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550/id2000 on pfc

Old 01-26-19, 09:10 PM
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550/id2000 on pfc

Looking for a little help with a new fuel system. Went from an 850/1680 setup, to a 550/1680 setup, still wasn't satisfied so just ordered a new rail and some id2000s from ffe. Looking for a base tune that will get me a good starting point to start and idle. I think at one point I was a member of the yahoo group, but I no longer have that datalogit box. Working on getting my hands on another one. Setup is EFR8374, stock ports, pump gas, stock 550/id2000s, Walbro 400, IGN-1a coils, GM 3bar. Willing to compensate for your time digging me out a base tune.
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Old 02-04-19, 07:38 PM
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Got my hands on a datalogit. Still need 550/2000 single basemap to get started.
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Old 02-05-19, 01:28 PM
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I can give you a map for stock blue printed ports, Force Performance HTA GT3582R T3 1.06, 550/1600 injectors, with all the supporting mods needed for longevity.
Mail me at [email protected]
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Old 02-10-19, 12:40 PM
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Still looking. Getting close to getting the car running, a base timing and/or fuel map for denso 550/id2000s runing 40 or 43.5 base pressure. Just need a good safe starting point.
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Old 02-10-19, 04:05 PM
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I'm running the same fuel injectors with a street port, I can send you my map.
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Old 02-11-19, 09:25 AM
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Originally Posted by jsemerica View Post
I'm running the same fuel injectors with a street port, I can send you my map.
Thanks. PM Sent.

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Old 02-20-19, 11:48 AM
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Still looking for that elusive single turbo street port 550/2000 map. Have a few maps that are close but not exactly like my setup.
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Old 02-20-19, 06:02 PM
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The car idles on the primary injectors only. Thus the default PFC map will start and idle fine with that map if the air pump and ISC solenoid are on the engine.
If air pump is removed or the ACV, then 02 FB needs to be turned off. If the ISC solenoid is removed, you then have a manual idle like an old carburetor engine.
But first before you do any tuning, properly adjusting the throttle body:
(1) cold start hot wax rod works properly
(2) throttle cable not too tight as to keep throttle from closing, when floored nor over stressing the cable
(3) manual idle adjust screw open at lease 1/4 turn from fully closed.
(4) air adjusting screw opened about 1.5 turns
(5) auto cruise cable not keep throttle open.
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Old 02-20-19, 11:23 PM
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That's a good basic checklist. Airpump, acv and thermowax all removed. Throttle cable is new and has freeplay, need to double check the aas screw. More importantly, spent the better part of this evening going through and highlighting all the pertinent info from your prep/tuning/usage notes and Brian Davies' single turbo manual. Only two concerns I have before I start the car this weekend is making sure I have the right data (even for the denso 550s since 40psi base is a slightly higher pressure than what they're rated for; and secondly that the base ignition map is going to be safe enough. Brian Davies manual gets a little vague on how much timing retard is necessary before attempting any tuning from the base map. Some solid, proven transition and overlap data from denso 550s to id2000s would be helpful too.
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Old 02-25-19, 09:11 AM
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Adding some notes to your quote below for where I believe I am at.
Originally Posted by cewrx7r1 View Post
The car idles on the primary injectors only. Thus the default PFC map will start and idle fine with that map if the air pump and ISC solenoid are on the engine.
If air pump is removed or the ACV, then 02 FB needs to be turned off. If the ISC solenoid is removed, you then have a manual idle like an old carburetor engine.
But first before you do any tuning, properly adjusting the throttle body:
(1) cold start hot wax rod works properly Check!
(2) throttle cable not too tight as to keep throttle from closing, when floored nor over stressing the cable Check!
(3) manual idle adjust screw open at lease 1/4 turn from fully closed. Check!
(4) air adjusting screw opened about 1.5 turns Check!
(5) auto cruise cable not keep throttle open. Check (no cruise)!
I see a lot of people changing their transition settings so that the Threshold % was lower, and the minimum secondary opening was lower. Since the secondaries aren't as efficient at flowing for low duty cycles, I'm wanting to go to ~45-50% and leaving the duration above 1ms. Here's an attempt to explain why I'm thinking this, at a high level:
  • 850cc/min injector coming on for 1.5ms ==> 850 *0.0015*60=76.5cc
  • 550cc/min injector at 40% duty ==> 550*40% = 220cc
    • So at ~40% duty, the 220cc demand would reduce 76.5cc from the primary, and open the secondary for the minimum 1.5ms to deliver this amount.
  • 2200cc/min injector coming on for 1.5ms ==> 2200 * 0.0015*60= 198cc
    • For the same 220cc requirement, the secondary is now flowing 198cc, and the primary is to reduce to 20cc.
Since I know the flow pattern of the 2000cc injectors seems to smooth out around 1ms, that's why I'm hoping to leave the minimum opening time a bit higher, or to increase the transition point for the primaries so they're not reducing to such a low cc draw. Thoughts on this? I haven't had to deal with staged injectors like this before, so any feedback is appreciated.


