me to drift the **** out of it. My swap with full size battery and dual 3 inch exhasut gained 130lb. and half that gain is from the trans. It probabily cost the same with rotary but there is no way I can keep it reliable and beat proof. I still find it hard to believe a 400 plus hp rotary can handle the way I beat my **** after 10 years of playing with rotaries.

Hellspawn

Mas280

Here is a dyno sheet for Hellspawn's car.

http://www.schaezler.net/michael/alb...bum04/test.jpg

Lets see some 13brew dyno sheets so we can compare...

Hellspawn

That Mas280 built, so that he could work on his next even MORE monsterous FD project. Gotta give credit where credit's due

owen is fat

both! LS1 is cheaper and will likely last longer than a rotary setup pushing the same power.
if you can do any of the work yourself you can make an LS1FD for pretty cheap for the power and performance you get from the end product. LS1FC widebodies are even less money!

flaresniper

in my v8 FB, im pushing 353rwhp without the 150 spray, 85-gsl-se rear end, and will be running 26x10.5x15 drag slicks. i too am hoping to join the tensecond club

2MCHPWR

iTrader: (2)

hey mark!
FYI after watching my tuner for two hours, and he knows his stuff (cartek; some of the fastest ls1's around), don't do 30 degrees timing especially when you road race. I told him i wanted 27.5 degrees. he laughed and said way too high and you'll make more power with less and less is way safer, but he gave 27.5 to me anyway. so it made 390 hp, 400 tq. Then he lowered it to 25.5 degrees, and it made 394hp, 404 tq. and of course he laughed at me. then he lowered it to 24 and it make 398 hp and 410 tq. i won't question him again.
moral of the story...stick with your 26 degrees. if anything, experiment with lowerer setting. atap it on road course and see if you get KR at 15 mins - 20 min into the session.

i'll be hitting the drag strip for the first time sunday with this car using 4.10's and MT ET street radials. concerns:
1) will i run out of gear? if so, is it faster to coast through traps or hit 5th?

2) how much psi to run in the MT's? car has a lot of torque in mid-range where i'll most likely be launching from. i'm thinking 15 psi to start. in my old ET streets (bias) from my firebird (3600 race weight), i used 12 lbs. That car made 18 more HP but 23 less TQ and weighed 670 lbs MORE!

here's the latest dyno graph:

payne

If you spin the motor all the way out to 6800 you will be fine to trap at the top of 4th.

I'll guess 11.8 assuming you hook okay.

payne

For me -

my 400hp LS1/FD is California Smog legal as an engine swap. You can NEVER have a smog legal 400hp rotary. (muchless a stock one)

turbogarrett

iTrader: (1)

Your hp #'s are pretty close to mine with same tires and rear gears, I go through almost at redline (6800) which is 123-124 mph. The 3.90's should get me a mph or 2 as my tr224 cam runs out of steam after 6500. My best runs were @ 20 psi tire pressure, slipping the clutch from ~3500. Good luck!

2MCHPWR

iTrader: (2)

well my concern was valid. i hit revlimiter 6800 RPM right before the traps. see vid here:
http://207.127.219.37/etown.htm
i only got 1 pass. i was spinning and axle hopping in first gear badly. my second/last run had worse axle hop and caused my exhaust to separate so i aborted the run, but had better 1.76 short time. there was decent head wind; killing approx 1-2 mph?

2MCHPWR

iTrader: (2)

chassis flex, band clamps and wheel hop can get you this:
http://207.127.219.37/images/rxpipe.jpg

thats why i aborted my second run.