LS engines
07-23-06, 06:26 PM
#1
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LS engines
hey guys im relitivly new to FDs and i was just wondering if the LS1 is the only practical engine swap for a FD within the LS serries engines? I am thinking about purchasing a FD in th near future so your input would be much appreaciated. thanx.
07-23-06, 06:34 PM
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http://www.grannysspeedshop.com
http://www.hinsonsupercars.com/
As far as practicality, v8s some domestic v6s, and the ford 2.3 are the 'practical' swaps because the mounts are cheap, readily available, and so are the motors, and they're cheap and responsive to mods and reliable.
You can put basically any motor in any car you want, within the limits of your ability to pay or fabricate yourself.
But at any rate, youre coming accros as a bit of a n00b, no offence. If you want to learn about LS engines, http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/ is a great place to go.
If you want to learn about cars in general, Id suggest you open your eyes and your ears and just hang around. Just dont develop any emotional attachments to inanimate objects or particular manufacturers, for your own good.
http://www.hinsonsupercars.com/
As far as practicality, v8s some domestic v6s, and the ford 2.3 are the 'practical' swaps because the mounts are cheap, readily available, and so are the motors, and they're cheap and responsive to mods and reliable.
You can put basically any motor in any car you want, within the limits of your ability to pay or fabricate yourself.
But at any rate, youre coming accros as a bit of a n00b, no offence. If you want to learn about LS engines, http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/ is a great place to go.
If you want to learn about cars in general, Id suggest you open your eyes and your ears and just hang around. Just dont develop any emotional attachments to inanimate objects or particular manufacturers, for your own good.
07-23-06, 06:35 PM
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^haha.
Pick your poison man. It all depends on your time and available funds. I've heard of people doing everything from built KA24DE, 2JZGTE's, RB26DETTS, LS1/LS2/LS6/LS7s, LT1s, SBC 350s, 302's, 351w's, etc etc.
My dream swap would be a 20B...and it wouldn't upset the rotards
Pick your poison man. It all depends on your time and available funds. I've heard of people doing everything from built KA24DE, 2JZGTE's, RB26DETTS, LS1/LS2/LS6/LS7s, LT1s, SBC 350s, 302's, 351w's, etc etc.
My dream swap would be a 20B...and it wouldn't upset the rotards
07-23-06, 06:37 PM
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Originally Posted by 93VRTouring
Ford 2.3T would be a better fit than an LS1, though I believe the LS2 and LS7 are both small blocks as well.
Plus, the amount of effort and time to put a 2.3T into a FD would waste the point of doing it cheap.
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07-23-06, 06:46 PM
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lol yes i am a noob.. my main concerns were clearance, weight distribution ect.
also if i wanted to go V8 would you recomend an LS2, LS6, LS7 or would it be best to stick with the traditional LS1.
also if i wanted to go V8 would you recomend an LS2, LS6, LS7 or would it be best to stick with the traditional LS1.
Last edited by DScott47; 07-23-06 at 07:01 PM.
07-23-06, 07:17 PM
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The LS7 will cost you 13,000 JUST for the short block and heads. It is by far the best wayw to go. If you want to spend alot less(I.E 3-4k) for both engine and transmission stick with an LS1.
100% of the time, the person who did the swap doesnt notice any handling difference as the weight distribution is barely changed(maybe 1% or a fraction of 1%). If you get the hinson kit you should have no clearance issues whatsoever, but word is with the Granny's kit you have to have some sort of power bulge in the hood.
100% of the time, the person who did the swap doesnt notice any handling difference as the weight distribution is barely changed(maybe 1% or a fraction of 1%). If you get the hinson kit you should have no clearance issues whatsoever, but word is with the Granny's kit you have to have some sort of power bulge in the hood.
07-23-06, 07:53 PM
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Just get an LS1. The other motors are not worth the extra cost. You can find a low-mileage LS1 for around $2,000.
Go here and start reading: http://www.torquecentral.com/forumdisplay.php?f=11
Go here and start reading: http://www.torquecentral.com/forumdisplay.php?f=11
07-23-06, 09:17 PM
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Originally Posted by js3324
The LS7 will cost you 13,000 JUST for the short block and heads. It is by far the best wayw to go. If you want to spend alot less(I.E 3-4k) for both engine and transmission stick with an LS1.
