So over the last two years iv changed tons of parts in my 89 turbo pretty much everything except the Apexi power FC i had when it was stock, since then i have a new streetported engine, 340lph fuel pump 2x 1600cc 2x 720cc injectors, FMIC new Garrett GT35 external wastegate, a dual stage turbosmart boost controller and a full 3 inch all the way exhaust as well as other mods (brakes,susp,clutch etc.)

within the next couple weeks it will be time to fire it up for the first time and my question is...What do i do? I really wanna break it in slowly and thoroughly, but i dont want to drive it without somebody going through my Power FC and making proper adjustments, do you need to do that on the dyno? or can somebody just do that by idling and revving up a bit in the driveway? Would you suggest as soon as i start the car, make sure there are no leaks or fires haha then put it on a trailer straight to the dyno, or, any other alternatives you guys have experienced?

Thanks this is my first heavily modified car and first time tuning and dynos have been in the picture and im just looking to do things right the first time. Any help would be greatly appreciated

Thanks

 

You will need to update the map so that it reflects the correct injectors and any timing changes due to porting. You don't *need* to go on a dyno for the break in tune, but you really want somebody competent to make your map. I'm not a tuner so I can't give accurate advice on the subtleties of building your map...

I would def be sure that you have cranked the motor over (without firing) properly before you try yo start it yo be sure you've got good oil pressure and movement. Fire her up and let it idle for a while, verify None of your fluids are leaking and that you won't overheat...

During your break in miles just be sure NOT to hammer them all out in one go (road trip style) since the full heat cycles (12 hours between trips to cool down) help as much as pure mileage..

Sadly I've become rather familiar with breaking in fresh rebuilds over the years

 

Thank you what engine management system do you use? I have the Power FC with the commander but im tossing the idea around about getting the FC datalogit

 

Another question is even if i just had the controller would a professional tuner still be able to tap into the advance tuning ability that the FCdatalogit offers?Like still plug a laptop to it? or would he only be able to use the parameters and tiny screen on the commander?

 

I used to have a PFC, sold that janx though... I'm in the process of doing a rebuild/refresh, when the engine goes back in I'll be using a Life Racing (F88RS) ECU.

In order to do an in depth tune on a PFC you NEED to utilize a Datalogit. You can make minor adjustments using the Commander, but the quality will be nowhere near what you're looking for. For an analogy, using the Commander would be like a kindergartner finger painting, where as using the datalogit would be like a High School Senior's art project. The difference in detail and quality will be easily visible.

Any tuner who takes your money for a map should have their own datalogit, if they ask you to provide them with one just turn around and walk away...

Where are you located at? We may be able to help point you in a good direction for mapping..

 

Well im in Alberta Canada

 

How close to Calgary are you? I would get in contact with REC (rotaryengine.com | Rotary Engine Specialists | Mazda Performance | RX7 Specialties), they are out of Calgary. I don't know if they do mapping, but they are REALLY good with engine components, I think it's safe to say that they should be local(ish) to you and will likely be willing to help point you in the right direction for a smooth start up an break-in =)

 

ya ive actually sourced most of my parts from Adam at REC but ya they don't do any tuning hes pointed me to Vex another Calgary shop but they seem to want me to get into a Haltech as its a very popular system for their mainly supra, gtr and subaru clients, but you have definatly cleared some things up for me thanks il find a reputable place in Calgary to help me out

 

Honestly going Haltech is NOT a bad decision to make... The PFC is/was good for what it was, but it's very limited when compared to todays standards. Haltech is very good as a middle ground "hobby" level ECU, it's more capable than the cheap ****, but not as expensive as the higher end units. You could pick up a PS1k to run a basic setup, get the flying lead built into a new harness, and you'll have SUCH a better/safer ECU package then you would by just throwing a PFC onto an old OEM harness.

Trust me, there is a reason I sold my PFC

 

I should of copyrighted that term.

 

Don't fret, I'll be paying you one way or the other (gunna need connectors, IAT sensors, and coils before this build is done)

 

The hardest part is getting it to drive "normal" and for keeping your motor together it's getting the boosted fueling safe as weather changes.

