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Can you do heel-toeing in FD with stock steering wheel ?

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Can you do heel-toeing in FD with stock steering wheel ?

Old 08-28-03, 05:31 AM
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Can you do heel-toeing in FD with stock steering wheel ?

Just as the title says. I'm about 6"2 tall and about 215lbs, and have big problems doing heel-toeing because of the big stock steering wheel. My legs are in the way

So do you change out for the smaller diameter steering wheel or do you have a way around it ?
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Old 08-28-03, 07:59 AM
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I am 6'4" and approx 200 pounds and I can't reliably do it, I end up with my right knee in the steering column.
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Old 08-28-03, 08:09 AM
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I'm about 6'1" and don't have any problems. However, it may just be my technique. I started with the sidestepping technique, but have since moved to using my heel on the brake and toe on the gas. So with my foot at about a 60 degree angle, it allows me to have my knee well to the right of the steering wheel. Hard to describe, but hope that helps a little.
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Old 08-28-03, 09:10 AM
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TailHappy, I completely understand you, but I can't brake like that. I'm used to braking with left side of my foot and then blip the throttle with its right side - my foot is not banked or turned left of right (or at least not much) - if you know what I mean

I'm getting a 320mm or 350mm Momo wheel. What is the stock wheel diameter is anyone knows from their head ?
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Old 08-28-03, 09:22 AM
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Originally posted by TailHappy
I started with the sidestepping technique, but have since moved to using my heel on the brake and toe on the gas.
That's the direction I am moving to but so far am real uncomfortable with my heel on the brake. Past ankle injuries make this movement very difficult for me, whereas sidestepping is fine.
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Old 08-29-03, 01:12 AM
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I have always wondered how to do this. I do the sidestepping technique. So, the other way to do it is to brake with your heel and blip with your toe? Or the other way around? How the hell do you modulate your braking pressure with your heel? I would go flying off of the road or lock up the brakes if I tried that.
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Old 08-29-03, 01:56 AM
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Generally you brake with your toe and tap-dance your heel over. In the Spec7, thats what I do. Of course, I've got a backwards L shaped pedal, which makes it easier. In my street 7, because I have big feet and wear Van's shoes for the most part, I do the sidestepping routine. I think even if I wore my racing shoes I'd still have to sidestep because of the angle of the stock seat and larger diameter street wheel.

I'll tell you one thing: you won't learn how to do it and be badass the same day. You may even drop a tranny before you get really good at it. But, if you don't learn how to do it, you'll drop more tranny's. Six of one, half-a-dozen of the other, eh?
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Old 08-29-03, 02:00 AM
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What is sidestepping technique ?

I use my thumb side of my right foot for braking and then blip the throttle with the other side of the foot.

Is this it ?
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Old 08-29-03, 04:49 AM
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The Widefoot gas pedal extender thingy made it very easy to "heel and toe" (which is a misnomer since I use the right side of my driver's foot to blip the throttle) easy for me. I found it much more difficult before the pedal modification. PM WidefootRacing (I think that's his screen name) for purchasing details. The small model works great for me. Once you learn how to do it, you pretty much do it everywhere (track, street, wherever).

-Max
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Old 08-29-03, 07:46 AM
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So you guys haven't ever run into trouble sidestepping the gas (you described it right, cruiser)? I started out that way since it seemed easier to get the feel for it, but once during hard braking when the brake pedal dropped farther than usual, I couldn't get my foot off the gas enough and it started over-revving...and the only way to stop was to let off the brake. Fortunately it was a situation where I just stopped braking to fix the problem, but I decided then to get used to heel-toeing.

I once read (maybe in the Skip Barber book) that your technique should depend on the car. Your toe, since it's most sensitive, should go on the most powerful pedal. So if you have a high-horsepower car, your toe should be on the gas, otherwise, it should be on the brake. I personally find that I'm more interested in a finesse movement of the throttle to get the revs right in comparison to a hamfisted application of the brake, so for me, the heel feels better on the brake.

As far as modulating the brake, I guess I'm just cheating since I have ABS to fall back on. But I love using the technique all the time, even if just pulling into a gas station, so I'm not always trying to threshhold brake. Guess I just find it good entertainment trying to perfect the technique.

