clean85owner

DtotheIARRHEA: What the **** did you just say?

audiobot7

Crashx7

You DO know that a LS1 is a 350, right? 5.7 Liters = 347 (close enough to say 350) cubic inches displacement.

Want proof? The conversion factor is 1L = 60.7 cu. in. You do the math...

But with the benefit of the doubt, maybe you're talking about an older LT1 or even worse, a carbureted 350 from the "good ole days."

Roy James

I love 350s of all sorts. A carbed 350 is a really inexpensive way to get 400HP+, with alum heads and other lightweight parts, arnt much heavier if any heavier than a stock TII with all its jugs on. I won't turn this into a war because its a matter of opinion, but theres nothing wrong with it.

CtotheHRIS

Yes i'm well aware, that an LS1 is about 350 CI, however, it is nothing close to your average smallblock 350.

Aluminum block, heads, roller cam and rockers.... that enging can actually rev, unlike an average smallblock that is dookie, IMO.
also, the LS1 swap doesnt destroy the weight distribution unlike other v8 swaps..

whats up with all the flamage? sheesh!

CtotheHRIS

i agree, its all a matter of opinion.

dumpsterdriver

a proper v8 rx7 would be about a million times more reliable than the touchy high boost built to **** 2 rotor the car would need to even compete.


near stock lt1's in an fc are good for high 11's.. thats badass


i love the fc body but hate the rotary personally. my next project is going to be an fc with the turbo buick 3.8 and trans. i see rotaries as an interesting concept, but their flaws are just too much for me to want to deal with. i figure the 3.8 swap will give me the best of both worlds.. a nice light rwd chassis and a powerful much more reliable and efficient drivetrain.

just my opinion

adrock3217

Much more efficient? LOL.

dumpsterdriver

im talking about gas. you think a built up rotary is going to get the same mileage as a gn 6?


what about the rx7 is more efficient?

honest question, i dont know them all that well.. just know that they are always exploding themselves

CtotheHRIS

well i guess to answer that question, you have to ask another question..

whats your definition of "built"?

MY definition of built is Not very streetable..


and i'm going to have to disagree with a stock LT1 doing high elevens in a 7.

the LT1's put out like 330 some odd HP at the crank? so lets be generous and say 290 WHP(very generous) i dont think that would be good enough for elevens in a stock FC... Let alone all the traction problems...

dumpsterdriver

theres a guy from indy that one of the people on my local forum knows that has a white fc with an lt1 with some boltons and his car has run in the high 11's, thats where i get that from. if you go through the trouble of motor swapping a car you would probably at least give it a good exhaust an intake and maybe a cam. thats pretty close to stock in my book.. at least in f body land.

whats it take to get 400 hp out of an fc tII? thats what i meant by built, whatever that amount of power requires, because if i were to do the lt1 swap thats what my baseline would be give or take a few.. i assume most people that swap end up with something like that. i know if i wanted 400hp out of my 2.2 turbo omni motor it would take 110 as regular and require a massive shitload of experimentation and money.. not to mention i would be riding the edge of death every time i got close to that number.. thats the beauty of a swap, 400 hp off of an ls or lt1 isnt that big of a deal.. and the nice stiff light rwd fc chassis takes to the conversion so nicely..

ive always wanted a gn/fc though.. lt1 would be the cheapest and easiest but man a 3.8t fc would be the ****

comradegiant

Jesus H Christ... you actually DRIVE an OMNI TURBO?

You are a brave man.

dumpsterdriver

i drive a turbo omni every day actually i have a backup vehicle, but my omni is really clean and has been surprisingly dependable.. this is my 4th omni so i kind of know what to look for when hunting them down now. luckily turbo dodges are just a couple steps above rx7's in reliability... they both totally suck at it ha

see a few threads down in the kills section for some videos of it in action. it isnt slow

No-Pistons-TT

lol well i really think u dont have much of a life do you?

dumpsterdriver

no all i do is suck dicks and wish i had an rx7!


wow you really told me!

