patman

iTrader: (3)

I dont have water injection. Stock turbo, stock IC, until spring when i put in my TO4. I do get boost sooner, but not much. full boost around 2500-3k. low end power is about halfway between normal TII and NA. All in all i'm extremely happy with the setup. also note that the detonation mentioned was 5k or so miles ago, and the wastegate has been fixed and the microtech tuned better, and i have had zero problems since.

ps i wanna see the numbers on the car running 40 psi...gotta be nuck'n futz

pluto

I'm using the RA 3mm apex seals so it doesn't come with any springs. I'll have to tear the engine down first before I can conclude it was the seals at fault. either way, everything is just speculation.

Scalliwag

Damn Steve I did not know your motor went Sorry to hear that. Hopefully the damage is light.

pluto

just low compression. doesn't sound like anything big deal. It should be a easy fix (simply replacing apex seals)

Scalliwag

Well that sounds promising then. No metal shards flying into the turbo at least

Rx-7Addict

iTrader: (2)

I had the same debate when I had my motor rebuilt. I heard good and bad things about the RA seals.

https://www.rx7club.com/rotary-car-performance-77/mazda-3-piece-vs-mazda-2-piece-vs-rotary-aviation-apex-seals-360217/

Check this thread out, it should be a big help. Basically the conclusion was to go with 2pc or 3pc Mazda seals, they are very similar. I chose to go with the Mazda seals in 2mm. I considered 3mm, but I didnt like the idea of milling the rotor and everything, so I stuck with the factory tolerances that are found on a stock rotor and using mazda apex seals.

-scott

t-von

iTrader: (8)

Which rotor has low compression?

Boostn7

?center?

pluto

Center, i know that the center rotor generally runs a little leaner than the rest because of how the intake manifold is design but at 11:1 a/f ratio at 8psi is hardly close to lean in my opinion. We'll see when i take the engine apart in the next few days/week

t-von

iTrader: (8)

Center...thats what I thought. Is it possible to tune for the flow embalance of the center rotor? Can more fuel be added to the center rotor to even things out? Also I noticed that you said in the other thread that you received the RA seals back in Jan or Feb 04. Those were the early batches that had clearence problems. If there's no damage, I personally would try seals from the newer batch. That way we can really see if they hold up.

Scalliwag

The ones that Ken used were from a very early batch. I have no idea if that would have changed anything in his case though.

t-von

iTrader: (8)

Those early batches had clearance problems. The machining process on the earlier batches were inconsistant. Some seals were machined slightly to thin. Some were overheated during the process of machining. I haven't heard of any problems with seals from the newer batches.

Scalliwag

If that is the case then that is inexcusable. As much as that 20 second lifespan of those seals cost Ken it is not much condolence.
Furthermore if the first batches were having problems it was the best kept secret in the world last January when we were seeking input on them.
At the time you would have thought Ken was the one and only to have a motor blow because of them.
Two brand new rotor housings from his Mazda sponsorship that did not live through one lousy engine dyno pull at RP.
If it was a bad batch of seals I don't know. I do know that those seals sucked and whether it was ****-poor QA or whatever there just is not a good excuse for that. If I seem livid about them after a year you can imagine what Ken would have to say about how he feels about QA'ing for them.

**** happens but I really hate for someone to pay so much in time and money because of someone elses fault.

t-von

iTrader: (8)

In January no one realized that there was a problem. Here's the thread with the discussion about the defects:

https://www.rx7club.com/showthread.p...racy+seals+cnc

Start with Tracy from "Real World Solution's" post (third from the top) and read on.


Inexcusable? I think they have handled this situation very professionally.

2Lucky2tha7

iTrader: (3)

Hey guys, I'm going to start rebuilding my engine in the morning and I also have the RA apex seals and springs. In the last 5 minutes of reading this, I'm getting the idea that the RA SPRINGS aren't good?? If I have to use OEM SPRINGS, that'll cost me $72 + S&H from Mazdatrix, not to mention the long wait for shipping (I'm in Pennsylvania, they're in California). Obviously, I definitely won't consider using the old ones...........I was already missing a few when I disassembled the engine, and I'm not "keen" on the fact of re-using springs. Can someone give me any input on this???

