silicone boy

Ok, I finally get to actually work on my car this week rather than reading about it on various forums. I took out my 93 FD's soul this week. It really wasn't that hard. It took about 6 man hours of work. Not much damage was done to the car or myself, but how come you always bust the same knuckles over and over again ? The hard part was getting the old engine cradle out, as the bolts were all stuck. I'm trying to get the swap done in a fairly short period of time. The delay right now is getting the heads for my LS motor. I'm getting some LS7 heads milled slightly and the intake ported. The part I'm most unsure about is the wiring, of course. Hopefully all goes well.

The soul leaving the body





Out with the old




The new, waiting to go in when some parts arrive





There's no replacement for displacement

RE-Amemiya

Well, good luck....(going to leave it at that)

TurboLumpy

awesome bro should be a beast. good luck keep this thread updated

silicone boy

I'm doing it for environmental reasons of course....less smoking oil, much better gas mileage, etc. The 550 RWHP (bigger cam, milled heads) have nothing to do with the swap. Just doing my small part to help global warming

bkg

what happened to the 13brew and how much $$$$ will it costs to make the ls7 faster than the engine that was in it. What are you changing it for just to do it or is it going to be a straight line car?
Love the Carl avatar turbolumpy

KaoticFdR1

the LS7 is already faster

mirabile

Countdown till this thread turns into a war zone....10...9....8

GoodfellaFD3S

iTrader: (213)

Come and talk to us when the car is actually running sometime in 2009.

bkg

Yeah hey look believe or not I am a rotor fan whose dad knows a guy(his name is james something) with a 400hp 350 in a 88 gxl so I can talk from 2 stand points.(he's like a 50 yr old guy so all he knows is 350'snever liked rotary's) I also know ryan pond who was featured in HCi magazine for his turbo rx8 and 2 friends with turbo 2's. So realistically for straight line speed yes maxxed out a v8 will always outpower a 13b turbo but for circuit track racing we all know 13b is always the way to go. But for street driven cars it really depends on the person. Cuz we as guys and mechanics never like to admit we can't do something and with rotary's whenever they blow it's never a mistake we made but cuz of the high #'s of people that fix them or tune them wrong causing them to blow the newbie rx7 fans write them off and go v8. Trust me when you take a turn in a (cast iron 350never rode in a LS1 powered 7)v8 car you feel the weight in front off it and can get hectic. Now for the LS1 swap it depends I have a 2nd gen. so parts for me are reasonable; so thats the only car I can talk about cuz I have one. LS1's aren't cheap at all for a remanufactured LS it's around 5-6grand I believe now A 13bt is aroung 2 and when tuned right(by a true rotary tuner) they can get around 400hp sock reliably I've heard of higher but this I know is true. A fully rebuild LS1 I'm told can get like 700hp now when you weight them yeah their like 40lbs different but after doing a single turbo conversion on a FD its probably even more light. Now personnally the only swap that I think does the rx7 any justice is the LS1 but crap aside it ain't that much cheaper cuz finding a LS1 in good shape for sale will be at least 3-4 grand and after doing the swap it tallys' near the 8 grand. Plus, all imports are more expensive than domestics that's common sense we need turbos to compete against 350's and 427's that our replacement for displacement.

Yeah and the rotary is difficult for beginners heck I'm a newbie but I'm lucky enough to know some hard core rotrhead's and a handful of people that want to or have done a v8 swap. Maintenance for a rx7 can get hi depending on generation but trust me changing sparkplugs and wires, headers, oil, front or main seals or the timing chain in a 350 powered rx7 isn't fun and is alot of hassle. We all know things break.(oil filter relocator kits are a blessing for v8 rx7's you should invest in one silicone boy) But I would never go v8 not from hate or animosity but because I like the rotary and it makes the rx7 unique. PLus no offense the rotary powered 7's separates the real rx7 heads from the posers that thrash them which silicone boy didn't do and I'm not thrashing anybody. But you all know the types I'm talking about.

Please don't take any of this as a V8 vs. rotary post cuz I'm tired of that rivalry but I'm just trying to be unbiased cuz I'm one of the lucky few to know both cars and I just wanted to get that off my chest. Don't worry if this go into a rotary vs. piston chat I'm not gonna be in it cuz some of thoses people are childish and probably don't even hav a 7 or know anyone with a v8 one to compare.So please nobody get offended.

silicone boy

I know this thread will attract those who are offended by the thought of a domestic V8 in a FD, but hear me out. I'm sure there are those for whom I cannot redeem myself. I rescued this car a few years ago from a salvage yard. It was going to the crusher, so it was lost to the Mazda world anyway, so purists cannot claim I took a perfectly good rotary off the streets. I invested a lot of money on bodywork and drove it as a rotary for the past four years. I HAVE HAD NO PROBLEMS WITH THE ROTARY. I was getting my butt kicked by Z05's in local autocrosses. Don't say it was my driving--I don't claim to be great, but no one else has been able to take them on nationally in super stock.

Seeing how this would not be a competitive car, I decided to make it a track day car. I wanted to double the horsepower and keep good daily drivability. That was easy with a cam swap in a 427. I would have preferred to keep it as a rotary, but can you honestly tell me that this is possible while keeping the twin turbos? As far as I'm concerned, the single turbo conversions everyone does to get this horsepower level turns the FD into a drag car and ruin the FD worse than a V8 swap. As far as I was concerned, my goals were not achievable with the factory drivetrain.

