steve kan is building me this setup. I am a low end rpm power **** so after thinking about it we have come to the decision that this is probably the best choice for me.

Im shooting for about 400-425 rwhp on pump gas at about 14-15psi.


larger streetport
t62-1 dual ball bearing (should put down 400rwhp at 14psi and full boost by 3k rpm)
1.0 exhaust AR
3.5 inch vband
3.5 inch downpipe
hks manifold
hks wastegate

 

max cooper showed me this setup...wowza...

perhaps not as responsive as my above setup but it looks damn good. like a big *** steak meal that i dont think i could eat but sure as hell would try.

http://www.kgparts.com/R85.htm

would need fuel to run that baby.


j

 

I like those dyno charts, climbs nice a quick then flattens out like none I've ever seen. That would be awesome on a drifter!

 

I thought you would never even consider going single?

 

As far as that Reactive racing kit all I can say is I gotta have that. I wonder what the boost threshold and lag is like on that because its making 300 torque and 300whp @ 4000RPM with 15psi and 470rwhp max. A combination of excellent tuning and excellent turbo matching.

 

One thing I'm curious about this turbo kit is if it uses the FD intake manifold or the Jay's manifold? I don't understand how the hp peaks at 8.5krpm since the stock intake manifold runners are tuned to peak at 7krpm before it tapers off.

 

big dreams killed by *** performance shops.

see my thread in the third gen section

 

That dyno graph in your liks is with a aftermarket intake manifold setup.

The setup you mentioned is pretty much the setup that Bryan from BNR has on his car right now. Its a great street setup. The car makes around 400rw at 14-15psi and made around 430rw or so at like 17-18psi. Like you said it also starts to pull real hard and is running a lot of boost by around 3500 (his isnt ball bearing).

Its a GREAT street setup. I think you'd like it, plus its easy to rebuild if sometime was to happen to it.

STEPHEN

 

thanks for that info steven. seems im going to eventually be in the need for one of those manifolds

jobs willing.

have you run bryan in that setup? how does it compare to yours?


j

 

Just in case anyone was interested the key to the power on the R85 is not the intake manifold. The intake manifold moves the peak hp out further in the rpm range but the flat torque curve is identical with the stock intake manifold just starts earlier and finishes sooner in the rpm range wich actually maybe desirable for some individuals taste. The overall performance of the kit is a combination of years of research and development with turbo/exhaust manifold design on my own race car wich has made 768rwhp on a turbocharged street ported 13b without the aid of NOS.

Demetrios Karagiannis
http://www.reactiveracing.com

"Trickle Down Performance - If your tuner can make 768rwhp chances are he can get you 600rwhp easily. If your tuner can only make 550rwhp, 450rwhp may be a difficlut task "

 

well regardless...that dyno sheet you all posted..both of them..are two of the yummiest i have ever seen. im very jealous.


as far as your trickle down comment....why do u think this is true? what is the problemo with tuners? is it that to get it right it takes more time than a tuner spends on customer cars? that is the only reason i can figure. if that is the case then it is just a money issue. yes?


j

 

I think it has alot to do with how much R&D does the tuner do with there own stuff. I had to break many eggs to make my omelet but now I feel I can make a pretty decent omelet It's just like any other car if you want the most powerful/reliable buick grand national go to the track and see who is doing the best with that particular application and chances are he can get you what you need.

 

Returns to scale.....

You can get 90% of the performance for 50% of the cost. It's when you go after that last 10% you start running into the big bucks. Think about it

 

I've been posting about looking for a turbo kit to replace my damaged RX6. I decided to get one of Dee's R85 kits. I was drooling over the dyno sheets, and the price and turbo rebuildability/replacability are nice plusses, too.

I am in the middle of a rebuild and should have all the parts I need in the next few weeks. I plan to have the car back on the road by May 1 or sooner. I'll try to hit a dyno after I get it all tuned to see what kind of power it makes. I'm experimenting with a few new products and things with this engine. I can't wait to see how it all turns out.

