If Money was No Object Coil-Over (FD)?
#26
If money is no object, keep your street car comfortable and buy a race car for the track. Similar to brake pads, what works on the track does not work well on the street. There are no coil-overs that allow you to adjust the spring rate with the flick of a switch or twist of a ****, which is what you'd need to have a single unit that works well for both street and track.
-Max
-Max
#27
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Anyone know why the QUANTUM rear springs are stiffer then the fronts or if that's possibly just a typo and it's the other way around?
As for what I'm looking for, is something that will perform excellent on the track and be acceptable on the street.
though with the amemiya coilovers you'd definetly want to run r-comps and wing might be a good idea otherwise you might have too much oversteer.
another option are dg-5 coilovers, its keiichi tsuchiyas company. i have kei office type xr (from his old company) and they are great. good for both the street and the track, i highly recommend them. i think their spring rates are better for those who dont want to run a wing.
#29
Originally Posted by azn akira
i would go with amemiya coilovers if you dont know how to adjust 3 way dampers, motons if you do. imo the quality of the damper makes a bigger difference in ride quality. i have 14/12 kg springs (thinking about going stiffer) and when i soften the dampers the ride is fine for the street. i've never had anyone complain
though with the amemiya coilovers you'd definetly want to run r-comps and wing might be a good idea otherwise you might have too much oversteer.
another option are dg-5 coilovers, its keiichi tsuchiyas company. i have kei office type xr (from his old company) and they are great. good for both the street and the track, i highly recommend them. i think their spring rates are better for those who dont want to run a wing.
though with the amemiya coilovers you'd definetly want to run r-comps and wing might be a good idea otherwise you might have too much oversteer.
another option are dg-5 coilovers, its keiichi tsuchiyas company. i have kei office type xr (from his old company) and they are great. good for both the street and the track, i highly recommend them. i think their spring rates are better for those who dont want to run a wing.
Also, are the Quantum RS spec the same as the RE Spec on rhdjapan? Or is it possibly just a typo and they are the same?
I also thought about the downforce for the RE-Amemiya QUANTUM's since the RE car has plenty of it but wasn't sure that was the reasoning.
I do have someone to set up the moton's but I would rather be able to do it myself. Are the Moton's that much more complex?
So many choices... I'm leaning toward the Quantums and have read good things about them. Anyone have anything else to pitch in?
"Im not sure what spring rates etc they are but the ride is amazing! So responsive and plush with not being too stiff."
"They don't ride as harsh as you may think due to the way the damper is built. Very very good kit"
Most Likely Options:
RE-Amemiya QUANTUM RS, SWIFT F16K/R18K - $4,687.88 (464,10 Yen) + S/H RE-Amemiya,Japan ($4773.72 shipped from rhdjapan.com)
Keiichi-Tsuchiya DG-5, SWIFT F16K/R14K - $2,690.97 (270,900 Yen) + S/H Japan
Moton - 3 Way (Excludes Springs) - $6,653.00 hrpworld.com + Swift Springs F16K/R14K? (I can get these cheaper through sponsored mech)
Scoot Custom made - (Cost Unknown) + S/H Scoot,Japan
Possible Options:
HKS Hiper Max 3 Sport, F12K/R10K - $1,599 rx7store.net
Tein Flex, F7.8K/R5.8K - $1,549 rx7store.net (Howard Coleman likes them)
Others (since they were mentioned):
*Supposedly the same
*Greddy Type S, F10K/R8K - $1,490 rx7store.net
*RE-Amemiya STREET - $2,100.00 (207,900 Yen) + S/H RE-Amemiya,Japan
RE-Amemiya QUANTUM RS, SWIFT F16K/R18K - $4,687.88 (464,10 Yen) + S/H RE-Amemiya,Japan ($4773.72 shipped from rhdjapan.com)
Keiichi-Tsuchiya DG-5, SWIFT F16K/R14K - $2,690.97 (270,900 Yen) + S/H Japan
Moton - 3 Way (Excludes Springs) - $6,653.00 hrpworld.com + Swift Springs F16K/R14K? (I can get these cheaper through sponsored mech)
Scoot Custom made - (Cost Unknown) + S/H Scoot,Japan
Possible Options:
HKS Hiper Max 3 Sport, F12K/R10K - $1,599 rx7store.net
Tein Flex, F7.8K/R5.8K - $1,549 rx7store.net (Howard Coleman likes them)
Others (since they were mentioned):
*Supposedly the same
*Greddy Type S, F10K/R8K - $1,490 rx7store.net
*RE-Amemiya STREET - $2,100.00 (207,900 Yen) + S/H RE-Amemiya,Japan
Last edited by thewird; 10-11-08 at 02:47 PM.
#31
Searching for 10th's
iTrader: (11)
I would call TriPoint engineering or TrueChoice Racing services and get a set of Koni competitionon double adjustable shocks valved for SM2 autox, matched to springs of their recommendation. These are coilovers BTW.
Then I would ditch the ST swaybars and put in a TriPoint front adjustable bar and Racing Beat rear adjustable bar.
About $4k for all the parts.
