KiyoKix

Yea it is the Cameron Worth car that I was talking about. I was wondering what happened to it. Do you know if he's gonna redo the car according to the "new" rules, or just call it quits? *crossed fingers*

bradrx7

No, I haven't heard. I haven't seen Cam in about 9 months. The big issue for him is funding. Scott Sansone codrives and funds some races, but Cam needs that to run. There is always a chance they will run at Daytona Jan 31-Feb1.

scratchjunkie

hey brad...since you seem to know m2's car and specs inside out. what type of tranny does it have? and what type of shocks does it have? IMO i think your ******* m2 to make yourself look better.

1FooknTiteFD

Another feature I remember the M2 car having was that it had a sequential shifter transmission. No need to step on the clutch to change gears, pretty damn hardcore and also a carbon fiber dash and big brake kit on all 4 brakes too

scratchjunkie, don't hate on brad his car is very nice. I agree that brad's car is probably a more bang for the buck car than the m2 racecar consider his is only 1/4 of the price and just as fun.

tims

comparing M2's car to a porsche GT3RS is just not fair. the GT3RS is designed solely for racing and all parts of the car are constructed for racing. yes, it does look like a current 911 but that is all. even a single turbo RX7 would be no match for a GT3RS on the track. in world challenge the Pettit RX7 gets killed by the GT3 cup car which is significantly slower than the RS. comparing ten year old race cars to current models is not fair to the older car. looks like this car was built to be a track car but it was not raced professionally ever(if this is not their world challenge car). the GT3RS is an incredible race car and at the moment can handle itself against alot of higher powered race cars. check the coverage of the POC's tribute to LeMans on speed channel. there were several 700+HP turbo 911's in that race and all were beaten by two GT3RS's. As for the sequential trans claimed to be in M2 car it is most likely the mazda motorsport trans which is dog ring but not sequential. neither will need the clutch for up or down shifts. Quaife and Hewland make sequential gearboxs that could be adapted to the RX7. in my opinion 100k is about 60k over priced since I could buy a used GT3 cup car in great condition for 120k-150k, and be competitive in World Challenge GT.

KiyoKix

With enough mods the RX7 could hang with the GT3RS. All it takes is research and development and money. Notice how long the GT3RS has been running in that series and then how long the RX7 has been there, it's the same for pretty much every team there is. Just like the RSX (Integra DC5) in the World Challenge, right now it's getting THRASHED (with a super duper size T) by the Integra owned by the same team (RealTime Acura), after some R&D time it will surely beat the old DC car.

tims

I am sorry but without a complete rework of the entire chassis you would never see the GT3RS on the track. I have been on track with these cars and with proper drivers are incredibly fast. Just from lap times at our local tracks these cars are much faster than any of the GTO RX7's of old. these cars are only a couple(2-3) seconds a lap slower than the GTS cars(Saleen S7, Corvette C5, and Viper ACR). fastest 3rd gen I have seen is nearly 10 seconds a lap slower on the same track, and this car has all the race parts that can put on a 3rd gen(dog ring gear box, triple adjustable Penske shocks, radial slicks, lightened chassis and body). the developement time would be so long that the newer GT3 would be on the track before you caught the older ones. this is a highly developed purpose built race car not a modified road car. If Mazda spent the time and money to develope a purpose built race car in this fashion and designed it to look similair to its road car you would have something. professional race cars are light years clear of modified road cars.

racedriver

I agree with tims, and i've been roadracing a 93 rx7 since 97. Its hard to compete with factory engineers, lots of weight over the rear tires, awesome brakes, and more bottom end torque any 13b will ever have. I was watching an alms race and it took Ron Fellows (top driver) a whole 2 laps to pass a gt3rs with his factory 600+ hp , tube frame, factory supported corvette.

maxpesce

The MAIN reason there are no competitive RX-7s in North American or European GT racing is that MAZDA has no reason to provide factory support &/or R&D to teams running a car that has not been sold in these markets since 1995 Back when the RX-7 was available here they so dominated IMSA GTU & GTO that by the time the 3rd gen came on the market IMSA had restriced rotaries to the point of making it almost impossible for them to be competitive.
The RX-7 is still competitive in it home market (JGTC) and I am guessing that by 2004 we will be seeing RX-8s in GT racing in North America.

racedriver

jgtc , its competitive, but don't forget its with a 3 rotor and very little stock parts.

KiyoKix

Not to start a stupid argument, but what you said just proves (tims) that all they really need is development time. The GT3RS while it is a RIDICULOUS beast, is still based on the 911 Turbo. All they did was take plenty of time to R&D about the car what works and doesn't and what everyone else has. If Mazda did the same it would have the same results, they've just never really had a reason too yet unfortunately. Hopefully it's time is soon.

BTW, if anyone was wondering Cam had his FD in the Virginia round of the World GT series (the final race), so he skipped road atlanta, but did come back for the final race (you actually get to see his car this time on the re-air on SPEED). Unfortunately he had a problem with the car going off course (forgot what happened to him cause I was busy talking to someone) and didn't finish but was in 16th place at the time (making his was up). The last race at Laguna he started in 16th I believe and finished in 12th. So I guess he isn't gonna call it quits after this year ...hopefully.

bradrx7

scratchjunkie... I wasn't ******* M2 or the car, I was ******* the fooking price. $100K is about $50K too much for that car.

maxpesce

When RX-7s were dominating IMSA GTO that was w/ 3 rotors also so whats the piont? JGTC rules are much more restrictive about oem part content than IMSA GTO ever was.

bradrx7

Regarding a GT3RS Porsche versus a track RX7:

I have some REAL data for you guys from last weekend at Texas World Speedway. I have a friend, Randy Posejpal, who just bought a GT3RS that finished 6th OVERALL at LeMans in 2001 and has been reworked for ALMS/Grand-Am. Randy has a second seat in the car and I went for a ride with him (WOW), PLUS we were on track together during the instructor sessions. Bottom line, my car was turning 1:56.5s with .8 bar boost. Randy turned 1:51s. He is on Goodyear slicks, I am on Hoosiers. His car is probably capable of 1:48s on the track, I am capable of maybe 1:54s with 12psi and new tires with a perfect lap.

