Brekyrself

iTrader: (30)

I am currently finishing up a full powerflex bushing install and need to get a set of coilovers ordered asap. Only problem is I can't decide on a set to go with. Any advice or first hand experience would be great.

Usage is 75% street (weekend toy) 25% DE track day. Aiming to do 1-3 DE events a month during the summer.

On the table:
-Ohlins Road and Track
-Stance XR (apparently these are re badged DG5 coilovers)
-Also open to other options 3k and under.

Ohlins
Positives
-Ohlins's makes great shocks
-Should be around in the future for rebuilds

Negatives
-Pillow ball mounts
-11k front and 11k rear springs???


Stance
Positives
-Proper rubber mounts
-Swift springs in any rate without having to purchase additional springs
-Relatively fair price

Downsides:
-Rebuilds for years to come?
-Quality of the shock valving? I come from the e36 M3 world where Bilstein, Koni, and AST are the big players. I have never heard of a DG5 coilover, let alone if they are on par with the big names.

I know the Ohlins will be a wonderful shock able to handle double duty however are they worth $1k more? From all the research pillow ball mounts will add NVH. I don't mind a small amount, just do not want to turn the FD into a rattle can. I have only experienced pillow ball mounts on a civic race car thus could not attest to where the added NVH was coming from Lastly, the Ohlins come standard with 11kg front and 11kg rear springs. This seems odd as all the research I have read, including Howard's threads, indicate we should follow the stock setup with respect to a similar split in spring rate. Looks like I would also need to purchase additional rates to test.

I am also researching if the stance top mounts will fit on the Ohlins.

GoodfellaFD3S

iTrader: (213)

At that price point I highly recommend you consider Zeals. Myself and Scrub run them on track and they've been phenomenal. Plus, they can be serviced within the USA.

There's nothing wrong with upper pillowball mounts and stiff springs, especially if paired with a high-quality damper. I run 12k/10k and Dan has 14k/12k and neither of us plan to change anytime soon

PM Miata_MX5 here on the forum, he works for Zeal and has been very helpful in the past

ARD T2

iTrader: (22)

The Stance XR is a custom valveable and serviceable unit in the USA. Stance just got their shock dyno to and I believe they are in your Chicago area. They are currently in the process of getting the tooling to valve the XR's here in the states as well. In regards to testing the valving of that particular coilover you can see that on site over there. The units are completely hand assembled, the casing is honed, tolerances are meticulously measured. a lot of what you will find with the Zeal coilover that I to have on all my retired projects. This unit is made and assembled in Japan. It is their flagship single adjustable.

I currently have them in 12/10 format and will have the custom 10/8 setups in a month.

Alternatively, if you're looking for a sub $1500.00 budget coilover that is also built to the desires and demands of the masses on the board I have spent several months working on a digressively valved, longer stroke, 10/8 Stance GR+ coilover. With standard stance springs it should retail between $1600 and $1650.00. I'm considering making it standard with Swift springs, but that might increase the cost more than I'd like.

Other than that Zeal is the only other damper I would suggest in the springs rates people are asking for.

Thanks, Rishie

ARD T2

iTrader: (22)

If you want the 12/10 i'll give you an uber spanking deal.

GodSquadMandrake

Ohlins hands down. I wouldn't put those in the same category as the others. It's lucky that they are under $5,000. As far as Ohlins go it's a very good deal. I believe they are actually manufactured by Yamaha to Ohlins specifications.

purerx7

iTrader: (61)

I have a set of great condition Ohlins PCVs with an extra set of springs and only 3500 street miles on them for $1450, shoot me a PM if you are interested.

ptrhahn

iTrader: (9)

Agreed. High end suspension engineers (for stuff like Moton, Penske) will tell you that a great deal of the energy that goes into shock tuning is for that first 1/8 of travel. You wanna do that with the expensive valving you paid for, or with rubber?

ChipsMotorsports

iTrader: (4)

I went with Ohlins Road and Track and swift springs. My next down choice wold have been Stance.

ARD T2

iTrader: (22)

Agreed, Ohlins/Moton/Penske are in a totally different category and price range. I don't compare those to the Zeal/Stance/Cusco/HKS price ranges.

