Turblown

iTrader: (12)

I have never seen too much oil pressure kill a journal bearing turbo. Usually what happens is the oil just leaks past the compressor seal. Probably oil contamination is what did it, was it installed on a fresh engine? I generally don't use a restrictor with journal bearing turbos, just make sure you're crankcase is well vented and your return line is flowing down.

TweakGames

iTrader: (3)

Weird ok, so then what killed this turbo? When it was starting to smoke, I did see smoke and oil leaking from the hot side where it connects to the center. Smoke and such would come out at random times. I added a .0625 restrictor and the smoking decreased but did not go away.

Here are some videos of the turbo. ( I think you have to open it in WMP or VNC, but they work. lol) (Also you have to click "Save file to your PC: click here" on the bottom to save the file.)

http://www.2shared.com/file/5200192/...09_221048.html 60 M
http://www.2shared.com/file/5200246/...09_220944.html 30 M

You can see the turbo spark on the right side of the housing, and the housing has scratch marks. Also you can see the blades move up and rattle after I rev the engine a little.

It still boosts fine (full 11 psi at 3,500 rpm) and holds it fine till redline. :/ I don't know what happened here. I don't think oil contamination did it, it started to smoke about a week after I changed my oil from 10-30w dino oil, to royal purple I think 10-50w. I can go check the bottles I have if that makes a difference.

Thanks for the help.
~Tweak

Turblown

iTrader: (12)

Taking it apart will give you a good idea of what happened. Is it oil cooled only? They will start to leak oil when you knock the bearings out, the shaft will be moving around and the compressor/turbine oil seals won't seal in the chra grooves. If you plan on sending it out for a rebuild, we could do it and I can tell you what I find. I didn't watch any of the videos, but is the turbo drain doing a 90?( seen it before on fc hks cast iron manifolds)

TweakGames

iTrader: (3)

Nope, oil going in on top, oil coming out on bottom. The drain goes strait down, then does a sharp turn to the engine, but I don't think it's 90. At some point is has to flatten out though because the oil return comes out level if I remember correctly. It is oil and water. I am not using a cast iron manifold although I do have one for sale. Well, I might have to send it out to you for a rebuild. If I take it apart is there anything I can ruin, or is it one of those things that as long as I keep all the pieces and then send it to you, everything will be fine? lol. Not sure what I would be looking for if I took it apart, I guess broken seals?

TweakGames

iTrader: (3)

I contacted Precision turbo, they really didn't want me to use a restrictor for some reason.

"I would not recommend using a restrictor. Your oil pressure is kind of high. Some of my customers use a -3 oil line to limit oil flow. We do not officially recommend this, but it does work for some people. The best solution is to go with a ball bearing turbo. It does not require as much oil and a restrictor can be used."

So I guess their solution is to buy a new turbo. :P

I was thinking that maybe my return line was causing the problem, maybe not flowing down enough? I have a 90* fitting coming right off the turbo. Also I just noticed my turbo isn't clocked perfectly strait, is that a big deal? Just trying to make sure I don't blow another turbo in 4 months of 11 psi boosting lol.

Here are some pictures of the setup. I was trying to focus on the oil lines and such. Let me know if you see anything I should change or check out.











The pictures are kinda deceiving, the return line doesn't "step down" it just turns to the right then back left again to go into the engine. There is a point close to the engine where it isn't going down. It is actually going up hill just a liiiitttlllee bit. What cha think? I'm not sure how I would solve that... BDC's goes up a lot more than mine does, and he doesn't have any issues.

http://bdc.cyberosity.com/v/Technica...alled.jpg.html

Thanks
~Tweak

arghx

iTrader: (3)

I'll see if I can take a picture off mine tomorrow... I used a 45 degree angle at the bottom of the turbo.

was this a real garrett T04S?

TweakGames

iTrader: (3)

I would assume so..... ? How would I be able to tell if its a fake? It came in the popular garret boxes, I got it from http://cheapturbo.stores.yahoo.net/garrettto4s601.html, they seem legit (but their customer service SUCKS). I fear now that because it only had a 30 day warranty that maybe it wasn't a real garret turbo.

arghx

iTrader: (3)

My old T04S clearly said "Garrett" on the front compressor housing. But it had a polished compressor housing, so maybe all those were marked but a lot of unpolished ones weren't or something. I mean the outfit seems legit...

I boosted about 18psi for a bit over 2000 miles on my then-new oil cooled T04S and it didn't have any problems. I had a restricter in the inlet from day one. My car has an FD oil pressure regulator.

TweakGames

iTrader: (3)

Yeah, mine has some weird *** front wheel nut also.... omg I think I have been rocking a crappy/ebay turbo this whole time.

arghx

iTrader: (3)

here is a pic of my old T04S when it was new:



here is my T04S vs the T67 I am going to put on my new setup (T04R)


and I hate to say it, but ATP turbo, an authorized Garrett distributor, has a T04S for $888

http://www.atpturbo.com/Merchant2/me...egory_Code=TBN

Turblown

iTrader: (12)

You were not rocking an ebay turbo. I know where your turbo originated and it just has a billet bullet compressor nut. Our shop is within 20 minutes of theirs...

Unless your return line is kinked I doubt thats the problem. What kind of egts were you seeing? Were you beating the **** out of this thing; like doing 4th gear pulls daily..

I still bet its oil contamination.