Now, when you get bored of heel-toeing, try a heel-toe double-clutched downshift to really blow your mind the first few tries
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Old 08-29-03, 09:13 AM
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Originally posted by TailHappy
Now, when you get bored of heel-toeing, try a heel-toe double-clutched downshift to really blow your mind the first few tries
The true mark of a true driver I practice on the street so that it becomes "normal" and then bring it to the track. My problem is that my ankle honestly hurts me due to past sports injuries and spending an afternoon at the track shifting all day gets to me.
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Old 08-29-03, 09:39 AM
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I've found that left-foot braking has me less concerned with heel-toe these days. But the side-stepping technique usually works better for me. I found this helped a lot for me .... find a sneaker that has a wide sole. The "oops-I-slipped-off-the-accelerator" miss is no longer an issue with the 'new' mod.
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Old 08-29-03, 06:06 PM
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I actually use sidestepping in everyday life.
In 99% downshifts, I sidestep to do some rev-matching. And sure helps me on the track.

I don't think I could keep the current finnese with heel-toeing, turned either way. Maybe my heel is numb or something
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Old 08-30-03, 02:05 AM
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I started with sidestepping, and kind developed a sidestep/ rollover technique. Sometimes I'll blip the throttle with my ankle.
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Old 08-30-03, 08:40 PM
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Now i have a 87 T2, but im 6'4 225. Take your shoes off! That really helped me alot! I can not at all heal-toe with shoes on, cause of the back heal of the shoe, but without shoes its no problem at all. So give that a try, or if u dont want to buy expensive racing shoes which dont really have a heal, buy some cheap wrestling shoes
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Old 08-31-03, 01:45 AM
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I'm glad I'm short...5' 7" (okay so I'm 5' 7 3/4 " or 5' 8" with shoes ) and I have absolutely no problems with heel and toe driving in the FC or FD. Damn...you guys are really big!
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Old 08-31-03, 09:58 PM
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I can heel-and-toe downshift in my 74 REPU no prob!!! Mazda got it right in that truck

5'11" 210lbs.
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Old 09-01-03, 12:41 AM
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I haven't tried it, but have you guys looked into the D-shaped wheels, with the flat part on the bottom? Mazdaspeed sells (or used to sell) one.
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Old 09-01-03, 03:58 AM
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Those things are probably a bitch to turn quickly if you need to move the wheel for more then 200-220degrees in one direction. They would rock if FDs had only had 1turn lock-to-lock.
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Old 09-02-03, 09:10 PM
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Argh! Doesn't that **** you off to no end?! I'm starting to learn to roll my foot, but I feel like I'm learning a bad habbit. Typically in any other I'll do the correct heal-toe technique keeping your toe on the gas and heal to quickly blip the throttle each downshift.

Speaking of bad habbit, I actually used to downshift my auto Accord at ever downshift with my right foot while using the left for the brake (no clutch!) The auto shifter stick had every gear 1-4...too bad the car's dead now with it's second engine, go figure!
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Old 09-02-03, 10:33 PM
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Originally posted by TailHappy

Now, when you get bored of heel-toeing, try a heel-toe double-clutched downshift to really blow your mind the first few tries
k, i'm a newb, so don't hurt me too much, but i thought the point of heel-toeing was a quicker double clutched downshift, but after readin gthat i guess not. So what exactly is the advantage? Besides being able to stress the gas and brake at the same time.

Soryr for the stupid question, i'm hoping eventually to start autoX and/or road racing, just trying to learn.
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Old 09-02-03, 10:37 PM
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When you are downshifting you brake with the ball of your foot and blip the throttle with your heel. This matches the rpm of the engine to the speed you are going. When you let the clutch out when you begin to go into the turn it is a much smoother transition so as to not upset the traction of the car. Smoother you can be the faster you will go because you won't lose traction.
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Old 09-03-03, 02:44 AM
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The Decompression of the engine will also aid in braking power on a straight. I made a thread about this a long time ago when I first got my car and the two ideas I got was bolting a racing seat to the frame (no sliders) and some trick little sparco steering wheel thing that makes it go a bit up I suppose. Since I allready probably don't fit in the car with a helmet anyways, the race seat option seems like a good idea. If anyone else has experience with this, come forth
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Old 09-03-03, 02:18 PM
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yeah....to it's just a rev matching technique without the added bonus of a double clutch...i understand the smoothness concept, io just always associated rev matching with double clutching
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Old 09-05-03, 12:10 AM
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use the widefoot adapter and all your problems will be solve
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