LokiRx7.1

iTrader: (1)

LOL! ROTFL! Wow those turbo omnis must be reliable huh!!! Your on your fourth one AMAZING I guess your right about those rotaries..... I mean considering I own an original 1981 me being the original owner and all, and you know what it still hasnt blown up.... huh that must just be me... NOT seeing as how I've worked at mazda dealerships before and I specialize in rotaries BECAUSE I OWN ONE. now on to the task at hand, Considering the fact that I put almost 300 horsepower to the ground in an engine with 140,000 miles on it and its a daily driver must make me exempt. YOU MORON! I am amazed at your stupidity I have worked on more muscle cars than your empty head could comprehend. Do you know how reliable a pontiac 400 is? when making 500 HP? I dont know you tell me. But the damn thing is a paper weight right now, threw a rod...... oh wait rotaries dont have those.... huh, who knew? I have worked on more 350's than I ever hope to see again and you know what? my engine is all Racing Beat aluminum housings.... So I guess that makes it lighter than ANY V8 and if you do the math a V8 would need 400+ HP to create equivilant performance. And do you know something? the old school Chevies were great motors but they wont last 140,000 miles at 400+ HP at the wheels!!! And unless your an idiot or a supremly lucky SOB You havent seen it done either. Even in the LS1's to many moving parts too heavy with the money and effort it takes to do the swap I dont see why any intelligent person just doesnt build the rotary. THE ONLY REASON a rotary blows up is when the dumb soccer mom who popped out four kids drives her husbands car and runs the oil out of it, OR the dumb bitch drives it in the summer and turns the A/C on full blast while in heavy traffic on a 90 degree day and overheats it, warping the rotar housings, Oh and the stupid people that run the living crap out of them all day long and never take care of it!!! The only reason rotaries have a bad name is because it is confined to one make and one model, if you look it up and compare it the blow up rate when in contrast to how many millions of piston engines there are IS ALMOST EXACTLY THE SAME. When you confine a specific motor to a specific car everyone heres isolated incidents and blows them out of proportion. Ford 351 Windsor V-8's Were Trash they used poor casting methods and the motors were absolute garbage, Flathead V-8s Prone to burning oil, Buick 3.8's absolute rubbish all they did was take a V-8 and cut off two cylinders, probably the worst motor Buick turned out, Chrysler 318's Underpowered for the cars they were put in, Dodge 2.0 I-4 the rear main seals were cheaply made and prone to failure they leaked oil even after they were replaced. What you dont get is if rotaries were everywhere and the only piston engine was in a camaro everyone would hear how bad 350's are EVEN though they are reliable. I rest my case I'm done, I cant wait to see your Immature Belittling and probably racist and homosexual comments, As I said earlier you are a moron, If I had to geuss your a teenager or someone in their early 20's who has nothing better to do than start talking trash.... and apparently suck dicks........ but anyway I already know you are going to make a comment on how advanced in years you are and I stand ready to shred to pieces any arguement you may have.

dumpsterdriver

wow you really told me. sounds like you are really pissed off about something.

i think in all of that rambling you were trying to say that a rotary is just as reliable as a v8, which in my experience is just ******* stupid because everyone i know or know of that plays with 7's has been through a couple motors at least. theres a local guy with an fd thats on i think his 4th motor in 2 years or so. its a badass car, but it always seems to be down.


i dont remember saying that turbo omnis were the most reliable cars on earth either, thats just your illogical horrible grammer having *** putting words into my mouth because you are butthurt that i said something you dont like. awwww you poor baby.. ill try to be more careful when i type with you around, you seem to be the sensitive type



you are the one that decided to act like a complete ******* retard and start insulting me, i was trying to have a conversation and then your little pantywaste *** vomits up a big illegeble block of **** like that going waa waa you said rx7s arent reliable!

well. compared to piston motors- they arent, ******* deal with it. you sound like some highschool fanboy.. you need to learn some respect. i know its the internet and all and you think you can say whatever the hell you want to people because you dont have to look them in the face, but it makes you look like a complete tool doing it. if someone says that rx7's blow up all the time in front of you do you scream at them for 10 minutes about how empty their moron heads are? im willing to bet not.



i think the line where you said "I dont see why any intelligent person just doesnt build the rotary." sums up your sad little fanboy view of things pretty nicely. its a big world, there is always going to be something faster, stronger, and more efficient than you. you are just going to have to accept that or risk spending the rest of your life whining like a little bitch on a message board everytimie someone mentions something that you dont agree with

a mild 400hp lt1 into an fc would be cheaper, easier, a lot more trustworthy, and get better mileage than a 400hp rotary. you wanted to turn this into a pissing match so there you go. do you actually think im wrong on any of these points? i can point out 6 or 7 nice daily driven lt1's around here that have never had the motors out of the car. the 2 fd's i know of around here are both on motor # 3 or 4. most of the people i know online that are into 7's have melted one down at some point.. every ad you see for fd's says "rebuilt engine" i thought this was accepted knowledge on here?

