If I get a big brake kit for the front, can the front 4 piston calipers and rotors go on the rear? I understand that a custom braket may have to be made. I was just wondering cause I thought it would be weird to have humungous rotors in front and some teeny tiny stockers on the rear.

 

i have also thought about doing this. i think its a good idea since our stock fronts are so darn small. I think a brake proportioning valve might be in order. I would also would like to know if the stock master cylinder would be ok with such big calipers all the way around. for instance, is it going to change the travel on the brake pedal? are the master cyl and caliper volume raitos going to be conductive for high performance braking?

 

Watch the propotion - front brakes typical do 75% to 80% of the braking force, and this is why you have larger brakes up front.  Running larger brakes in back just adds unnecessary weight and money for almost no gain in braking performance.


-Ted

 

Well, what I'm trying to figure out is... With a big brake kit up front, you'd end up having like 95% braking up front. so to help the back out, take off the small rear brakes and replace them with the larger, original front calipers and rotors. you're front brakes will still be massive compared to the new rear rotors but this should help even things out a bit. if you keep the stock rear brakes with massive fronts, i don't think the best proportioning valve in the world will even things back out to 80/20. I can already lock up the fronts and in some cases the backs too. I only have 225's on now, but what happens when i get 265's all the way around. My stock brakes probably won't be able to lock them up. Therefore, i get bigger brakes. But why just the front. Don' t you want to increase braking all the way around? So get a big brake kit for the front and move the original fronts to the rear since they are bigger than the stock rear disks. Now there are big brakes front and rear and the car will stop better then if just having the front brakes replaced.

That was all I was wanting to know....can it "easily" be done. Is all you have to do is make a new bracket for the caliper? Do you need a larger master cylinder?

 

You bring up the other major point when talking about big brake upgrades - the tires.  If your tires will flat everytime you hit the brakes, why even bother?  Having big brakes will look cool and will get you the oooh's and aaaah's, but if your brakes easily overpower your tires, where's the practicality in it?  Answer?  There is none.

All your questions are valid - this is basically what we go through when trying to design a big brake kit.  You have a numbers of variables, and you need to find the limitations.  You can play with the...

brake master cylinder bore
brake caliper piston bore (front and rear)
proportioning valve (stock is sometimes built into the BMC)

If you can hit the right combination of parts, you've got a great kit in the making.  The hard part is to get the combination correct.  Testing a prototype brake kit can be hazardous to your health!

After going through testing of some prototype brake kits on the FC3S, I find them a bit underachieving.  The best braking I ever driven with was the stock FC3S brakes using upgraded brake pads - that's it.  The big brakes look to be a show-off upgrade for most buyers.

-Ted

 

Ted, i do a lot of open track events and i can only do about 2 laps on a 2 miles course untill my brakes are so far faded im hitting the brakes at the middle of the strights. I have some 'high performance' rotex street pads and im still using the rubber lines. I think the problem is the rubber lines, but the other FC's out there have stock lines, pads and dont have the problems like i do. Those guys are even faster then me out there! I also put fresh fluid in before every race, usually use motul.

any ideas what could be wrong?

 

you could be one the brakes too long maybe hitting them a little early and riding them longer to get your speed down. i tend to do that in my 1st gen race car cause i don't like slamming the brakes at the last possible moment. although mine don't get too hot because i have cooling ducts running to them.

my point was, when i upgrade my wheels and tires, my stock brakes don't stand a chance. and i'd rather have more than enough braking power than not enough. after only a few hard stops with my current brakes, they start to make sounds, coming from the pads maybe, sounds like i'm trying to stop with rocks as pads.

 

How about some more details about your existing brakes, what ist he condition?

I have no problems with the brakes on my car, i did an open lap session for 6 hours, many racers in the racing forum who lap 2nd gen rx-7 also have no problems with stock stuff. Perhaps trying out other names for brake pads will yeild better results then what you are getting.

 

Too much variables...

How much track experience do you have?  I mean seriously...
When I started doing driving events at NASA, I was seriously overusing the brakes.  Only lessons from experienced drivers will increase your speed and decrease your lap times.  Yes, it's a very humbling experience.

Some drivers like more brake on the track.  If you're going to be serious about these track events, I would address the rubber lines and brake pads.  We were using Cool Carbon (discontinued) brake pads on a 2600# FC chassis with a non-turbo 13B-REW only pumping out 130hp at the wheels.  My partner managed to get the car to run a sub 2:10 at Laguna Seca on street tires - I consider this pretty quick.  The car ran stock brake rotors and a crappy suspension (Tokico HP fronts, stock rears, cut ST springs in all 4 corners).

I have no idea how your track is, but if it's heavy braking, you might want to step up to Hawk Blues for brake pads (reasonably priced).  I prefer the Performance Friction stuff, but these pads are very hard to find (and pricey!).

Stainless steel brake lines are no excuse, as most complete kits are around $100.


-Ted

 

my car has 63,000 miles on it now. But its been doing the same thing since i got it at 50,000. I have the 4 piston calipers in front. When i got the car, i did a brake bleed that very day. I think its the first one it ever got. The front calipers dont have this hardware and i think because of that, they have always sqeeked a lot. The Rotex pads that i have are supose to be performance stuff, but i dont think they are to good. I had some performance frictions on a differnt car and those seemed much better. But then again, i dont think these pads are that bad either.
I have replaced the master cyl to see if thats a problem, but that was not the case.

It has always seemed that the rears where a little strong, maybe the fronts are binding? would it be a good idea to pop out a piston on them and see if its rusty or anything? Should i get thta hardware too?

 

OC, start with a known quality pad. I run Carbotech XPs on the track,I have never heard of anyone fading them on any street car. Next, run the motul 5.1, I would not recomend 600 for a street car, as it picks up moisture rather quickly(motul does not recomend it for the street either). That should cover it, I would run a lesser pad, say stock Mazda, or EBC greens in the back. This will give you close to proper biasing without a valve. Next, you can improve pedal feel, and response by installing SS lines. If your still having a problem, it is most likely your braking "style". Hope that helps, Carl.
Ted, in your experience what brakes would you run with 12" slicks? I have been running stockers with XPs, and Motul with 235 V700 tires, but my new combo is 10.6" slicks in the front, and 12.2" slicks in the rear. Any experience? Thanks, Carl