RX7Store.net Stage 3 Upgrade
07-04-12, 11:49 PM
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RX7Store.net Stage 3 Upgrade
The time has come the walrus said...to transition over to a single turbo setup for my 93. My current goal is a street-able, weekend road course track car, topping out at 450 horsepower. I'm currently running stock ports, so I don't know how reasonable that goal is just yet, but I'll take what I can get, and when needed I'll get her ported.
Right now I'm looking at the Stage 3 Power Upgrade through Rx7store.net. Here's what's included:
Racing Beat Dual Tip Exhaust (Already have this)
Apexi Power FC + Commander
Nippondenso Fuel Pump
Stainless Midpipe (I'd really like the resonated version, but I'm near deaf from my time in the Infantry anyways, so meh
)
Greddy Style Front Mount Intercooler
T04R Kit (Manifold, Tial 44mm Wastegate, 3" DP, all lines/fittings, with what looks like a choice of either a .84/1.00/1.15 A/R)
HKS Twin Power Ignition
and their Extreme Fuel System Upgrade (1680cc secondaries + secondary rail, Aeromotive FPR, all lines/fittings)
Total Price: $5,500.00 (I'll also be purchasing a 3 bar MAP sensor and HKS BOV separately.)
After gathering as much knowledge as my head can hold from the forums, I've got a few questions that I'm still trying to wrap my head around.
1.) Clutch - RX7store.net dyno'd the Stage 3 upgrade at 440hp @ 7.1k and 334 ft/lb @ about 6.6k. No other mods are listed, and I'm skeptical about the stock clutch being able to handle that kind of power/torque. I've read bad reviews on the single disc SPECs and slightly better (but not great) reviews on the ACT single discs. Stock clutch for these goals, bueno or no.
2.) Turbine A/R - I've just recently learned how to read compressor maps, but the T04R maps are hard to find. Any opinions on what A/R to run? I saw that tom94rx7 was running .96 A/R, and his power band/spool times looked great, although he was running a street port. Kudos to him for pushing the numbers he does!
3.) AF ratio - According to RX7.com, 1680 secondaries with the 550 primaries should support 538hp at the crank running at 80% duty cycle. I'll also be running the Nippon Denso fuel pump with the Aeromotive FPR. I'm not really that concerned, as I'll probably fall well short of my goal with stock ports, but I think this setup should be okay, but again opinions?
4.) Lastly, I'm currently running a 3" DP, custom intake, and RB exhaust, so I don't need the RB exhaust. Anyone have experience negotiating with their crew in terms of kits like this? I'd like to substitute something(s) of equal value to the exhaust in exchange. I figure they're probably selling it for a reduced kit cost of around $550 (versus $610) so what should I try to get in exchange? I'm thinking maybe an upgraded clutch, Profec B/AVC-R, or ??? What do you guys think? (assuming they're even willing to negotiate for a swap)
Just trying to iron out the last details, measure twice cut once and all of that. Any help, opinions, or advice would be greatly appreciated, thanks in advance for your time.
Right now I'm looking at the Stage 3 Power Upgrade through Rx7store.net. Here's what's included:
Racing Beat Dual Tip Exhaust (Already have this)
Apexi Power FC + Commander
Nippondenso Fuel Pump
Stainless Midpipe (I'd really like the resonated version, but I'm near deaf from my time in the Infantry anyways, so meh
)Greddy Style Front Mount Intercooler
T04R Kit (Manifold, Tial 44mm Wastegate, 3" DP, all lines/fittings, with what looks like a choice of either a .84/1.00/1.15 A/R)
HKS Twin Power Ignition
and their Extreme Fuel System Upgrade (1680cc secondaries + secondary rail, Aeromotive FPR, all lines/fittings)
Total Price: $5,500.00 (I'll also be purchasing a 3 bar MAP sensor and HKS BOV separately.)
After gathering as much knowledge as my head can hold from the forums, I've got a few questions that I'm still trying to wrap my head around.
1.) Clutch - RX7store.net dyno'd the Stage 3 upgrade at 440hp @ 7.1k and 334 ft/lb @ about 6.6k. No other mods are listed, and I'm skeptical about the stock clutch being able to handle that kind of power/torque. I've read bad reviews on the single disc SPECs and slightly better (but not great) reviews on the ACT single discs. Stock clutch for these goals, bueno or no.
2.) Turbine A/R - I've just recently learned how to read compressor maps, but the T04R maps are hard to find. Any opinions on what A/R to run? I saw that tom94rx7 was running .96 A/R, and his power band/spool times looked great, although he was running a street port. Kudos to him for pushing the numbers he does!
