ptrhahn

iTrader: (9)

Anyone have any good info to share on these? I've heard mixed reviews... supposedly very streetable for those inclined to use it full time, but slow to heat up and not ultimately as grippy... how about wet performance?

Thanks!

Cossie

I dont know abt streetable....

in my pinion, R compounds are never streeable

Yes to the slow heat up(2 laps at laguna seca)

Grip is good but I have yet to full test them...too many changes in my car recently...no constant factor...

OC_

the race tires? the ones that are basicly slicks on the outside?
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires....ilot+Sport+Cup

after reading some of those it dosent seem that those where the race tire i thought they where!

they aslo come in silly sizes.

if your not going to use these on a track, i would look at a really good street tire.

i hear good things about that toyo T1S

bkapold@aol.com

Those Cups won't last on the street..You'd be lucky to get 5m out of a set

ptrhahn

iTrader: (9)

My car isn't a daily driver (often), so they'd mostly see fair-weather street use and track time. I know people have had luck w/ A032 and RA1s on street, so i wondered how these would do...

They do come in limited sizes, but 295/30/18 rear, and 265/35/18 front wouldn't exactly be SILLY :-)

Cossie

I use 265/35/18 all ard

18x9.5 Volks CE28N

ptrhahn

iTrader: (9)

I'm still trying to find anyone who can say for sure that the 18x10.5 +45 Volk fitment will or won't work in the rear.

SleepR1

We're all waiting for YOU to tell us LOL

rynberg

It SHOULD work with rolled fenders. I've seen people running 18x10 +38 offset rears with rolled fenders. Also, 9.5 wide +40 offset fits fine w/o rolled fenders and a 10.5 +45 offset would only stick out about 2mm more.

Well, it should work on the fender side, but perhaps it may not clear on the inboard side?

ptrhahn

iTrader: (9)

I dunno... i feel like we should all chip in and buy ONE 10.5" wheel with one 295/30/18 tire and settle it!

It'll be close... might actually come down to the brand of tire you use...

Carl Byck

For the street the RA1 is the only R compound that will last any period of time on the street, next would be BFG TAKDs, if you are driving beyond those, you belong in jail(next to mey cell ). I pulled 1.03G by way of a GTech Pro in my Supra on KDs. Very nice.

ptrhahn

iTrader: (9)

I'd run the toyo RA1s, but they don't come in an appropriate size for the front in 18" :-(

KDs aren't an R-compound AFAIK, though I guess they are about as sticky as "regular" tires get... and they ALSO don't come in the sizes I want >:-0

alberto_mg

I'd say try the BMW or Porsche boards or Grassroots Motorsports with your question. I saw a few posts about them on dtmpower.net when I had my BMW.

BFGRX7

iTrader: (2)

the pilot sport cup was initially designed for Porsche club racing events in europe. They are now used in Porsche Club of America events, hence the Porche specific sizes. They are multiple compound tires that have excellent wear characteristics. There is an audi A4 owner that has seen 12K on the tires using the tires to drive from a Chicago suburb to either Gingerman in MI or Elkart Lake, WI. With regards to the tires taking some time to heat up, that tends to be an extention of improper inflation techniques. Many have used Khumho and Hoosier inflation pressures, which tend to be too high. Wet weather performance is very good so long as it isn't a driving rainstorm in which case the tire has a procedure for grooving for the wet. We have seen the Khums and Hoosiers faster over the first 2-5 laps. They always fall off after that point with the Cups staying dead consistent. The Sport Cups' sidewall construction is much stiffer than the competitors allowing for quicker initial turn-in as well as contributing to the car taking a more consistent "set" in a turn. Most fail to realise that because these tires have a stiffer sidewall you must consider lowering your spring rates compared to the competitors (re:softer ride). I have a wealth of info on the Sport Cup as well as the BFGoodrich KDs if anyone's interested.

~M

dclin

iTrader: (4)

I'd actually be more worried about the fender side. Should work with heavily rolled fenders (to the point of pulling the fender out, like what a New Zealander - Arnie - did quite a few years ago. http://www.rx7.net.nz/fdkai.htm - click on Members list / Arnie N. / Build pictures now on page 2 - damn, I hate frames). A 18x10.5 +45 has the same back spacing as a 18x10 +51 (all things being equal), which we know quite a few have now (which may or may not require at least aftermarket trailing arms for more clearance). I believe the key is the tire selection - I don't think a 295 width would work well (unless heavy negative camber setting and/or the above mentioned fender massaging), though 265 should work (which brings about a whole new set of faults).