-Max

 

But shifting the tq curve to a higher rpm affects the HP, even if the tq is the same. If you take 340rwtq and shift it up 1000rpms its going to make an additional 65rwhp

STEPHEN

 

Excellent choice on the turbo. One of the best compressor choices for moderately high power applications on a rotary with a fantastic boost threshold.

It's humorous to see the list's frenzy re: various vendor offerings. You know, touting the lastest and greatest turbos from Garrett, HKS, etc . (I'm not referring to Dee). Of course, the vendor's objective is to make money, so I can't really blame them. However, I think a lot of the "old school" turbos such as the T04E (certain trims), 60-1, 62-1, and T04S (52, 56 and 60 trim) will perform equally as well or better than a lot of these new units at a fraction of the cost. Unfortunately, folks who do not research cannot make educated choices. For example:

1. Many fail to consider turbine maps and housings when selecting a turbocharger, e.g.: the exhaust housings on the GT30R/35R are too small for their compressor parings to make huge power on a rotary (given turbine efficiency and rotary EGTs).

2. Ball bearings do nothing for boost threshold (a surge line is a surge line regardless of the bearing type). If the turbocharger is too large for your application, a freaking frictionless bearing won't spool it!

3. Modest improvements in compressor efficiency don't affect horsepower appreciably when using a decent intercooler.

I'm not saying these improvements aren't noteworthy, particuarly if you looking to wring the last little bit out of your engine. However, for the guy who's happy with "400 RWHP," give me a break.

Okay, end of rant

One more point- if you're going road racing, I'd recommend the TiAL over the HKS gate. Seen a few people fry these under extreme conditions. Otherwise coo.-

Cheers,

Gene

 

Yeah makes sense Garrett wastes alot of time and money for really no reason,just small negligible improvements, there really is no benifit to the newer stuff other than higher prices, please tell me your not one of those guys who says water cooled center sections only adds more places to leak from. I'm not getting the GT35R is too small thing, to small relative to what, making huge power, I don't remember it being sold as a huge power setup by any vendor. According to you the cars putting down 450whp on a 35R are just running too small a turbo?So 450whp in a 26-2800lb car is not enough?

 

Gene this is not exactly true, I posted on this before.

A good wheel diameter ratio is between 1.1 and 1.20 (good boost
response and low backpressure). Mediocre is
1.20 to 1.25 (decent boost response and moderate backpressure). Anything
above 1.3 is horrible (bad boost response and
very high backpressure). Anything above 1.4 is shitty (doorstop material).

In doing the math a 35R is 1.20 there is no disparity in relation from front to rear, there are tons of rotaries running 35r's with good results making good streetable power. I think to many guys come into this forum and read about turbo's that are just too big for normal use and want it just because the bigger guys are running them.

As far as the other comments I leave those alone.

-Sean

 

Interesting....so by your logic, you can stick a 35R into a T25 housing and still perform the same? I think Gene's comment is directly related to the size of the exhaust housing, not the ratio between the compressor/turbine wheels diameter.

just my .02

 

what turbo do you have on the half bridge that is in the gotham video?

 

A T80 turbo with a R trim turbine wheel. Switching to a custom exhaust manifold and T88 (garrett thumper series) turbo before rotary revolution. :-) Actually, we'll have my cym running the same turbo as my red car.

 

by what rpm do you expect full boost? do you have a primary street port and secondary bridge port?

 

Actually, I stand corrected he IS refering to housing size, my mistake I read it wrong, however the "logic" that everyone seems to use on this board is somewhat misguided, terms like "full boost" and "too small" are relative terms not absolutes like everyone makes them sound on here. This confuses the guys who are new to it they read it then regurgitate it to everyone else on here.

That's my .02

And hey and give my wheel ratio numbers a try sometime I bet you'll see "my logic" is spot on next time you build your own turbo.

 

doh

 

I apologize for not getting back sooner. I was, in fact, referring to housing size and turbine efficiency. I'm not saying the 35R isn't a good choice for 400-450 RWHP or
that the turbine housing is too small for that kind of power. Rather, that even more potential could be had from this turbo if the 82mm compressor was mated to a larger hot side- particularly when considering the rotary's EGTs and exhaust flow.

Sean, I assume you already knew that ...hence the 40R?



Gene