Dietbudda

Good morning gentlemen, IT's been a while since i posted on the RX-7 forums since picking up my RX-8, but the time has come to combine my 8 with the engine from an FD running a single turbo.
I have a few questions i was hoping people could answer, or at least point me in the right direction.

1) Enginemengment. I am using the stock wiring harness from the FD and was hoping to find out what most poeple are running. I am leaning towards the AEM PnP unit, but was not sure if it controlled the OMP. Is there a particular EMS system people like more that controls the OMP without major modificiaiton to the wiring harness?

2) Turbo size. I have a freshly rebuilt turbo in my garage that i was orginally going to use on my audi, sold the audi, still have the turbo. I'm not looking for a huge amount of power, 330 would be the highest, but was curious as to what people with rotary experince think of this size turbo.



3) Injectors. With the information above, sizing on injectors. I was roginally thinking 4 x 880. Am i sizing this right?

4) Wastegate. 44mm right?

thanks you in advance for the help. If this is all common knowledge, i'm doing a hiorrible job and will take any guidance given.

Turblown

iTrader: (12)

ECU:
http://www.turblown.net/store/index.php?productID=137

Injectors:
http://www.turblown.net/store/index.php?productID=63

Turbo has too small of a turbine side, will work up to 6k then choke.

Perfect 330rwhp turbo; Should get you that around 11psi

http://www.turblown.net/store/index.php?productID=8

You don't have to swap the Rx7 engine to have a reliable 330rwhp fyi...

Dietbudda

Thank you for the links, i'll start looking through them now.

You're right, i can get that with the renesis motor. The motor just popped in it two weeks ago.
Since my buddy has a JDM motor he WAS going to use for his, he's giving me a screaming deal on it since his car was totalled in the summer last year.

Reading hat, ON.

lastphaseofthis

iTrader: (8)

13b-msp+stock fd twins. that would be a magicial power curve.

diabolical1

iTrader: (3)

also, if you go over to Rx8Club, there is a thread by the user Dethwalkin (i think) in which he highlights his REW swap, so you may be able to get some ideas and useful tidbits there as well.

Dietbudda

I've been emailing back and forth with a member on the forums about the swap.
I've got everything organized aside form the questions above so far. Seems fairly easy, just need to pay attention to detail.

Unfortuntlly the stock twins do not fit inside the 8's engine bay due to the motor location. I was roginally hoping to use the stock twins just to get me up and running.

dznutzuk

iTrader: (1)

Get going already

Dietbudda

haha, this weekend my friend, this weekend...
Travelling is a bitch!

SirCygnus

iTrader: (1)

why not just get a 2nd gen turbo, get a bnr stage 4, and have it good to 380 to 400 whp?

Dietbudda

I'm not sure exactly what all that means.
Do you mean a T2 motor?
What exactly is a BNR stage 4? I'm assuming it's a kit of some sorts?

Turbo8

iTrader: (17)

Engine location has nothing to do with it. The Renesis has side exhaust ports thus it has a shared center iron located exhaust port, totalling 3 exhaust ports. The FD has 2 exhaust ports. So you would need to fabricate an intensively complex and compact manifold to run the FD twins on a Renesis. But yes, if it could work easily, it would be a good combo.

How are you are planning on running your stock gauges since they run off the ECU? And are you keeping the stock made-of-glass RX-8 transmission?

And to answer your question on EMS', yes the AEM has full control over the OMP. It is not, however, the most popular EMS option. Most run the PowerFC due to the excellent base mapping and flexibility.

t-von

iTrader: (8)

Would it not be easier to piggy back the Fd engine with the factory Rx8 harness? I know you still need the Rx8 wiring for the dash electronics and such. You could use a Haltech Platinum 1000 to run the fuel, spark, and OMP. You can also run direct fire ignition and negative split in vacuum to save gas. The Haltech will also run the Rx8 single trigger set-up if you want to use that instead of the Fd's two sensors. Splice in all the other sensors with the Rx8 factory ecu and Haltech and you should be good to go.