But your right - I know Bigred has 18x10 +38 (which should theoritically have basically the same front spacing as 18X10.5 +45), but with 265/35/18s. I think the stretched sidewall bought him the precious mm's he needed hehe. I never found out what his camber setting was though.

Quote:

Originally posted by rynberg

Also, 9.5 wide +40 offset fits fine w/o rolled fenders and a 10.5 +45 offset would only stick out about 2mm more.

Should actually stick out 7.7mm, all things being equal.

dclin

iTrader: (4)

Ahh, figured out how to direct link to Arnie's page:

http://geocities.com/fdkaimember/arnien2.htm

Cossie

[IMG] http://images4.fotki.com/v44/photos/...n007310-vi.jpg[/IMG]

Report on the track

Second time on the track ... car drives right this time(had a broken front sway the alst time)

Takes a good 2 laps to fully warm up but grip is great after that.

I run hot 30-31F 32R Excellent grip with a little noise if I try too hard...

My tire sizes are 265/35/18 all ard with 18x9.5 CE28Ns


Didnt break any records but my times were more consitent

ptrhahn

iTrader: (9)

I'm certainly interested in your "wealth" of info. I'm surprised you mention the KD, since its not an "R" compound tire... how does it compare?

DamonB

Let the info fly! Let's hear it.

ptrhahn

iTrader: (9)

Yup,
A 10.5 +45 should have the frontspacing of a 10 +38, and the backspacing of a 10 +51. 4" frontspace, 7.5" backspace (withing a mm).

They'll stick out about 1/4" further than the 10 +44 Fikses on my car, and with 275/40's, they look for all the world like they would rub, but don't.... but i'm SURE that would be ok w/ a roll job

BFGRX7

iTrader: (2)

Ya know what? That line sounded really bad and I didn't mean it to come out that way! Maybe I should have intro'd myself first. Sorry guys! I work for Michelin as a motorsports marketing manager. I have been involved with the Porsche Club of America for the past year going to most of their larger regional events in the Northeast and midwest. The "wealth of knowledge" is regarding the care and feeding report of the Sport Cup tires. I can send out this report to you to read at your leisure. Many of you know that Michelin also owns BFGoodrich tires. I've been fortunate enough to do comparison tests with our Michelin high performance tires and can tell you that there is a big difference in performance! Now I know you're all saying I'm bias and full of **** and that's completely understandable. But just so you know, there are going to be a large number of arrive and drive events in 04' in conjuction with a yet to be named series in the Import Revolution tradition. I can get that info to you as soon as its announced in the new year. The premise behind the arrive and drive is to let you the consumer judge for yourself the differences between our product and the competitions and I'm not talking about lat year's competition-I mean the new stuff! You will also get to drive in high-performance cars like the 350Z and maybe get into a car you may not necessarily buy but have wanted to trash (re:SRT4). Again, sorry guys. I didn't mean to come off sounding like an ***!

~M

ptrhahn

iTrader: (9)

BFGRX7... i wasn't thinking you sounded like an *** at all... i should have left the quotes off. I'm genuinely interested in how you would rate:

1. Sport Cups to other "R" s

2. BFG KDs to "R" compound tires

3. Your opinion on the "nearest to R" street tire (perhaps the KD) or the most streetable "R".

Fire away, we like real data!

BFGRX7

iTrader: (2)

Well the cool thing about SCs for you guys is that even though they were initially designed for the 911s, we have done quite a bit of testing on the 944s. While there are some pretty obvious vehicle dynamics differences, we were able to create a balance for that model within a few sessions. My office is a few miles away (I'm on vaca!). I'll head in and get some of our results to disscus later this evening.

~M

DamonB

BFGRX7, I'm the Mod of this section and I say spill as many beans as you see fit Like prthahn said; you have first hand info that real enthusiests are always looking for. Sure you may be a little biased but I think all of us could learn a lot nonetheless.

I would personally love to hear anything you have to say about tire development.

Michelin owning BFG was news to me. How long has it been that way?

dclin

iTrader: (4)

Yes, all the info you can share with us is terrific! Just of plain curiousity, why did BMW equip the M3 CSL with 19" wheels? IIRC, it's brakes were not signicantly larger to warrant the increased wheel diameter. Since SCs are spec for the car, I was hoping you might have more insight on this.

Not that I'm anti-19's by anymeans - 19x9s and 19X10s are the latest set of wheels for me - but I got them strictly for aesthetics. If going to 19" SCs is acceptable for occassional track use, I may forget about buying a dedicated set of track wheels and tires and just run 19" SCs alll the time. TIA!