JHew84

iTrader: (9)

Alright, after a long period of buying and installing things for my new engine and single turbo swap I'm finally getting ready to crank it over for the first time, except it won't fire. Have fuel, plenty of pressure, strong cranks, but no spark.

I relocated the coil packs next to the brake booster on the fire wall, but the ground is good (checked) and the harness is still getting power. All the connectors are plugged into the correct coil pack. Ignitor is grounded properly and receiving power.

I put one of the plugs on a wire and watched for spark, nothing, put a tester inside the coil pack itself, nothing. These coil packs were the same ones that were on the car when it ran last and it had plenty of spark, granted they've been sitting for a year or so but I didn't think that would really make ALL THREE go bad at once?

Is there something stupid I'm missing? I've gone over all the connectors a couple times now and don't see any that are not plugged in, especially anything related to the coils.

I've searched around but every ones problems seem to be related to things I've already checked. Harness is good, ignitor is good, grounds are good, still not getting any spark ...

Any help is appreciated.

arghx

iTrader: (3)

check all fuses

JHew84

iTrader: (9)

I did, twice actually , and my friend looked them over as well to see if I missed one possibly...

Would that really cause this issue? I have power everywhere up to the coils, then nothing, seems like if it was a blown fuse I would be losing power somewhere else before the coils? I'm still finding it hard to believe that all of these coils are bad at the same time, otherwise I'd be looking for a new set of coils.


Also, as I didn't really take this into consideration earlier, my tachometer is not moving when I turn the motor over. I'm no longer at my garage otherwise I'd double check to make sure the CAS connectors are correct, but I remember scrutinizing over that detail when I reinstalled everything so I'm pretty sure they are correct.

And because I neglected to mention it in the first post, I am running a PFC. I am also running brand new NGK plugs, and brand new wires. I did hook up my old wires to test though (just in case the new wires were junk) and came up with the same results. The ignition system has been untouched since the car was last run and it worked fine then.

Dudemaaanownsanrx7

iTrader: (23)

so u get no spark on any of the wires?

JHew84

iTrader: (9)

Correct

Smitter

it sounds like the Crank Angle Sensors. The tach needle should bounce and u should see engine rpm on your commander if the CAS is working correctly

catch-22

iTrader: (2)

1+ for checking your CAS sensors the grey one caused it for me. i had bare wires touching each other!!!

JHew84

iTrader: (9)

well I know the harness for the CAS is good, but these aren't the same sensors that were used before, they came on the motor I purchased, so that is a possibility. I might try to go look at it today, I'm hoping I just put the connectors on backwards, but we'll see.

I didn't check the PFC for an RPM signal since I wasn't thinking about it at the time, but I do know the tach worked before tearing everything apart so I'm sure there was none anyway.

Thanks for the replies, I will try to get out there today, if not then friday for sure, and check it out.

JHew84

iTrader: (9)

Well I went out and swapped the known good CAS's over from my old motor, no dice. The tach wasn't moving either, along with no signal to the PFC. Then I plugged the EGI fuse back in (I was always under the impression it only cut power to the fuel?) and the tach had a slight movement to it and the PFC was registering RPM... still no spark...

Any ideas?

Dudemaaanownsanrx7

iTrader: (23)

The egi cuts both. Did you recheck all the wires for spark? How did you test them?

JHew84

iTrader: (9)

I checked both primaries as I've read multiple times now the car should start and idle with only the primaries firing. I put a plug on the wire and held it next to a ground, nothing.

Dudemaaanownsanrx7

iTrader: (23)

you should check all of them for spark. it could just be one one of the wires at the short coil harness connection. The "primary" or more commonly referred to as the leading, both connect to the same coil. so if one of the wires connecting to it is bad then neither leading plugs will fire. The trailing have separate connections so usually a bad connection would only effect one spark plug's firing. it's a better to test everything when trying to run down these gremlins.

For instance I had a bad connection at the short harness and both leadings wouldnt fire. but i still had trailings. The next thing i did was swap around the small wires that plug into the coil from the known working to the known bad. when i did this the problem switched sides so i knew it was not the spark plugs, or the coils but something before that. Hope this all makes sense

JHew84

iTrader: (9)

I didn't test at the harness for spark, I did check for power though and that was fine on all three plugs. How do I test for spark at the harness?

Dudemaaanownsanrx7

iTrader: (23)

no test for spark just as u were, I'm just saying check the other 2 wires. Then go from there if u have no spark at those either.

The short harness i did a continuity test on to determine where the problem was.

JHew84

iTrader: (9)

Ah ok, I already tested for spark at all four wires before and none tested positive. I don't think the CAS's that came with the motor were bad as it was pulled from a running car, and that is the only thing I have changed since testing the other wires.

I also did a continuity test on the short harness and all 3 legs of it tested fine, wasn't sure if there was another test that could be run on that part of the harness for signal or something.


I really don't know much about electronics though and am working on getting a friend out to look it over who does. At this point it almost has to be something related to the wiring harness I'm thinking.

Dudemaaanownsanrx7

iTrader: (23)

also, if you're doing a lot of the work by yourself you should save yourself some hassle and run a + power wire with a switch going from the engine bay to the starter solenoid. its very easy to tap into the main lug on the fuse block or battery or anything with +12 v. Then on the solenoid just use a female to 2 male connector so that you can connect both the new switch as well as retain the ignition switch inside the car.

This was the BEST mod I ever did when trying to trouble shoot problems exactly like this

Dudemaaanownsanrx7

iTrader: (23)

You tested the wires with the EGI out so of course they won't fire. After plugging that back in it should be tested at all 4 again.

The only other test I can think of is the one in the FSM about checking the resistance of the coils. But this would be after testing for spark on all 4 again.. The odds of all the coils going bad at once seems slim. Your main fuse is good right? I imagine so since u said u had power at the coils.

JHew84

iTrader: (9)

Initially all four were tested with the EGI relay in, then I could smell fuel so I pulled it under the assumption I could still test for spark with it out and NOT keep flooding the engine. This is when I "noticed" that the tach wasn't getting any signal, then I discovered the EGI kills everything when I plugged it back in later lol.

I'll have to check the FSM for that test the next time I'm out there. I'm basically just trying to get as many things as possible to look over when I have the opportunity to work on it again (gotta love busy schedules!). So any other ideas I'm certainly open and able to try.

Also I'm not by myself most of the time, otherwise I definitely would have rigged up a remote ignition to run these tests on my own. This entire time I've had a friend with me to check for spark/turn the engine over when needed.

JHew84

iTrader: (9)

Just to update this my friend came over and ran some more tests. Still had continuity everywhere, coils checked out fine, CAS checked out fine, wiring harness' all checked out fine, but when he went to test the actual ignitor (something I had no idea how to do haha) he came to the conclusion it was shorted out.

From the wiring diagram he seemed pretty sure that the ignitor itself needs to be grounded to the chassis... anyone else with the coil relocation kit run into this problem? if so how did you fix it? He also said that the ground I had for the ignitor itself was indeed not good and could have been the cause of the ignitor going bad in the first place...

So I have a new ignitor on the way and hopefully that will fix the problem, it certainly explains the symptoms, I just wasn't aware how I had my grounds set up could have had this affect .