people like you really take this board down a notch. the turbo dodge boards arent full of elitest ****** like you, not even the dsm boards have so many utter douchebags. its nice to be able to have a conversation without some ******* jumping down your throat every now and then, you should try it. you disagree with me? fine, explain yourself in a rational manner and we will talk about it. you start throwing around 9th grade insults like that and you honestly expect me to take anything you say seriously? so far you are 100% a tool. wear it with pride.

phear

Wouldn't getting a 20b be cheaper than an LS1? and they'd still be just as good with a good port I'd think o.O, unless there is a flaw that I don't know about them? Just throwing my $.02 out there.

dumpsterdriver

id love to see a 20b 7 running around.. those things sound so completely badass..

a few years ago i was considering a 7 but only on a 20b.. i remember the estimates i was getting from people that had done it were crazy expensive, more than 10,000$.. its been a few years though, maybe stuff is cheaper these days, but i gave up that idea real quick once i started seeing the numbers


you can get an lt1 and tranny out of a yard (or in my case from one of the 57 million f body people around here ha) for maybe 1000$, put 1000$ in machine work into it, but the mounting stuff from grannys for 200 or so, say another ~2k for megasquirt and wiring and all of the little stuff.. not too bad, especially considering the times that fc's pull with just a mild lt1 swap. the grand national swap would end up being more because of all the extra turbo stuff, but it would also be much cooler imo

LokiRx7.1

iTrader: (1)

first of all I think I qouted your so called nice coversation maybe I made a mistake here we go again

As I said before you are generalizing the subject unfortunatley you are compareing two different thing I hate it when idiots like you start bashing things you know nothing about. First of all if you boost something it will blow up V-8 or rotary, unfortunatly for you I am not any sort of elitest ninth grade punk. I own in addition to my seven, a 1977 Pontiac Trans Am I love it more than just about anything and have turned wrenches on every pontiac there is, I also own a 350 chevy performance crate neither of which are boosted and comparing the reliability of any performance V8 including that of which an LS1 is almost THE SAME you cant go around trying to **** off the whole board why am I pissed, maybe because you are showing grave disrespect on an Rx-7 board talking trash about Rx-7's. Ever heard of the Banks Turbo? I've seen it applied to a 350 that motor needed rebuilt constantly you cant boost any motor and expect it to be reliable, your omni turbo wont be running enough boost to even qualify here. I still dont understand why many owners constantly go through motors, I've seen many a person throw out a perfectly rebuildable engine in favor of a new one, I dont know why they just do.
Now we are talking about life and reliabilty here NOT gas mileage, thats a totally different subject. If you are really performance minded what does mileage matter? If your 400+ N/A LS1 is as reliable as you say it is then I gaurantee my car which will weigh far less, and dont argue with me here I already specified I have used All aluminum RB Block components, If I'm putting 300 HP to the groung N/A I will go toe to toe with you everywhich way. Because my car will be lighter so it will make up for my lack of HP, A supercharged or tubo'd rotary only blows up when they are not built properly or they are not taken care of. I will admit a rotary requires slightly more attention than a piston engine just because of heat related issues and slight oil consumption. But you cant judge the rotary on a few isolated occurances or what you've been told, you want living proof of a High HP daily driven RX-7 I'd be glad to show you. Rotaries are inherently more reliable because of the lack of moving parts, but if you throw in EFI an ECU a Turbo and sell it to the masses? most people dont know how to take care of a turbocharged engine much less a rotary engine, So what happens when you combine the two?? You are one of those people that give rotaries a bad name, they are revolutionary and the only reason they arent more widespread is because Mazda is keeping sole control, ironically the very company you praise (GM) helped push the rotary foreward,

You knew damn well when you said this someone was going to go off you just didnt expect me to flame up,
You want to do a V-8 swap fine or a 3.8 swap fine, I still know several people that run turbo applications that are properly built that are also daily drivers, I know at least one or two are on this very forum. It is a matter of opinion on what you like, I've made a lifestyle as you would from rotaries I dont like people that give them bad names, I dislike ford, you dont see me on ford forums telling them about how crappy their motors are and how I'm going to swap in a rotary instead. Its a 2 way street learn to walk it,

.

A proper boosted rotary could be just as reliable, note we both used the word proper

Yes thats badass, Jesus Padilla drives an FB with a boosted 13B and does 8's
Like I said a two way street, anything can be built properly, even a rotary, and if they couldnt than why is mazda still making them? dont you think by now they should have realized something, but I can already see you are smarter than me or anyone on this forum, oh and all the engineers at mazda right? okay I guess your just smarter than everyone, are you related to the presdent? J/W.....