3.) AF ratio - According to RX7.com, 1680 secondaries with the 550 primaries should support 538hp at the crank running at 80% duty cycle. I'll also be running the Nippon Denso fuel pump with the Aeromotive FPR. I'm not really that concerned, as I'll probably fall well short of my goal with stock ports, but I think this setup should be okay, but again opinions?
4.) Lastly, I'm currently running a 3" DP, custom intake, and RB exhaust, so I don't need the RB exhaust. Anyone have experience negotiating with their crew in terms of kits like this? I'd like to substitute something(s) of equal value to the exhaust in exchange. I figure they're probably selling it for a reduced kit cost of around $550 (versus $610) so what should I try to get in exchange? I'm thinking maybe an upgraded clutch, Profec B/AVC-R, or ??? What do you guys think? (assuming they're even willing to negotiate for a swap)
Just trying to iron out the last details, measure twice cut once and all of that. Any help, opinions, or advice would be greatly appreciated, thanks in advance for your time.
07-05-12, 01:56 AM
#2
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My experience with their crew (rx7store) is that they will sell you items that they don't have in stock, and beat around the bush for the MONTHS it takes for the items to get on the shelf. I dropped $8k at rx7store.net once and it took me literally like 4 months to get my stuff. Half the guys would lie to me when I'd call and the other half wouldn't answer the phone. Also, if they don't specify that a part is genuine, assume it's not!
Personally I'd suggest you find another retailer, ESPECIALLY for the turbo kit!!! (Elliot at Turblown or Sean at A-spec are the go-to guys if you're looking for quality over quantity when it comes to singles)
As for your mods:
The stock clutch will not be able to handle that kind of power. A single disk clutch rated for the torque will def be able to handle it, but it will be heavy.
Turbine A/R is (as I understand it) a balancing act between how quickly your turbo will react/spool, and how long it will breath for before lowering your power in the higher rpms.
If you're buying new injectors anyway than you should probably just go with newer style EV14 based injectors, like the ID ones. 720cc/2000cc IDs will be MORE than enough fuel, but will still give you good drive-ability while just farting around town.
When you do your single conversion there is a bit more to consider (if you want to do it right) than just the turbo and intercooler. What all supporting mods do you currently have?
You're not likely to find ANY shop that will accept your used parts in exchange for a lower price on their new ones. Your best bet is to just sell off the old parts from your twins (DP, Intake, twins themselves, etc., etc) in order to recoup some of the costs.
Also, I would STRONGLY suggest you look into some form of Water Injection if I were you.
Personally I'd suggest you find another retailer, ESPECIALLY for the turbo kit!!! (Elliot at Turblown or Sean at A-spec are the go-to guys if you're looking for quality over quantity when it comes to singles)
As for your mods:
The stock clutch will not be able to handle that kind of power. A single disk clutch rated for the torque will def be able to handle it, but it will be heavy.
Turbine A/R is (as I understand it) a balancing act between how quickly your turbo will react/spool, and how long it will breath for before lowering your power in the higher rpms.
If you're buying new injectors anyway than you should probably just go with newer style EV14 based injectors, like the ID ones. 720cc/2000cc IDs will be MORE than enough fuel, but will still give you good drive-ability while just farting around town.
When you do your single conversion there is a bit more to consider (if you want to do it right) than just the turbo and intercooler. What all supporting mods do you currently have?
You're not likely to find ANY shop that will accept your used parts in exchange for a lower price on their new ones. Your best bet is to just sell off the old parts from your twins (DP, Intake, twins themselves, etc., etc) in order to recoup some of the costs.
Also, I would STRONGLY suggest you look into some form of Water Injection if I were you.
07-05-12, 02:18 AM
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In terms of supporting mods, the Power FC + Commander, HKS ignition, Nippondenso Fuel Pump with new secondary rail + injectors, and FMIC come with the stage 3 upgrade. I'm currently running a 3" catback, and the kit also comes with midpipe to open up the exhaust. WI is definitely in the future, but I was hoping to get away with at least 15psi before I needed it.
That's too bad that their customer service is so bad. I've heard similar things from other people as well, in terms of how long it takes to get through to them and get the parts that were ordered. I'll have to do some comparison shopping with A-spec and Turblown as well.
I guess I should have been a little more specific. I'm not trying to sell them my used RB exhaust, I just don't need the one that comes with the kit. I figured I'd try and convince them to give me something else of equal value instead of a second exhaust, like one of the single disc ACT clutches or a Profec B.
That's too bad that their customer service is so bad. I've heard similar things from other people as well, in terms of how long it takes to get through to them and get the parts that were ordered. I'll have to do some comparison shopping with A-spec and Turblown as well.