Quite a bit less then Penske's or Motons, probably just as good.
Then I would ditch the ST swaybars and put in a TriPoint front adjustable bar and Racing Beat rear adjustable bar.
About $4k for all the parts.
Quite a bit less then Penske's or Motons, probably just as good.
#32
Already have the new Racing Beat sway bars front and rear, as well as the front mount reinforcement strut.
Forgot to mention, thanks to everyone that has participated in this thread. It's going much better then I thought it would. Very usefull info.
thewird
Forgot to mention, thanks to everyone that has participated in this thread. It's going much better then I thought it would. Very usefull info.
thewird
#33
Rotor or no motor
iTrader: (24)
re-amemiya greddy suspension spring rates:
-Front : 10kg
-Rear : 8kg
Greddy suspension type S
1993-96 front 10K-L200mm/ rear 8K-L200mm FD3S
Spring rates sourced from greddy.com and rhdjapan
#35
Rotor or no motor
iTrader: (24)
Well, thewird wants a compromise for street and track if i get it right from the first post.. I think the hks is the best compromise for both.
I havent used the quantum so i wouldnt know as i have mentioned in my previous post. i have tried the re-amemiya greddy and the greddy type S and havent felt any difference
I havent used the quantum so i wouldnt know as i have mentioned in my previous post. i have tried the re-amemiya greddy and the greddy type S and havent felt any difference
#36
Mr. Links
iTrader: (1)
+1 on jkstill's suggestions. For a dual purpose car, which is what you have, you aren't going to get any better than re-valved double adjustable Koni's. The RB sways aren't much better than stock which is why jkstill recommend Tripoint's which is adjustable. Most of the serious guys are running the Tripoint front sway with something like the Tanabe rear sway.
#38
IMO, getting race dampers for a car that is not 100% pure race/competition is just a waste of money especially when you consider the amount of maintenance they require. The reason of "I can" is not always a good one. i.e. you "can" drive a car with your feet; however, that doesn't mean you should.
+1 on jkstill's suggestions. For a dual purpose car, which is what you have, you aren't going to get any better than re-valved double adjustable Koni's. The RB sways aren't much better than stock which is why jkstill recommend Tripoint's which is adjustable. Most of the serious guys are running the Tripoint front sway with something like the Tanabe rear sway.
+1 on jkstill's suggestions. For a dual purpose car, which is what you have, you aren't going to get any better than re-valved double adjustable Koni's. The RB sways aren't much better than stock which is why jkstill recommend Tripoint's which is adjustable. Most of the serious guys are running the Tripoint front sway with something like the Tanabe rear sway.
Getting engine ready for abuse (not for this thread)....
Brakes were fading like no tomorrow... Got Hawk HP+ all around and new slotted rotors... That helped but wasn't good enough...
Changed brake fluid to Motul 5.1... better but still not good...
Got Stoptech BBK with matching rear rotors... mmm so much better but balance was a little off...
Got Hawk DTC-70 pads for the front... ah yes perfect ...
Then wanted more stable car in the corners... Koni yellow shocks + H&R springs... mmm, new shocks and springs vs 15 year old shocks are like night and day, success ... Now car leans too much in the corners...
Get racing beat front/rear sway bars + reinforcement strut... Ah good but now I need more grip....
Start using Hoosier R6's... omg bbq, lap times start dropping like a rock ...
Water temps go up to fast (10-15 minutes 106C)... order FDNewbie/Intransigent Dual Oil Cooler Kit... ah great, i can stay on for 20+ minutes and water temps only 96-98C...
Want to go faster... increase boost to 17 pounds and one day try 18 pounds and blow the motor (yes it was tuned for it but i was running lean on purpose 12 afr)... Build new motor with ceramic apex seals and port the intake manifold and order FEED throttle body... also order 500R-SP turbo (still hasn't arrived)...
Notice my suspension doesn't work as well as race car's I run with, open this thread which seems to be pointing to RE-Amemiya QUANTUM's...
edit: ah yes, also got 24 piece superpro bushings because some were worn and decided to do a complete overhaul to something better.
What more after this? Guess we'll find out after suspension and new turbo is on
thewird
Last edited by thewird; 10-12-08 at 05:25 PM.
#40
If the sway bars need to be upgraded, i'll get to that but I only upgrade one thing at a time so I can feel the difference each modification makes.
thewird
#41
Mr. Links
iTrader: (1)
Just because RE runs Quantums doesn't mean they are running them "as is" straight off the shelf. i.e. don't think that just because you by the same thing, you'll have the exact same performance.
Also, you can do just custom springs or you can use the Ground Control coilover sleeves if you want the additional height adjustability.
Do as you wish, but IMO I think you are making a mistake going for a pure race damper.
#43
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Most important, you can get Koni's easily and quickly serviced here in the US from multiple locations. Next, you'll be guaranteed that the shocks have been dyno'd for the requested valving. Lastly, there are a lot of shock dyno's around showing that Koni are about the most predictable dampers around until you get to the race equipment like Moton or Penske.