One lap, we entered the long main straight with Randy behind me. I pointed him by and pulled in behind his car. For those of you who do not road race, it is very hard to catch back up to someone like that but I was able to get back into Randy's draft and stay about 6 car lengths back into turn 1 at about 150. He did leave me through the turn 1-2 sweeper because of stickier tires and better overall grip. As good as I have made my car handle, the GT3RS is damn strong.

That is REAL data, same day, same session, same track.

KiyoKix

I understand how strong the GT3RS is (did anyone watch the final round of World GT...the battle between Pobst/GT3RS and Yound/Saleen was just short of incredible! ), I've been in love with that car for a long time now (I like the GT3 more than the GT2 despite the fact that the GT2 is faster, I just like the pureness of the GT3). All I'm merely stating is that given enough research and development you COULD campaign an FD RX7 with successful results against the GT3RS. It will take a lot of work to get that to happen because they have a huge headstart (which is why whenever a new car is entered into the series they ALMOST never do "well"). Just think about it, what were are basically doing as a club is doing research and development (except we don't get paid for it...haha) on a car that is basically 16 yrs old and trying to get it to compete/exceed cars that are newer and used with a wealth of knowledge that wasn't available when our cars were made. Basically we're "Mazda Engineers" and just don't realize it...

tims

you have some similair looking models confused. the GT3RS is the cars run in ALMS and Grand Am, a GT3 Cup car is the cars seen in Speed World Challenge GT(these are not the same car under the sheet metal), and a GT3RS is much faster on a track than a GT2. If your friend indeed has a GT3RS and cannot put at least 10 seconds a lap on any RX7, you are either one heck of a driver, your friend needs some more seat time, or that was not a GT3RS. I have seen pro caliber drivers in GT3RS's lapping consistently 5plus seconds a lap over equally competent drivers in GT3 cup cars. Also in world challenge cars are restricted to even the field some cars run smaller tires and air restricters to even things out. The GT2 race car is so old now that even with an unrestricted engine(unlimited boost) it cannot keep up with a well driven GT3RS. the problem with the RX7 is the technology is dated and short of redisigning the entire chassis you will always be at a disadvantage to the newer purpose built race cars. this is what was done to the Japanese touring car mentioned earlier. the body looks similair but the entire chassis was changed. this is not a heavily modified road car.

bradrx7

Tims,
I KNOW the difference between a GT3RS and GT3Cup car. Randy's car is a GT3RS (as I said) out of Kevin Buckler's Racer's Group which imported it from Seikel in europe (who ran it to 6th at LeMans in 2001). Mike Hartige had his new GT3Cup car there last weekend, too. It WAs interesting to compare the two. Mike ran a low lap of 1:51 and change during qualifying.

Now, my RX7 is VERY well setup and I have been driving TWS since 1970. As I said, can do a 1:54 on new tires on a perfect lap. Randy was shaking down the car for the forst time and was building more and more speed all weekend.

I cannot keep up with OR compete with either of these vehicles or drivers. If you read the posts, that was my point. However, their cars are NOT 5 seconds per minute faster than my car, during last weekend, at my home track. you are correct about the technology, etc. I was trying to explain to those earlier posters that the WC Rx7s are never going to be competitive race cars again in 2 rotor trim.

KiyoKix

I wish they could use the 3 rotor in the 7 for the challenge, like I said we're always gonna be chasing the competition because we have to make out technology from basically scratch (or learn to adapt to theirs) because of the fact that our cars are "old". It's possible, but I don't know if it's worth it to people to do it right now for those classes, I'd love to see it though! I wonder what they're gonna do with the RX8 since nobody has really seen the limits or reactions that the motor has to modifications.

Mazderati

iTrader: (3)

I had the opportunity to attend the last round of the Speed World Challenge at VIR the other weekend and was able to talk to Cameron Worth and the Pettit team who were very cool guys by the way. Cam took the time to answer a couple of questions I had and the rest of the crew was not only nice, but very funny as well.

The car that Cam and the Pettit crew are campaigning now is not the original GT car that won the GT race in 98'. It is, in fact a newer car which is different in some ways (I'm not sure as to the exact specs. of the original).

I read the SCCA Speed rules regarding the RX-7s, but Cam's car runs a single Garrett. If I remember correctly he was running 6-8 lbs. of boost through the motor as well. Cam said that they have had some "teething problems" with this car and have yet to get things sorted out completly.

Cam and the crew also mentioned the fact that they were accustomed to running on sticky Hoosier slicks and have had to do quite a bit of adjusting to compensate for the loss of traction while running on the Toyo tires.

One more thing was the "For Sale" sign in the rear glass. I asked them what the deal was, hoping they weren't quitting racing all together, and the response I received mentioned something along the lines of Mazda's possible offerings of four factory backed RX-8s sometime very soon.

Mazderati

iTrader: (3)

KiyoKix

I can't remember where I heard that, BUT I've also heard something about Mazda having a few (I didn't hear 4 though) RX8 factory backed cars. I really hope so, it'll be pretty sweet. I'm sure Peter Farrell will also campaign a few cars too.