Brian

t-von

iTrader: (8)

I think the RA springs are ok for NA applications. I wouldn't use them with forced induction because I heard that the RA springs aren't heat treated.

2Lucky2tha7

iTrader: (3)

Damn............I'm building this engine to be boosted within the next year or so. I'd really hate to have to pull it all apart just for apex seal springs!!!!! But I really need to get this engine together like......NOW!!! I guess I'm just hoping to see a more "comforting" response from someone.

SIDE NOTE: my friend is running the same seals and springs in his TII from the early batch with the numbers on them, and now he's getting compression between 25-90 psi on the rotors!!! Is it really the springs??? Did they ever "change" them??? (I think the rear rotor was 85-80-70, and the front was between 25-70 psi)

patman

iTrader: (3)

i used the RA springs. you can read my posts above about the success ive had.

pat

Scalliwag

They had a QA problem that lasted 4 months according to that link. It took Ken less than a minute run time to find that out. Did anyone that bought any seals from those batches receive any notification after they found out that there may be problems and if they had not used them yet that they shouldn't?
So while they told everybody to go out and buy new housings at close to a grand they did not follow up and basically issue a recall. Did they pay for any of the engines that were lost.
You may see it as a "professionally" handled situation but how much $ are you or your friends out on the seals? David ordered the seals and he never received anything from them warning him in case he had not used them yet. That is what I call leaving your customer hanging. I think it was their "professional" obligation to go back through their sales records and contact those affected.

von

I agree that OEM is the best. Ceramics are good to I hear.

I had old *** OEM's with around 170k miles on them. I made 160rwp in my N/A and detonated wile racing that you can hear over the radio 8k rpm's. It sounded like a rain storm and lasted for 10 seconds because I kept my foot on it trying to figure out what it was. The car was fine and made full power for a few weeks after until I started racing again on the same road same speed (140) and detonated for another 8 seconds or so (not exagerating) but the seals finally let go after deacceleration but still got home during a 14 mile trip. Kick ***

zyounker

In puerto rico they run stock 2mm seals up to like 60psi of boost.


Dont waste your time/money.

2Lucky2tha7

iTrader: (3)

Alright guys, I just spoke with Tracy Crook from Rotary Aviation and he basically told me what T-VON stated above.....that they are good for N/A and TURBO applications, but they do not do well above "much more than" stock boost levels, or when using NITROUS, or really high revving (like over 7000-8000rpms) like what happened to the guy that BOOSTN7 was talking about on the first page of this forum with his peripheral ported engine. He also mentioned that when he did "testing", that he found contents of INCONEL in the OEM springs which allow the OEM springs to keep their tensile strength at higher temperatures as opposed to the aftermarket springs that he includes in his kits.
So, I went ahead and just ordered all 12 OEM apex seal springs from Mazdatrix just a few minutes ago and I'm having them overnighted--->costing me a total of about $100.
I'd be wayy tooo pissed off if I found out later on when I start boostin this engine that the RA apex springs weren't up to the job, because I'll be running 10+psi of boost on 9.7:1 rotors, so it'll be getting pretty hot in the engine......

2Lucky2tha7

iTrader: (3)

^^
Stock 2mm 2-piece or 3-piece??? I take it that your obviously talking about 2-piece, as it would be very hard to believe that claim if you were talking about the 3-piece.....

Maxthe7man

****....thats not what I wanted to read...sigh....
Anyone else confirm that? Not for high revs now or highboost, and my motor is a bridgeport with a T51s....Guess what I'll be doing next week...

t-von

iTrader: (8)

They as in RA springs or the apex seals that are only good for stock boost? Just trying to make sure that everyone understands what "THEY" you are talking about.