I also noticed that while I upgraded my fuel system this winter I'm having some concern surrounding my map. This is primarily because when I read the current settings, I saw that the secondary injectors were set for 100% and 1500cc, when I do believe they're 850cc OEMs (while my injector duty and fuel pressure agree). Comparing my map to the sample map within FC-Edit, i'm very different, however, the "SR" map that's available is much closer where where I currently am. I'm just more loaded up with fuel in from cell (3,5) to (16,17), with most of it being ~1200 rpm ramping up boost and then ~3600-4000 rpm while around 7-10psi. The difference is ~10% of the base map in msec at these points.

I am on the stock twins, so I'm thinking this was my edits to try and have the transitions smooth out between injector switches. If anyone is willing to share their 550/2200 fuel maps, I like to use them to compare, and then make adjustments for a starting point on my side. Worst case, I think I'll be pretty heavy in fuel, but I'd like a better starting point before moving into on-boost tuning in case I'm jumping into sub-9AFRs as the primary turbo kicks and secondary injectors transition.

Thanks!

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Last edited by ConSynX; 02-25-19 at 07:06 PM. Reason: Because I'm an idiot and put my Hotmail email instead of my Yahoo...
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Old 02-25-19, 11:40 AM
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Started the car this weekend on the 550/2000s. I used a tune I found on the pfc yahoo group. Changed all the settings for my setup. It was based on an ignition map that cewrx7 had tweaked for someone else years ago. It started and idled, just idled way too high (12-1500) and way too rich (11-11.5), but it's a start.

Disregard the commentary lol. Unfortunately my voltage was too low for my wideband to come on in this video. Something is up with the exciter wire on my alternator or something. You have to blip the throttle to get it to start charging. Seems like good vacuum too.


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Old 02-25-19, 01:12 PM
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aplscrambles which map did you grab (assuming it's from the FC-Datalogit-user group?
If so, which did you go with, SR, Jeff Schutz, or BaseMaps_Jan072009 (or something else)?
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Old 02-27-19, 03:53 PM
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Originally Posted by ConSynX View Post
aplscrambles which map did you grab (assuming it's from the FC-Datalogit-user group?
If so, which did you go with, SR, Jeff Schutz, or BaseMaps_Jan072009 (or something else)?
Yes, I found it on the Datalogit yahoo group. I believe the person who originally posted it's username was lobo something? The filename that was created after chuck tweaked it was something like "lobo improved map". Then I further tweaked it for my setup. I'll send it to you if you'd like to check it out, send my your email. I think it is fairly safe timing, and is now set up for ign coils, a gm 3 bar, denso 550s/ id2000s. Here is a better vid I took of the actual first cold test/startup showing how this map runs on my fresh stockport single turbo, with no elbow attached, and no belt on the a/c, p/s.
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Old 02-27-19, 11:21 PM
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You have to look at the engine requirements for duty cycle to get high enough for injector transition to happen, what your mods are. and driving style.
A close to stock engine with the secondary vacuum throttle plates still in the UIM, does not need much.

A modified engine with increased air flow demands can use earlier injector transition especially if using stock 550 primaries and if the secondary vacuum throttle plates are removed.
Such as my engine. It takes a cruise speed of near 110 mph before the secondaries come on. Under boost I need the secondaries sooner to offset the opened secondary throttle plates to provide
better mixing of fuel with air. At full throttle, there is a lot of air going through the two secondaries as compared to the small primary.

Testing/logging will determine which works best for you and YOU CAN TAKE THAT TO THE BANK!
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Old 04-06-19, 09:21 PM
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whats the datalogit yahoo group? I'm also on the same boat. Cant get mine to run well after all my mods. I need a base map that'll support my mods.
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