100% of the time, the person who did the swap doesnt notice any handling difference as the weight distribution is barely changed(maybe 1% or a fraction of 1%). If you get the hinson kit you should have no clearance issues whatsoever, but word is with the Granny's kit you have to have some sort of power bulge in the hood.
100% of the time, the person who did the swap doesnt notice any handling difference as the weight distribution is barely changed(maybe 1% or a fraction of 1%). If you get the hinson kit you should have no clearance issues whatsoever, but word is with the Granny's kit you have to have some sort of power bulge in the hood.
This isn't a cheap mod. You need to do a lot of research. The LS/LT or 20b will be the powerful swaps with the most resource available. I would stick with the GM V8 myself but for about the same money you can build a 400 RWHP FD, $15k-20k on top of the car.
07-23-06, 09:47 PM
#13
Originally Posted by FLA94FD
That would make it a long block
This isn't a cheap mod. You need to do a lot of research. The LS/LT or 20b will be the powerful swaps with the most resource available. I would stick with the GM V8 myself but for about the same money you can build a 400 RWHP FD, $15k-20k on top of the car.
This isn't a cheap mod. You need to do a lot of research. The LS/LT or 20b will be the powerful swaps with the most resource available. I would stick with the GM V8 myself but for about the same money you can build a 400 RWHP FD, $15k-20k on top of the car.
I would definitly just do an LS1 swap, and throw some heads, a cam, and headers and your car will be very very fast, and reliable....
As far as weight distribution goes, there was a post a little bit ago in the suspension forum about a guy who corner balanced his LS1 fd and it was only slightly off from perfect 50/50
07-23-06, 10:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Cgotto6
Long Block doesnt always mean block and heads...How about all the other accessories...
I would definitly just do an LS1 swap, and throw some heads, a cam, and headers and your car will be very very fast, and reliable....
As far as weight distribution goes, there was a post a little bit ago in the suspension forum about a guy who corner balanced his LS1 fd and it was only slightly off from perfect 50/50
I would definitly just do an LS1 swap, and throw some heads, a cam, and headers and your car will be very very fast, and reliable....
As far as weight distribution goes, there was a post a little bit ago in the suspension forum about a guy who corner balanced his LS1 fd and it was only slightly off from perfect 50/50
A long block includes the short block along with heads/and valve train and normally a camshaft. With crate motors this frequently can include the intake.
07-24-06, 04:15 PM
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Static weight distribution is not a big deal, and even 'heavy' cars are rarely past 56/44 - and most of that is becaus ethey dont have their front axle as far forward as the RX7s, which have the front wheels so far forwards the engine is entirely or almost entirely behind it.
But at any rate your tires and suspension matter a LOT more, and tons of turbo FDs are 'noseheavy' (hah) anyway. Let go of it. Dogma and marketing != practical concerns. 0-5% isn't a worry, the PMOI would be low anyway.
The biggest gain is that youd get much more power and torque and control with a large displacement NA motor than you would with a turbo, and the stock twins have yawn inspiring power comparable to... stock 302s, but a lot less reliability, and a hell of a lot less torque.
Anyway, in the long run, going LS1 is your best bet. LS6 is just a LS1 with a diff cam and heads (and a marginal difference at that, the LS7 is too expensive, and the LS2 AFAIK uses fly by wire and is a lot more expensive. But IIRC you also would want a LS2 if you want to go for big cubes.. and speaking of which LSx 402s have made 500 whp NA - better get a cobra cradle or some big rubber.
But anyway, a 300 whp FD with torque, reliability, and gas mileage is nice enough as it is. See how you like it first!
But at any rate your tires and suspension matter a LOT more, and tons of turbo FDs are 'noseheavy' (hah) anyway. Let go of it. Dogma and marketing != practical concerns. 0-5% isn't a worry, the PMOI would be low anyway.
The biggest gain is that youd get much more power and torque and control with a large displacement NA motor than you would with a turbo, and the stock twins have yawn inspiring power comparable to... stock 302s, but a lot less reliability, and a hell of a lot less torque.
Anyway, in the long run, going LS1 is your best bet. LS6 is just a LS1 with a diff cam and heads (and a marginal difference at that, the LS7 is too expensive, and the LS2 AFAIK uses fly by wire and is a lot more expensive. But IIRC you also would want a LS2 if you want to go for big cubes.. and speaking of which LSx 402s have made 500 whp NA - better get a cobra cradle or some big rubber.
But anyway, a 300 whp FD with torque, reliability, and gas mileage is nice enough as it is. See how you like it first!