 

ya? i think il try this apexi out for now but my next big investment could potentially be a haltech or the adaptronic unit that turbosource is selling. what is all required when switching to a haltech do you have to rewire the entire engine bay? if thats required it may not be a bad idea to get it since the wiring is all 25 years old haha

 

You would need to rewire the engine bay, and terminated the ends of the long flying lead harness( with pins/terminals).

You can do the same with the universal Adaptronic ECUs;

Adaptronic Universal Select Series

 

Thanks Elliot by the way the wastegate and miscellaneous other bits arrived today and look great!

and to go with the painting reference the PFC would be a high school student whereas the adaptronic unit would be a masterpiece from an acclaimed renaissance artist.

 

I don't think I would go THAT far

I'm no tuner, nor do I have hands on experience with a wide range of aftermarket ECU's... But I'd say that Adaptronic is good for what it is (a modern entry/mid level ECU) but it's not really the cream of the crop. Pectel would be up there, higher end Life Racing/Syvecs units (F90/S12) would be up there, surprisingly the new AEM Infinity seems REALLY good, I'm sure the Haltech Elite will be up there, along with Motec's top offering.. Even so, you can spend $5,000-$10,000 on ONLY the ECU (not counting the $2k+ for a good harness) but still come out with a crap running car..

An ECU is a tool, nothing more. If the person programming the ECU isn't capable then the tune will suck. ECU's have their limits, but so do tuners. If you get a damned good tuner who REALLY knows the ECU then you will have a much better end result than if you have some super computer, but the guy tuning it is a moron. The same is true where if you have a good tuner but the ECU isn't all that capable, you want a capable ECU and a competent tuner in order to take full advantage of your setup.

 

this is a question aimed more at the shops who install and rewire new EMS systems, how much does it run a guy? on average

 

You can probably find a hack to do a job for a few hundred. On an FD with full integration of all the stock elements such as AC, gauges, etc., you're in the $500-1000 and up range. Considering the time to do it properly, that's cheap labor.

On the low end of good options, you can find a custom built replacement loom in the $650 and up range. This would allow you to install it yourself, saving some labor cost. Install should consist of nothing more than unplugging your emissions harness and plugging in the new harness. On the high end, I just completed a full race FD and did a full integration with a LOT of additional sensors, traction control, 3-axis G sensor, DBW, etc., and it was an 80 hour job. Not cheap.

 

has anybody bought the haltech system from mazdatrix where it says the harness comes pre setup with all the stock plug ins already installed and ready to go, that way its easy enough to do yourself. is it really as good as it sounds? can you really just get it and plug all the necessary new wire in?

 

The harness Mazdatrix advertises is Haltech generic rotary harness. Its built to work with S5 sensors, EV1 injectors, and stock, LS1, or Haltech/Bosch ignition. If you're using alternate injectors or if your installing into an FD, you'll need to modify the brand new and expensive harness.

If you're looking for a full replacement harness built to suit your particular application there are other options available at similar or lower pricing.

 

There is nothing wrong with Apexi PowerFC as with many other ECU out there, but only when you know how to tune them.

If you need an ECU get one which is supported by your local tuner. Nothing less and nothing more.

Just my 2p.

 

Chris ( C. Ludwig) who posted makes a nice harnesses, I highly recommend his. He can make them for the 420 or 440 wire in models.

 

Ok here is a MAP sensor question early on in my build I threw my map sensor out for no apparent reason now I need a new one I remember it being a denso are they fairly common? Is it an aftermarket piece? Come stock on the car? When I bought the car it was slightly modded so I don't know

 

Better question, is the stock S5 MAP sensor mounted on the strut tower, a denso unit by chance?

 

Your stock sensor and the S5 are probably Denso. Just a guess. You can use any sensor with the PFC. You just need to enter the proper calibration in the Datalogit. Many upgrade to the GM 3-bar anyway. That would probably be the least expensive option, unless you can find a good used sensor for cheap.