waynespeed

http://perso.wanadoo.fr/rxsept/Image...esis_paper.pdf


Get it while its HOT.

buzz

thanks...
so any guesses on how long until someone tries the renesis side plates with a current style PP rotor housing for a 6 ports in, 6 ports out effect?

waynespeed

With all the crazy rotary guys out there, someone is bound to do it. More flow, more gas and more power.

sinfestboy

I havnt read it yet, but because it is from SAE, I know its gonna be good......

Judge Ito

I would monster bridgeport the intake and exhaust ports

13BAce

A bridgeported exhaust port. I feel like I've gone to the rotary looney bin.

Judge Ito

Jim I have always wanted to seriously BP a six port engine, I mean a radical BP connect both ports and run that bridge all the way up. Now this is my chance, when I get a hold of a renesis engine I will do it. let me see is somebody up for it????

buzz

monster bridge port on the inlet and exhaust ports..... ooooooh, imagine the sound!
Can I bet 20c that Judge Ito will then spray the magic blue bottle across it? Can't wait!

AJC13B

the car will sound like a stocker buzz!! All the noise from a ported rotor comes from the overlap and with the Renesis engine there will be ZERO overlap!!

BP inlet and exhaust AND turbo to boot....Im thinking reliable and drivable 1000hp 13Bs will be not too far away

menace

thank you ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh..............

that is sooooooooo mint

13BAce

If you come to my house you may be in for a surprise. Maybe I'll come by one of these days and bring something to show you.

Judge Ito

Let's get this show on the road.... who has some renesis plates?????

Judge Ito

Don't tell me that I'm going to drive with Vosko and spy in and around your house for a renesis engine?

Judge Ito

Nitrous is like my American Express card. I don't leave home without it....

13BAce

Nah, something else. I tried it because I've never seen anyone take my approach. I'm not close to finished because it's alot of work, but the major work has been done.

Judge Ito

I see said the blind man. Abel "Flaco" Ibarra told me that, he use to run a 6 port engine in his Rx2 and made some serious Power.

13BAce

I remember a guy named Orly from Miami telling me about using 6 port housings in turbo motors, but he wouldn't say much after that. That was about 4 years ago. I would have just used 4 port housings for my "in progress" motor, but I had some 6 port housings lying around, and I figured "why not?"

sinfestboy

renesis side plates, everything ported as much as possible, huge intake, no exhaust (somehow.... top fuel style?) and 1000 natually aspirated hp out of a 1.3 litre engine. oh yeah, and as much nitrous as possible.

Judge Ito

Did somebody say nitrous again??? Man I love a rotary on N20

peejay

How?

The lack of overlap hurts power - the only function of the side port exhaust is to REDUCE EMISSIONS. To compensate for the power loss, Mazda gave it very high compression compared to any previous production Mazda rotary. (I think on the order of 11:1 or 12:1)

Why bother bridge porting when you can have peripheral porting? We already have peripheral port exhausts. There's also no point to having super-high compression if you're going turbocharged. Higher compression means you can force less air mass into the chamber before pressures get too scary.

Basically, I see ABSOLUTELY NO ADVANTAGE WHATSOEVER to modifying the Renesis as we expect it. You'd be much better off starting with a peripheral-exhaust engine.

Now, ON THE OTHER HAND... There is something to be said for a bridge/peripheral-intake, side-exhaust engine. This would get the overlap period biased to BTDC, which is good. With the side exhaust, you still have the emissions advantage of making it hard for the crevice volumes' unburnt gases to fall out the exhaust port. The exhaust atill won't be as forceful as a peripheral-exhaust engine but this isn't a bad thing if you car must be street driveable (read: quiet). Not so good for turbos, but hey, turbo engines need lower compression than the Renesis (and as lightweight as they say the rotors will be, I doubt there's much meat to mill out to lower compression) and besides, if you really do want to go turbo, boingers work just fine with similarly "soft" exhaust events.

waynespeed

Compression Ratio is 9.7 to 1 (see table 1 major specifications of tested engine, on page 2), two exhaust ports per rotor. Hey you never know. I'm curious to see the comparison between a full peripheral port vs. a bridge ported MSPRE. Overlap should not be a problem. Im sure some good old porting would resolve that part.

AJC13B

peejay - What happens when you BP or PP a turbo? Why is recommended not to BP or PP a street turbo engine? You lose all the bottom end because of overlap. When the rotor face opens to the intake and exhaust side, both are open so you lose some of the intake straight out the exhaust and you lose power and have crap emmisions and fuel consumption.

You say you see no advantage? 180kw from a n/a factory engine and we all know how restrictive factory exhaust systems are. Up over 200kw with an exhaust and intake changes? And still have a factory smooth car. Add a BP with ZERO OVERLAP you get the power of a BP without the lumpy idle or crap fuel economy or need for super loud exhaust. I have heard that in testing Mazda got the n/a setup to near 300kw. Shall I go on?

if you can't see the advantages, you need to open your eyes mate

relvinnian

I agree with peejay. From what I've read on this, it appears that in this side port engine configuration, the engine is only more efficient during "light load" situations.

You are talking about low-end power. It is a compromise people have to make. If you want to make more power, you eventually have to elevate the torque peak. You will always loose power down low from doing this. I'm sure you have more overlap on your large street port, than you might imagine.

RICE RACING

Nothing makes more power from 2k onwards than a Peripheral Port...period.

https://www.rx7club.com/forum/attach...&postid=338746

It ALL depends on how the Intake/Ports/Exhaust/Ports are tuned, this has been known since 1960.

You can see this from the BMEP in the SAE paper in question, the only reason the RENISIS makes good power is due to the higher peak power rpm and the high compression it uses.

The test done in the SAE paper uses an earlier engine with 9.7:1 compression, it verifiies what I have been saying for a LONG time. The RENISIS is designed and made for economy and emmisions, use the higher compression rotors it uses and tune the intake and exhaust for higher rpm (like it does) and you will have MORE power with Peripheral exhaust ports, imagine how much power with Peripheral Intake as well

Bitchn7

Judge ito, My brother made a 6 port 13B into a big bridge by opening both lots of ports up into one big port. This engine surprisingly had a lot of power and from low in the RPM as well. Went like hell in his 323 hatch. Was just an experiment as the parts were lying around and it went well. His PP he built later went even better but thats another story.