TweakGames

iTrader: (3)

Thank you for the pictures. Yes I know that ATP had the turbo, but if you re-look at the receipt, mine was Originally $818, then I got an upgraded water center, and some accessories making it more. Was a little weird that they needed to make a CNC v-band and have it welded on. I'm pretty sure they screwed me on that, but nothing I can do now. Maybe I should have got it all through ATP, not like it could have lasted any less time lol.



My EGT sensors don't seem to be working much any more. I think the little tip melted away. :

I'm not sure its possible to beat the **** out of it at 11 psi, but, I was thinking about it today on my trip home, I was not even able to boost the turbo till BDC came out and tuned my car. (10-3-08) So really only like 4-5 months, of north west WINTER driving. lol If you have ever been to the northwest during winter you would know I would not be able to fully boost without eating ditch. I did 0 drift or autox during that time (lol again the whole winter / snow thing), so the hardest thing I did was 3 dyno pulls.

Would you recommend I change my oil every 1,500 miles instead of 2,500? Most of my miles are highway going from Pullman to Seattle.

TweakGames

iTrader: (3)

Anyways, here is my new turbo. I had some time to take measurements. According to http://www.fc3spro.com/TECH/TURBO/tmodels.html it looks like I have something close to HKS T04R.



So my PT67 is kinda like the T04R but smaller hot side. Should be fun. I was really disappointed to find out the PT67's hot side isn-t P-trim. As you can see this one is not divided and my manifold is divided. Will that cause any long term issues? Also the PT67's Hot side housing won't fit at all on the T04S. It's to small. :/

PT67 with it's stock housing.


PT67 with my .84 divided P-Trim.



I thought it was interesting to see the difference between the stock specs of the T04S and how far MY T04S has wore down lol.

Here are just some more pictures I took. I tried to measure things, but I might have done it incorrectly.

TweakGames

iTrader: (3)

Turblown

iTrader: (12)

Thats your problem, egts too high. You fried the chra, and you're going to fry your new turbo too.

TweakGames

iTrader: (3)

Hmmmm... the first turbo had water cooling also... you would think that would have helped? Would explain why my turbo was glowing red lol. Should I retard the timing a few degress? What would you recommend?

mort2002

iTrader: (1)

well i know my hybrid glows red too, but i also monitor my EGTs and havent had any problems yet...

TweakGames

iTrader: (3)

Oh crap. I just had an idea. If you have a restrictive exhaust your EGTs go up correct? Well I just installed an apexi ATS exhaust silencer .... a little over a month ago.... :/ Did that raise my EGTs and roast my turbo?

classicauto

iTrader: (3)

one of my friends from whitby does observe a slight rise in EGT's when he installs the butt plug. Is that the type of silencer you're talking about? Or some type of muffler?

By slight I mean ~75F post turbo.

What kind of EGT probes were they and how long were they in there? I have ran some pretty high EGT's at times getting different thigns sorted out and have yet to fry a probe. But my guess is anything that can melt away an insturment designed for 2000F enviroment must be pretty effing hot!

arghx

iTrader: (3)

didn't you have a crush bent downpipe or something? talk about backpressure and high EGT's...

and here is a pic of my new oil return line for my T04R. Coming off the bottom of the turbo (you can't see it) is a 45 degree fitting with male 10AN on each side. Then the 10AN hose has straight fittings on each end. The CHRA is relatively vertical.

TweakGames

iTrader: (3)

I was running this Apexi ATS active silencer. It pretty much makes the air go from 4 inches down to the size a little more then a quarter. (The air goes through the small hole in the center.) It's an active silencer, so when the exahst pressure gets higher from high RPMS or boost, it opens up the outside ring and lets it flow more (and get loud). I can DEFINITLY understand if this thing made my EGTs get higher. LOL I just remembered also lol, I fixed a hole in my muffler that was letting a good chunk of air get out the bottom of my muffler without having to go through the silencer, adding more restriction. :/



Yes, it is a crush bent down pipe, but not THAT crushed, or bent, and it is still 3 inches, so it's down to like I would assume 2.7 inches in the bends?

I have the TeamRip EGT, that everyone else has been using. I guess they are not "melted" but the tip of the probe is missing and there was a chip missing out of the unit. It looks like one of the units might work, I will hook it back up and look at my EGTs after I get the new turbo on.



Can you tell by looking at pictures of exhaust sleeves if something is wrong?





Thank you for the picture of your oil drain. That looks like a very smooth run. Your setup looks nice in general.

classicauto

iTrader: (3)

nice job on fragging that probe

What kind of EGT's was it running under cruise etc? (while you could still measure them....)

TweakGames

iTrader: (3)

Lol, for those keeping track, I've got a cracked front apex seal slowly getting worse and worse. Mid full 11 psi, 6000 rpm drift this last weekend one of my couplers exploded and I think caused me to go super lean. (I think I went super lean because, my haltech is set to only turn on the secondary injectors at .7 psi, so I was running redline with only my 550 primary injectors, and I don't see how I could have possibly had enough fuel. :/ )

Anyways, off to most likely a half bridge unless I can get BDC to do a semi-p port. At least the turbo will spool sooners.

~Tweak

arghx

iTrader: (3)

I thought Haltech could stage based on duty cycle?

TweakGames

iTrader: (3)

Nope, looks like (at least from what I can tell in the injector setup on my e11) that you can only set the staging point by what "bar" or what vacuum or boost point.