importboi22

is it possible to get the irons surfaced?

Crusader_9x

yeah its called lapping. do might get lucky a search for it you and find a shop or somehtijng.

93BlackFD

www.mazdatrix.com

rxtasy3

iTrader: (2)

this is only if there's slight wear, grooves and such, in the housings. i actually had a set surface ground cause it would take way too long to lap them. no, it didn't cost me anything since my dad worked at the place where i had them done at the time. another way would probably be to have them milled like cylinder heads r done, either way, they will still have to be lapped before using them.

importboi22

so u just cant surface them and reuse them?

peejay

I don't know if a cylinder head mill would work. The mill is a roughly 18-24" diameter wheel with a single point cutting bit mounted every few inches around the circumference. The surface of the side housings is hardened beginning in (1979?) and the cutters would probably wear out *very* quickly before they made much headway.

I have a nagging desire to ask if we could chuck one of my junk side housings in there as an experiment... but I *really* don't want to have to pay several hundred bucks for new bits if it doesn't work.

93BlackFD

no, you can't use a head mill....bad idea

Sponge Bob Square Pants

Yes, they are just saying a cylinder head mill machine probably would not work well.

rxtasy3

iTrader: (2)

i didn't mean use a machine that mills heads, i said they were milled "like" u would mill heads. an industrial type machine shop will have a surfacing machine that has a perfectly flat surface plate the part to be milled is mounted to and a cutting head that will mill a very wide path in one pass. i didn't see this machine or ask how they were done. just going by the cutting marks left in the housings, the reason for still needing lapped after this is done to remove the marks, otherwise, the seals would never seat.

stevenoz

iTrader: (27)

If any of you want your plates surfaced I will do all four sides for $150. A lot cheaper than Mazdatrix.

Herblenny

iTrader: (13)

where are you located and when you say surfaced, i guess you are lapping??

stevenoz

iTrader: (27)

Located in North Carolina.

I use a surface grinder.

importboi22

is that safe?

Herblenny

iTrader: (13)

So, what grid is that??

I'm not sure thats safe..
do you have experience with rotary engine plates??? Whom have done this for??

stevenoz

iTrader: (27)

Why do you think its not safe???

There is no telling how many plates I have surfaced on it and had no problems with them. You take off a .0005 ( half a thousanth ) at a time until the wear marks are gone. Usually it take about .004 to clean up most of the surfaces. Correct me if I am wrong, but I would think this would be more accurate than lapping them.

Herblenny

iTrader: (13)

Well, like I said, i'm not sure... As all the top Rotary Engine builders I've met have always lapped instead of using surface grinder.

What would you say the grid # is for the surface grinder??

And is anyone on the forum that you know of have gotten your surface grind??

All I want to know is some reference.. as I mentioned earlier, I have no clue.. this is something new.

rxtasy3

iTrader: (2)

perfectly fine. i've used this type grinder before, for that size of surface to be ground, as long as it's indicated flat before grinding, it will be prefactly flat after and both sides parallel(sp) with each other.

banzaitoyota

i have a professional lapping shop do it. cost is reasonable. Recommend having the irons heat treated prior to lapping

Herblenny

iTrader: (13)

I'm sure its fine.. I mean not getting lapping is fine.. but I've recently found out that lapping is important to gauge the condition of your plates and also for lifespan of your engine.. Its not about just shaving metal..

stevenoz

iTrader: (27)

Im sure there are a few people that could get on here that I have built motors for that are not having any problems with it. But, don't take my word for it. Call Bruce Turrentine and ask him. He has only built a few thousand motors and he has his ground. I was going to do some for him before he went and got a surface grinder and other things in his new shop.

As far as the grid # I couldn't tell you. I am not a tool and die expert. Its my dads shop and they have a couple of surface grinders there. I know how to set it up and use it but thats about the extent of my knowledge of it. I also have a CNC program that can run out the o-rings grooves. When you surface them down you lose the original depth of the o-ring groove. You need to watch the depth of the o-ring groove.

Here is a picture of what they look like after its done.

peejay

All of the top rotary engine builders that have their own equipment, do rotaries and nothing but rotaries, so obviously they will buy the proper equipment necessary for the job.

We do boingers and nothing but boingers at the race shop where I am working, so we don't have a lapping machine, we don't even have a surface grinder... not necessary, and unneccesary equipment A) won't pay for itself and B) takes up valuable shop space. If we did rotaries and nothing but rotaries, you bet we'd have a lapping table.

As long as the surface is true and of the proper surface finish, any method that gets the job done will work.

- Pete (I've used a D/A sander and lots of 400 and 600 grit paper, but don't try this at home kids)

Herblenny

iTrader: (13)

Is it me or I see some defects?? can you take some detail pics of some spots??

rxtasy3

iTrader: (2)

that's only if u r doing housings of '86 and later engines when those grooves were moved to the intermediate housings. '85 and earlier, the grooves were in the rotor housings. the engine i built was a '74.

sevensheaven

iTrader: (1)

Bruce Turrentine sends his out, at least when he emailed me back just two weeks ago he said so. Sends them to shop in SC. I have the phone # and the guys name (Ray) on my work email. I can't get to it from home, but Pm me and I can get it to anyone intrested.

Terry7

BLUE TII

iTrader: (9)

Rob at Pineapple grinds instead of lappping as well. He mentioned the grit he used, but I forget- though it looks quite course to the eye (much more so than that pictured plate).

My plates had worn through all but the deepest scratches in ~10,000miles; though, I can't say if that is a good thing or not.