Just because RE runs Quantums doesn't mean they are running them "as is" straight off the shelf. i.e. don't think that just because you by the same thing, you'll have the exact same performance.
Also, you can do just custom springs or you can use the Ground Control coilover sleeves if you want the additional height adjustability.
Do as you wish, but IMO I think you are making a mistake going for a pure race damper.
Just because RE runs Quantums doesn't mean they are running them "as is" straight off the shelf. i.e. don't think that just because you by the same thing, you'll have the exact same performance.
Also, you can do just custom springs or you can use the Ground Control coilover sleeves if you want the additional height adjustability.
Do as you wish, but IMO I think you are making a mistake going for a pure race damper.
I know thewird's car; he's pulled some lightening quick times at our local track called Dunnville. But I still advise against high-end race coilovers unless you want to make your FD a dedicated track car. Even so, as Mahjik had pointed out, maintenance will be difficult.
Also, I'd strongly recommend Delrin bushings. They provide an absolutely linearity in the handling of the car.
Howi
#44
Rotary Freak
iTrader: (22)
Agreed with Mahjik.
Servicability is everything if track is this important to you. Get something that can be serviced and turned around within 2 weeks. PENSKE would be nice.
By custom spring rates he simply means you can get 2.5" ID coilover springs at the rate of your choice and have your Dampers valved accordingly.
If you worked with a company like Tripoint or Ground Control and specified corner balance values, track topography, etc... however detailed you could be, they can set you up with a custom suspension.
Same goes for Moton, Ohlins, JRZ also. the money will be spent in the custom build and service you desire. The name you choose is up to you.
Now Tein also makes a Super Racing Damper which is Double Adjustable, independent, and possibly a better value. They have all the tools to valve and design this however you want.
Rishie
Servicability is everything if track is this important to you. Get something that can be serviced and turned around within 2 weeks. PENSKE would be nice.
By custom spring rates he simply means you can get 2.5" ID coilover springs at the rate of your choice and have your Dampers valved accordingly.
If you worked with a company like Tripoint or Ground Control and specified corner balance values, track topography, etc... however detailed you could be, they can set you up with a custom suspension.
Same goes for Moton, Ohlins, JRZ also. the money will be spent in the custom build and service you desire. The name you choose is up to you.
Now Tein also makes a Super Racing Damper which is Double Adjustable, independent, and possibly a better value. They have all the tools to valve and design this however you want.
Rishie
#45
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The right way to go about this is to read up on dampers, springs, bars, everything suspension related and understand how they all work together, then calling up a race shock company like the ones already mentioned here and getting them to build you a shock for your purposes. It is absolutely crucial that you understand a shock dyno, otherwise you are purely getting fleeced by marketing bullshit. Data do not lie.
If you're hardcore you can get racer revalvable shocks - you can put in your own shims, jets, plates and adjust valving in as little as 10 minutes. The more exotic way is to get adjustable shocks. Be sure that the rebound and compression spectrum is what you're looking for though.
The lazy way to do it is to go with pre-determined rates, i.e., Teins, DG-5's, Quantums. These are marketed for the average week-end racer who has no interest in hardcore suspension engineering. How hard do you want to work? Btw, low-end Konis are crap. The hysteresis is terrible.
Here's an example of a PROPER shock dyno.
If you're hardcore you can get racer revalvable shocks - you can put in your own shims, jets, plates and adjust valving in as little as 10 minutes. The more exotic way is to get adjustable shocks. Be sure that the rebound and compression spectrum is what you're looking for though.
The lazy way to do it is to go with pre-determined rates, i.e., Teins, DG-5's, Quantums. These are marketed for the average week-end racer who has no interest in hardcore suspension engineering. How hard do you want to work? Btw, low-end Konis are crap. The hysteresis is terrible.
Here's an example of a PROPER shock dyno.
#47
Lives on the Forum
iTrader: (6)
IMO, getting race dampers for a car that is not 100% pure race/competition is just a waste of money especially when you consider the amount of maintenance they require. The reason of "I can" is not always a good one. i.e. you "can" drive a car with your feet; however, that doesn't mean you should.
Quoted for the truth, for those who are not local to thewird should know that he doesn't listen to what people say. Just goes on his own and buys things... ie. his.. I can attitude..
I say listen to what Mahjik says. I think the name brand is fooling this young man.
#48
Eats, Sleeps, Dreams Rotary
iTrader: (19)
My FD's not really a daily driver. I take it up to the hills for some fun a couple times a month, but it's mostly a toy for Laguna Seca. The ZEALS, IMO, are a great set up for someone like me, who doesn't street-drive the car TOO much, but also want's a 1/2way decent ride on the way to the track.
If money were no object, I'd be looking into a set of Penskes and a trailer.
#50
Rotor or no motor
iTrader: (24)
the more you dig into it the more confused you ll be.
write down all the brands/models, close your eyes, point ur finger at one and open your eyes ! and buy that one ! lol
all the suspension that were mentioned in this thread are good !!!!!!!!!
write down all the brands/models, close your eyes, point ur finger at one and open your eyes ! and buy that one ! lol
all the suspension that were mentioned in this thread are good !!!!!!!!!