Rishie

Brekyrself

iTrader: (30)

What rate swift springs did you go with? Did you try the Ohlins with the factory 11k front and rear?

ARD T2

iTrader: (22)

We are swift distributor but at the same time Touge Factory in Chicago might even have them in stock if you need a good local source. Talk to Scott.

Rishie

ChipsMotorsports

iTrader: (4)

Ohlins recommends no more than 30% spring increase with the stock coilovers that will make it 14k F 14k R.

I went with re-valved Ohlins so i can run 18k F 18k R, do to monster rims and tires
3 rotor up front with 19x9 244/35/19 and 19x12 335/30/19 lol

Miata_mx5

A set of race ZEAL Super Function XRs fully optioned out with Staubli quick disconnectors, 30 x 30 way remote adjustment reservoirs, and everything will run you $6000-$8000. A bit out of the $2000 dollar price bracket.

That said, we still use our ZEAL Components in motorsports worldwide and dare I say offer the most amount of quality options for the Japanese cars. At least all of the ZEAL/ENDLESS stuff is still made in Japan also. No outsourcing here.

ZEAL products are available through AutoRnD as well

GodSquadMandrake

Please the jealous is already high in this thread lol

Brekyrself

iTrader: (30)

I'm going to order the Ohlins on Tuesday from Michael at Improved Racing.

Look's like I'll also pick up a set of swift springs, 10k front and 8k rear. When dropping the rear down to 8k from 11k, will it be necessary to go with a taller spring to compensate for the softer rate? Once I find the spec's on the Ohlins springs, free height and ID, I'll send you over a PM for a quote.

Thanks all and I'll be sure to report back with a proper review.

ChipsMotorsports

iTrader: (4)

Ohlins spring sizes
65mm ID
200mm Fronts
180mm rears
Get them from
https://www.good-win-racing.com/mazd...arg=secure%3d1
2852.00 shipped
Hope that helps...
Chip U

Brekyrself

iTrader: (30)

Just put in the order with Improved Racing this morning. What is everyone's thoughts on the spring rates of 11k front and 11k rear that come stock with the coilovers?

Mazda from the factory has more spring in the front just as most aftermarket coilover's do. Reading Howard's threads around motion ratio's etc, would it be more optimal to swap in 10k front 8k rear springs? I am running stock 94 sways however do have the thicker 93 rear bar I may put on.

Brekyrself

iTrader: (30)

Made some progress the last few days.

First got all the arms back on with new powerflex bushings.



The build quality is top notch.





Yes pillowball mounts however they are easily replaceable. The manual even suggests changing them at the 20,000km rebuild.

Finished up installing all the coilovers at the Ohlins suggested spring preload and body length. Still need to swap the diff bushings to Powerflex at which point I'll drop it down and adjust the ride height. Corner balance and alignment is set for Tuesday. I am anxious to see how tail happy the car will be with the same spring rate front and rear. I swapped in the thicker 93 (17.3mm) rear sway bar however may quickly go back to the stock 94 (13.8mm)


A side note about the Powerflex steering rack bushings. The driver side bushing needs modification to fit correctly. Without it, here is what it fits like.



By comparing the stock bushing and the Powerflex you can see the stock bushing's sides are rounded where as the Powerflex bushing is squared off.



The rack is machined to accept the rounded edges thus the Powerflex will not fit correctly. Quick work with the dremel and it fits like it should. I thought at first the wider stub on the Powerflex bushing was causing it to not sit completely flush with the rack thus trimed it to match the stock bushings pyramid shape. Trimming the stub did nothing however I am not sure if it will be required once the bushing is rounded off correctly.

Additionally I have no clue what rear sway bar Powerflex designed their bushings for. They list them as 18mm however are too large for the 93 17.3mm rear sway.

Brekyrself

iTrader: (30)

Wow......

That about sums up the difference in going from stock 68k bushings to all new Powerflex bushings and of course Ohlins coilovers. I can not believe the difference, its something everyone needs to expierence.

Here's my corner balance and alignment sheet. The cross weights were within 8lbs of each other to begin with so no corner balancing was required?