07-24-06, 07:04 PM
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Originally Posted by FLA94FD
That would make it a long block
This isn't a cheap mod. You need to do a lot of research. The LS/LT or 20b will be the powerful swaps with the most resource available. I would stick with the GM V8 myself but for about the same money you can build a 400 RWHP FD, $15k-20k on top of the car.
This isn't a cheap mod. You need to do a lot of research. The LS/LT or 20b will be the powerful swaps with the most resource available. I would stick with the GM V8 myself but for about the same money you can build a 400 RWHP FD, $15k-20k on top of the car.
07-25-06, 01:25 PM
#18
If you were to purchase an LS7 crate motor they come complete from intake to oil pan with coil packs etc. You need to source the accessories mainly. Then the LS7 computer $400, wiring harness ($800), and a host of other parts. It is the most expensive proposition to build with production parts; however it is a dry sump motor that can make 700hp on 91 octane with a few simple mods.
Buy a 50K mile LS1/T56 complete pullout ($3.5-4.5K) add a bigger cam, some long tube headers, good exhaust, underdrive pulley, ported TB, LS6 intake, and tuning and you should be at 400rwhp.
Add some ported heads ($1300-2200) and you should be close to 440rwhp. Add a FAST 90 intake/90mm TB $1200 and you can gain another 20-30rwhp. Once you get to the ported heads stage the buildup gets pricey fast.
Jump up to a stroker motor and things get pricey fast. A resleeved motor allows 422ci427/434/447 cubes up to a 485ci but obviously is some serious bucks with drawbacks the larger you go.
The hardest part is finding a clean FD. Save your money because the LS1 conversion isn't cheap; however it makes for a great combo and totally streetable even with 500hp. If you can do all the work yourself (you can if you have 1/2 a brain and some motivation) you will save thousands.
Buy a 50K mile LS1/T56 complete pullout ($3.5-4.5K) add a bigger cam, some long tube headers, good exhaust, underdrive pulley, ported TB, LS6 intake, and tuning and you should be at 400rwhp.
Add some ported heads ($1300-2200) and you should be close to 440rwhp. Add a FAST 90 intake/90mm TB $1200 and you can gain another 20-30rwhp. Once you get to the ported heads stage the buildup gets pricey fast.
Jump up to a stroker motor and things get pricey fast. A resleeved motor allows 422ci427/434/447 cubes up to a 485ci but obviously is some serious bucks with drawbacks the larger you go.
The hardest part is finding a clean FD. Save your money because the LS1 conversion isn't cheap; however it makes for a great combo and totally streetable even with 500hp. If you can do all the work yourself (you can if you have 1/2 a brain and some motivation) you will save thousands.
Last edited by gnx7; 07-25-06 at 01:29 PM.
08-01-06, 01:15 PM
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I'm thinking about doing the same swap into my FD.. I was wondering about the transmission though.. I've heard of using a Richmond Gear 6-speed as an alternative to the T56, would there be any benefit to using it instead?
08-01-06, 01:21 PM
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Originally Posted by engineno9
I'm thinking about doing the same swap into my FD.. I was wondering about the transmission though.. I've heard of using a Richmond Gear 6-speed as an alternative to the T56, would there be any benefit to using it instead?
08-01-06, 02:34 PM
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Why what? Why LS1 swap? Why 6 speed? Why find an alternative to a t56?
I just read something about it so I wanted to know if anyone else had ever heard of this being done and could possibly give me pros/cons on either.
I just read something about it so I wanted to know if anyone else had ever heard of this being done and could possibly give me pros/cons on either.
08-01-06, 02:41 PM
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Originally Posted by engineno9
Why what? Why LS1 swap? Why 6 speed? Why find an alternative to a t56?
I just read something about it so I wanted to know if anyone else had ever heard of this being done and could possibly give me pros/cons on either.
I just read something about it so I wanted to know if anyone else had ever heard of this being done and could possibly give me pros/cons on either.
08-01-06, 03:38 PM
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Originally Posted by engineno9
I'm thinking about doing the same swap into my FD.. I was wondering about the transmission though.. I've heard of using a Richmond Gear 6-speed as an alternative to the T56, would there be any benefit to using it instead?
http://www.ddperformance.com/t56_partsupgrades.htm
08-01-06, 03:53 PM
#25
Originally Posted by engineno9
It's mostly just curiousity I suppose.
How much does this swap run anyways?
How much does this swap run anyways?