I too was thinking of buying an Rx8 and swapping in the Fd engine.

dznutzuk

iTrader: (1)

Well for those who don't know and are interested in seeing something similar check out my car:
http://www.rx8club.com/showthread.php?t=159291&page=5

oinesra

iTrader: (2)

I think you totally misunderstood What he was getting at.

dznutzuk

iTrader: (1)

Actually that is one of the main reasons. If someone swaps an FD engine into the 8, there is no room for the stock location tt's. Just because the engine dimensions are the same doesn't mean that the engine bay is the same, the 8's bay in that region is narrower, plus side engine mounts(superior) make it impossible.

Dietbudda

Engine's out, it's starting to get serious.
Should have the new engine in my possesion by next weekend.

dznutzuk

iTrader: (1)

Good job buddy! Looks like you fubar-ed the a/c line a bit... Btw the passenger's side brake line(black metal that runs along the firewall) needs to be tucked away to keep it away from heat.

Dietbudda

Evening again.
So I've got most everything decided on with the exception of two things.
Wastegate size. 38 or 44 mm. Pretty straight forward.

Not so straight forward, turbo choice.
Plans for car. Somewhat daily driver. 4 days a week. 79% freeway.
Power needs to be around 330, rear wheel. I am unsure of the 'safe' limit for a stock 13b, that would help limit my goal. I'd like something responsive, 4k plus for some pull. I've been looking at both the TO4E and the GT35. It looks like the TO4E leaves me more room for growth if I decide to build the motor. From what I've seen the numbers are in favor of the GT35 but I've ears the T3 is limiting.
Any advice would be awesome. Thanks guys.

sngl13b

iTrader: (16)

hello i acually did this this swap on a customers car where i work,we got it all working with the rx8 harness the only thing we had trouble with was the valve on the side of the intake to trick the ecu in thinking it was working and had to get rid of the metering pump because the turbo manifold we used(hks cast)...i do agree with turblown would be much easier to get 330 with the stock engine,he went with the swap becuase he wanted 400+...good luck

Dietbudda

In thus circumstance the cost and fun factor of doing this myself out weigh that of a turbo renesis.
There will be plenty of time to have fun above 400 hp. Just not for the next 12 months.

Turblown

iTrader: (12)

350 to 400 rwhp with great response is to4E, 400 to 450rwhp is 1.06 gt35R or our T4 TD61( P trim gt35R)

dznutzuk

iTrader: (1)

44mm is the minimum for these engines

I tuned my friends car with a gt3540 w/1.06 and made 415rwhp at 17psi. Great power but I'm not a fan of ball bearing turbos. Btw this was his second turbo-the first one shitted on him after about 3years.

Dietbudda

I have a few options for the hot side on the TO4E. .84, .96 and 1.06.
I feel .96 sounds best, but would like to hear some opions from others.
Thanks again guys.

Turblown

iTrader: (12)

1.0 divided on a divided manifold, should be at 1 bar by 3200rpms

Dietbudda

Alright, got alot accomplished this weekend.
Friday I got all the fun stuff in the mail, Engine, Manifold, WG, BOV, oil relocation, various fabrication parts and the ECU for the whole thing.
Got the engine stripped down, all the parts off and loaded both engines up into the beater protege. Thing is a champion.
Saturday morning got to the shop, had the nuts removed and went home to begin mocking up the mounts.
Saturday afternoon I met a kid in Jersey to pick up the ECU and get some parts needed for the mount work.
Sunday got the mounts 'finalized' and after an 1.5 hours of struggling, FINALLY got the motor to mate up.
So as it sits now, the engine is in and mated up. Compression is good and a few items are on the motor.

Next weekend should be a nice relaxed one, now that the motor is in, I can see what needs to be monkey'd with better.
The A/C compressor bracket needs further modification to fit the compressor in next to the steering column.
Firewall needs to be beaten inwards a little, the manifold is a hair to close for my comfort.
Need to make some changes to the fuel rail and ultimately may just buy a new set up.
The radiator is going to get replaced and I need to make some changes to the hoses. I’ll be looking at hoses I can bend into custom shapes to make things easier.

I have a question though, anyone know the difference between the FD OMP and the RX8's OMP? The REW motor has two hole for oil, the renesis 4. I was wondering if i can use the FD OMP, but i'm using the renesis wiring harness and ECU to control the OMP so the signal and the response would need to be the same if i were to rewire the plug. if the pumps can't be changed, can i plug up/block off two feed holes on the renesis OMP?


Enough with the boring part, here's the eye candy...