Ride height is set at ~25.25 from the ground to fender lip. This is actually the outcome by following Ohlins instructions on shock length while assembling.

I can't wait to get more seat time and get out on a track next month. The 11k springs are much stiffer than stock however so far very streetable. This may be due to the fact I am still running the stock wheels and I'll be sure to report feedback once going up to 18's with 35 series sidewalls.

1bigfella

Thanks for all the info, keep it coming. Let us know if the mods improved your track times.

Cheers Jason

Eiji

iTrader: (1)

Just wondering how the Ohlins are feeling now given some time? The 11k springs aren't too harsh on the street and performed well on the track (if you got the chance to go)?

I'm also keen on a set but rather worried about the 11k springs being far too stiff for the street.

Brekyrself

iTrader: (30)

I won't be able to make it out on the track until next month however a friend convinced me to do an autox on the 31st.

Chicago roads are terrible thus I do feel the 11k rates may be too stiff for streets around me. More importantly before I swap any rates I want to see how it performs where these shocks are inteded to be, on the track.

I have the feeling it will be tail happy thus if it is I will start with swapping in the thinner 94 rear sway. If this still does not do the trick I'll go with 10k front and 8k rear springs next season.

Eiji

iTrader: (1)

Have you tried playing with the damper settings at all?

Other people have said setting the damper setting all the way to softest has improved the ride somewhat, but then some people have also said even at the hardest setting its not hard enough for the track...

It's all very abstract and subjective unfortunately.

shineautoproject

iTrader: (11)

I think Rishie made an awesome choice providing coilovers with Swift Springs. Most wouldn't take the extra effort in getting new springs (since coilovers already come with standard springs) unless they are shopping for different rates.

i have swift springs on my buddy club coilovers and they gave a vast improvement over the standard springs they came with. I've been told you can't go wrong with Hyperco's or Swift springs.


As far as high end suspension goes. If you're going to spend the money, I highly suggest you go all out and get a 2 way adjustable coilover. One where the compression and rebound can be adjusted independently. I find it hard for a single adjustable, regardless of how high end it is, to come anywhere near a 2 way adjustable if you are looking for precision control and comfort control.

I have a Lotus Exige that comes with single adjustable bilsteins. They were great, but i immediately jumped on a deal for a set of 2-way adjustable JRZ's. The moment I could adjust the rebound to be stiffer than the compression all around, you can feel a valued difference in comfortability and stability in weight transfer just from driving the street alone.

The person i purchased the JRZ's from recently had 2 way ohlins before the JRZ and his opinion was that the JRZ's performed "way better." i did not ask him details by what he meant. Take if for whatever its worth. I think he's shopping around for a set of quantums which have been valved and track tested for the Lotus extensively.


I'm surprised no one hear has mention quantums. Quantums are high end as well and I would put them right up there with JRZ's, without the JRZ price. They are used in Formula 1 as well. I am shopping for a set of 2 way quantums for my FD. If Rishie can get these here for 4k .. I'm game.

If you do a search on Ti Racing FD3S, they recently did 57 secs at Tsukuba Revspeed battle last december on what is virtually a street FD with 99 spec turbos doing about 330 rwhp. the car is equipped with quantums , but im sure Ti Racing had them valved to spec for them. I can try to find out more. 57 secs is pretty damn fast. for the longest time the Revolution FD3S was 56 secs on the same track.

I've been told to get the JRZ's since Im somewhat already familiar with them, but I would like to try out the Quantums. 57 secs on a street fd with moderate power is pretty impressive and enough proof for me to make a move. Now its all about price and getting the correct valving. I will try to find out what spring rates they were using.

Im sure there are alot of top brands out there with a proven reputation, but I prefer to go with a top brand that is proven specifically for our cars. At least i will know most of the homework has been done.

Ken

Brent Dalton

iTrader: (31)

Get a tripoint front sway bar and it will help out alot as well. I think your rears will be fine as long as your dampening is softer in the rear than the front.

If you are really interested in your shocks, you can get them dyno'd and get a "no ****" assessment of what they are doing and what your range of adjustment really is. There are alot of local motorcycle shops that have shock dyno's that can dyno them.