There are those that would say that the V8 swap ruins the handling, but this has been disproven time and time again-besides, was the original setup really perfect, considering how many of you modify your suspensions? In fact, it appears to me that the stock drivetrain sat too high in the engine bay. It's possible that I will have a lower center of gravity and a the same or slightly better polar moment of inertia. Rest assured, preserving the wonderful handling of this thing is one of my top priorities, because I'm not into drag racing.


To answer those who say this project will take forever, this is not my first swap and I'm finding the process to be extremely straightforward. My initial 280Z swap took me a couple of months, and that's with totally rebuilding the suspension and reinforcing the chassis. Here it is now, after getting its second drivetrain:







As you can see, I have nothing against twin turbos

GoodfellaFD3S

iTrader: (213)

If you think that a single turbo ruins an FD, then you really know absolutely nothing about modded FDs. Seriously. A GT35R makes 400 to the wheels, with full boost at 3300ish rpm. How is that ruining it?

silicone boy

If it comes on nice and gradually, rather than being kicked in the rear, then I would say it maintains its track manners and I would stand corrected. Otherwise, it's just a drag car, which I am not a fan of. What I liked about the stock FD was that you could hardly tell the turbos were there on the roadcourse. A lot of engineering went into that, and it showed. I couldn't find people who were able to replicate these manners with a single turbo setup, although I'm sure someone had done it. The car you see above has similar "gentleness" in the turbo system. You can hardly tell the turbos are there except that, once they start working, you're going freakishly fast. It cost me a lot of tuning to get that setup

It's hard to build a turbo track car that works-nothing sucks worse than when your gigantic turbo kicks in at the apex. I applaud the Mazda engineers for doing a great job of building one of the great street/track cars of all time. I just wish they had been able to give us as much horsepower as it deserves (like 550 RWHP )

Rotary_Menace

one word, Wicked. 427, im drooling on my keyboard. i though an LS2 FD would be wicked. Wish i had the talent to do one of those, though learning to do an LSX swap is going to be high on the New years to do list.

Neil

bkg

silicone boy I'm glad everyones open minded about this cuz as we all can attest to some people like what they like and that's great and some people just get offended trust me. Some may not like it but as a car guy and rx7 guy I have to say the LS swaps are the best when swapping. You did the swap with good style and I respect that. I respect those of you that give credit to the 7 and understand it becuase those are the one of you that at least learned about the rotary. I'm glad nobody took what I posted as a diss and responded respectively I hope I can stay posted about the swap.
Good Luck

Black91n/a

Man I'd LOVE to have an LS7 FD. Nice work!

ZumSpeedRX-7

iTrader: (12)

good luck on the project. not my cup of tea, but i can respect the amount of time, patience, and money you will be putting into it.

and a LS RX-7 is insane on the autocross and road course, from what ive seen first hand. so please use it wisely. at least take it out to one track day. you're spending all this time building it, might as well spend some time to truly appreciate it.

keep us updated as the progress continues.

silicone boy

Thanks for the comments and words of encouragement guys. As I said, I have nothing against rotaries. In fact, I think I'm going to take the old drivetrain apart to learn more about it. I've also kept all the old hardware to convert the car back if desired (I don't think that will ever happen, since I lost a lot of flesh off my knuckles the first time). If they only made larger turbos for a dual sequential setup that worked as well as the factory one, I might have gone that route (although it would have been a major PITA to remove the old turbos!).

In any case, I think we can all agree that the FD is one of the greatest street cars of all time, regardless of price, and we all do our best to make it even better.

bkg

no problem man, if more 7 heads could be civilized and understand that no matter what its powered by we all love the 7. Some understand the rotary and can push it as far as someone can with a v8 powered one. If all of the rotorheads that understood it which some do and most of the v8 guys that thrash the rotary's(doesn't happen to often anymore) we all could have decent conversations like this and learn about our fellow 7 freiends. But as we all know those that thrash really don't know crap anyway. Hopefully I'll never be involved in any of those immature v8 vs rotary wars.
Yes rx7's (I have an fchopefully get a t2) are the best rotary is for the purebreeds and the Ls is just as good a compromise(not a cast iron v8).

CharlesM

You are doing an Ls7 swap?How many of these have been done? And how much more difficult would it be than the Ls1? It sounds beautiful You know, if you wanted to get really crazy,.... you could still add a pair of twins on it or go with a single turbo. But that would be a lot more money,.... and the power output my remind you of the drag car that you don't want but not much could touch it!


Excuse me while I day dream,.........

OK back,... Can't wait to hear how things keep going for you.


Wish I was in your shoes

SoontobeLS1'd

Effin wonderful. Good luck.

manatecu

iTrader: (6)

I have owned a 3rd gen with stock twins, modified twins, a GT35/40, and t78. I now own a 3rd gen with a stock 2002 LS1. Each and every one of these is a different car and requires a different budget. You will not be able to tell the differeence in weight from a single turbo setup and an LS1 setup.

My preference for reliable power is the LS1. I still have a second gen vert with a rotary in it but power it really does not have.

My advice to anyone considering changing from stock twins is ride in a car that has the modifications you are considering before you make the plunge because you think its cool or looks good.

Chris

silicone boy

Well said. Sure, the single turbo option is the one people go for to get massive horsepower,but it really is a different car than the one you started with, and if it's a road racer you want, it's probably not the best option for most driving styles. It just depends on what you are engineering for. BTW, there is only one LS7 FD that I know of.

bkg

I agree, but now with the EMS they have out now and turbo kits lately FD's have been getting like 600hp+ and 500FTlbs of torque which was unheard of before so using those single turbo kits aren't as peaky and unpredicatable as they used to be. Now for the LS if you get the turbo kits they have fo them (gale Banks is like 8 grand I think)they've came so far along where they will make boost at like 4 grand and the LS loves turbos I hear.