LokiRx7.1

iTrader: (1)

BTW I will apologize for the flaming and as I said it is a two way street, and the reason I have a crate 350 is simply the fact I did consider the swap, but I'm just too attached to my rotary to get rid of it.

LokiRx7.1

iTrader: (1)

Okay you dont know what this takes for me to do But I apolgize for attacking you so badly, I actually wasnt paying attention and thought you were the idiot that created this thread, sorry occasionally I pop off at the hilt a little too much and after a revision of what has been said I think I went a little over the top, I expect you to make your point and I dont expect you to change your opinion just in the future I would ask you not to be so negative without expecting a negative response.

dumpsterdriver

dude.. you are getting me wrong and totally taking this the wrong way. im not here to disrespect rotarys, look at my posts in this thread.. i was just giving my opinions, thats what this board is for right? if you disagree awesome, im all for a conversation, but not one that starts and ends with be being called a dumbass when i didnt do anything to deserve that ****.

n/a rotarys are exempt from my unreliability accusations, i still see rusted out shitty fb's crusing around rocking 200k motors, the same with fc's.. everyone ive known thats done an rx7 has done a turbo one though, thats the most common way people make them fast, and i am just speaking from experience here... they all explode.. all of them. the only person i know of with a turbo rx7 that DIDNT blow a motor at some point is a friend of mine from michigan, and she only had here car swapped to turbo for a week before someone wrecked it so that doesnt even count haha. this is just what I have seen, but ive seen it over and over again and am noticing a trend. i know a lot more people with pistion cars and they just handle abuse better, and i abuse the hell out of my cars.

i respect any fast car, rotary or not, but i will never build one just because ive seen how much frustration they put people through.. if i spent a lot of money and time building a car i dont want to have to worry about a half second of detonation blowing out a seal and causing another month of downtime or whatever, and that is just far more common in my experience on a rotary than it is on piston engines. i consider making that point to be illustrating the obvious, not baselessly talking **** about the cars. i love the fc body, i really want to build one because they are awesome cars to drive, but i dont want to do it with a rotary.. hence the swap.

the bottom line is ive seen what happens with 7's, the slightest thing can and will kill them instantly. thats not something i want to deal with. the lack of moving parts doesnt mean much to me when the engine with 200 times the complexity usually ends up lasting 3 times as long. you are right about mileage, as far as pure performance goes it doesnt matter, but i do a lot of cruising and road trips to out of state tracks and build my cars to be driven all the time, so getting 10mpg isnt an option for me.. its just another peice of the reason i dont want to deal with one.


ps, my omni runs 20 psi now and is good for high 12's on slicks, next spring when my built motor goes in it will be doing just over 30 psi off a t3/t4 50 trim. ive had 4 because i love them, i cant get away from them. everytime i sell one i end up buying another 6 months later ha.

dumpsterdriver

thanks, its forgotten, weve all done it at some point

im not here to disrespect, but the subject of swaps came up so i just started talking about it. a gn fc is kind of my dream car so i will ramble about it whenever i get the chance ha


i do have strong opinions on the turbocharged rotary engine though, ive seen the frustration they have caused so many people and it just scares me too much to touch them with a 10 ft. pole. if you or anyone knows them well enough to build a strong one that keeps going noting but respect from me, i just dont think i would be able to keep one alive because i flog the **** out of cars and run them pretty much to their limit at all times ha... if i run into detonation on a chrysler 2.2 or a 4g63 it just pulls timing and the motor absorbs it and keeps on trucking.. rx7's dont seem to be nearly as forgiving


all my opinions, im not here to trash anyone, but i will explain myself

2ndGen.rocket

You're all ******* retards.

Any modern V8 is almost always going to put out a larger amount of reliable horsepower and torque than a boosted rotary. ****, you want to get into reliabilty arguments? How many FD's are running around on original motors right now? How many FD's had blown motors before they hit 50k miles? Yeah, that's what I ******* thought.

Stock for stock I would put the 4.6 or the 5.7 up against any rotary, any day of the week. Give me 20 grand and an LS1, and you can take any rotary you wish plus the same amoutn of cash. I guarantee you that I would be able to build a motor that would blow any rotary out of the ******* water any day of the week, and still be more reliable.

And 351's aren't shitty motors either. I think any FC would be honored to have a bored and balanced 351 from Ford Racing under it's hood. It'd make a much more potent car.