I guess I should have been a little more specific. I'm not trying to sell them my used RB exhaust, I just don't need the one that comes with the kit. I figured I'd try and convince them to give me something else of equal value instead of a second exhaust, like one of the single disc ACT clutches or a Profec B.
07-05-12, 08:13 AM
#4
Pistons are for pussy's
Weird. Just a month ago i made my first purchase with Jason and everything went smoothly. FMIC kit shipped in a day and the Fuel Kit which was backordered shipped 1 week later. Smooth and nice
To the OP. ACT Street/Strip or the 6-puck sprung will be enough to support 450whp as they support 410 and 500 lb/tq each.
To the OP. ACT Street/Strip or the 6-puck sprung will be enough to support 450whp as they support 410 and 500 lb/tq each.
07-06-12, 09:24 AM
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I think that I'll try and get them to replace the RB exhaust with a Profec B. That should even out the cost, and I feel it's a fair trade. Apart from the stage 3 package, I'll throw down for a 6-puck from ACT as well. Since I see different opinions of rx7store across the site, if I do end up going the rx7store route, I'll be sure and post a thorough write-up/review on both the ordering/purchase and the installation. I'm comfortable playing the guinea pig role.
I feel like I've mapped out everything correctly...I still just have that nagging "I left the iron on" feeling. The only thing I won't be purchasing off the bat will be a WI system. I'll monitor the intake temps and knock closely during tuning, and if they're cause for concern, I can opt-in for it at that point. Thanks for the advice thus far.
I feel like I've mapped out everything correctly...I still just have that nagging "I left the iron on" feeling. The only thing I won't be purchasing off the bat will be a WI system. I'll monitor the intake temps and knock closely during tuning, and if they're cause for concern, I can opt-in for it at that point. Thanks for the advice thus far.
07-06-12, 10:45 AM
#6
Add a water/meth kit and your goal of 450rwhp should be achievable around 17-18psi on pump gas and be reliable with a good tune. Id opt for the hi-flow cat as it really makes a big difference in the car stinking or not. Other than that,dont over think it. Looks like you have a good plan.
07-07-12, 11:18 AM
#7
I think that I'll try and get them to replace the RB exhaust with a Profec B. That should even out the cost, and I feel it's a fair trade. Apart from the stage 3 package, I'll throw down for a 6-puck from ACT as well. Since I see different opinions of rx7store across the site, if I do end up going the rx7store route, I'll be sure and post a thorough write-up/review on both the ordering/purchase and the installation. I'm comfortable playing the guinea pig role.
I feel like I've mapped out everything correctly...I still just have that nagging "I left the iron on" feeling. The only thing I won't be purchasing off the bat will be a WI system. I'll monitor the intake temps and knock closely during tuning, and if they're cause for concern, I can opt-in for it at that point. Thanks for the advice thus far.
I feel like I've mapped out everything correctly...I still just have that nagging "I left the iron on" feeling. The only thing I won't be purchasing off the bat will be a WI system. I'll monitor the intake temps and knock closely during tuning, and if they're cause for concern, I can opt-in for it at that point. Thanks for the advice thus far.
I think I have an email from you and will respond to that on Monday. We can also talk on the phone about the stage 3 setup. I have that on the site so customers can follow it as an upgrade path, but can swap out parts if you want to go a different route.
As djseven mentioned I would also go with a meth/water kit.
In terms of time it takes to ship all of those parts, a lot depends on availability which I try to give at the time of purchase. We don't make most of those parts so we are at the mercy of the distributer. Especially on a large order, just one part that is on backorder can hold things up.
As of now most of the stage 3 setup is available.
Jason
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07-10-12, 07:27 PM
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Kenseto,
I think I have an email from you and will respond to that on Monday. We can also talk on the phone about the stage 3 setup. I have that on the site so customers can follow it as an upgrade path, but can swap out parts if you want to go a different route.
As djseven mentioned I would also go with a meth/water kit.
In terms of time it takes to ship all of those parts, a lot depends on availability which I try to give at the time of purchase. We don't make most of those parts so we are at the mercy of the distributer. Especially on a large order, just one part that is on backorder can hold things up.
As of now most of the stage 3 setup is available.
Jason
I think I have an email from you and will respond to that on Monday. We can also talk on the phone about the stage 3 setup. I have that on the site so customers can follow it as an upgrade path, but can swap out parts if you want to go a different route.
As djseven mentioned I would also go with a meth/water kit.
In terms of time it takes to ship all of those parts, a lot depends on availability which I try to give at the time of purchase. We don't make most of those parts so we are at the mercy of the distributer. Especially on a large order, just one part that is on backorder can hold things up.
As of now most of the stage 3 setup is available.
Jason
Thanks everyone for the advice/opinions. Pending my work and laziness, I'll try and get a good write up with pics from start to finish.Kyle
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