I'm not going to make this a drawn out long story, but as some of you know I have changed my under the hood a few times trying to get the Camden supercharger with a efi/ecu setup to work perfect. This has been a very costly, long frustrating road I have traveled. I do like Superchargers better than Turbo's because of the low end tourque, feel, and sound.

My question is if I can't get this setup to work after this summer to where I want it. Should I just do the change over to a Turbo or keep going with this Supercharger? I would Just like some of your opinions as to what you guys would do.

Please post

Thanks

 

That's a really hard decision Deena... You've put a lot of time and work into this project and I'd hate to see the only cool Supercharged RX7 in the area convert to what everyone else's RX7 is. I think it should depend on whether you still wanna be different than everyone else or if you wanna join the group. Sometimes it costs a lot to be different, I would know

I say, don't listen to anyone's opinions on this poll, do what YOU and Codeblue (sorry forgot his name ) would want to do. You'll be happier that way


~Josh Ryan~

 

Turbo gives you more flexibility I think....SC is nice for steady power band but hard to dial in.

 

Deena, you have ioTus, which is a good turbo setup. I think you should stick with the supercharger on blue. It seems to me that all the parts are there, so the big spending is done. Now it's just a matter of setting each peice to work with the others. I'd hate to see you turn back, when all that's left is just a few turns of some screws. I think you guys would be a great information resource for people wanting to do one or the other, having both cars. I say hang in there, it'll happen with blue.

 

My guess is the reason that the last motor went out was detonation due to heat. Your set up is proven to make power. Since your running 10 psi without a intercooler, I would try a water injection system. Compressing your intake air to 10 psi generates alot of heat. Heat is bad. Heat can can cause your intake charge to ingnite (like a deisel) before it even gets a spark. The water injection itself wont give you any more power but will enable you to use the power you already have more safely. I think I want one for my next mod myself.

http://www.coolingmist.com/categorie...n=set&res=1024

 

Supercharged all the way. No need to have 2 torbo'd vehicles. Have one of each!

 

Inspiration for you, notice he's running coolingmist water injection

https://www.rx7club.com/showthread.php?p=4428751

 

I like dr.jones63 idea, watermist, or you could do a v-mount intercooler setup that would give the appearance on the outside (looking into the grill) of being turbocharged. Not to mention that both of those options would further cool down your engine which is what you needed to do already right?

 

how would u intercool a camden supercharger?

 

yeah you allready have a turboed first gen! keep blue supercharged

 

Keep it Supercharged, some of us look upto you and that car as an ideal ever since that krispy creme meet a year ago. Too many turbos on the street and not enough 'unique' expressions. Show 'em what a rx7 with low end torque is capable of!

 

well, i like the supercharger. but if you can't get it to where you can drive it. you gotta do something else. time can tell.

 

Well once ya get the microtech back, see how that does for ya. If you dont like it, then ya can go turbo, but you can also see how that is by driving the other car. Turbo lag sucks, and I like the even power of a super... but to each thier own... plus drivability is always a factor...

 

He's not running a camden though, different charger and setup entirely that I believe flows more, plus higher compression rotors since I believe Deena is running TII rotors right? That's really where you're being held back Deena! If you are that is.

My opinion, you just got Iotus's turbo FB, right? Stick with a supercharger, but get something bigger and badder that can flow more CFM. Like a roots type charger, or an a large Eaton (not like an m90 that everyone uses... too small).

Also, as suggested, I believe water injection would be the best type of cooling rather than an intercooler. Lower the intake temps, run more boost or leaner a/f ratios or a more aggressive timing map and get more power! The rotary really comes alive in the timing maps, if you haven't paid much attention to those, you should have Of course if you don't have proper cooling then don't, have you logged any air intake temps AFTER the supercharger by chance?

 

i say keep it supercharged and then go with an intercooler and also the water/alcohol injection and i think that you would be able to run it just fine like that. personaly i love the turbo charger. but i think that a supercharger is cool.

 

I'm for the supercharger!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Not wishing to be unsympathetic, I would just like to say this story is pretty typical of the people I have known over the past 20 years tinkering with rotary engines, trying to get another 100 or more horsepower by adding a blower of one sort or the other, radical porting, exotic intake systems, etc. I have known some who gave up and sold their cars after never getting them sorted properly. Mazda spent years engineering their turbo cars, and they are not exactly known for longevity, although some people do get lucky of course. (Please don't tell us about your TII that is still running perfectly after 400,000 miles and never replaced anything but the spark plugs).

Interestingly, the people I know who have struggled with aftermarket blowers and various exotic intake systems have NOT been the people who have criticised my simple solution of putting in a V8. Some of them have spent at least as much time and money as I have. I only added about 100 pounds to the car, I get almost the same fuel mileage as with my rotary powered car, and when I put the pedal down, there is certainly no turbo lag, or any other kind of lag!

 

I only have 137,000 on my 88 AE but its still going strong. To each his or her own but to me having a rotary is over half the fun. And as time goes by with more and more rx7's leaving the road mine will get rarer and rarer. It's all about satisfaction. It's so cool to dust those V8's with a 1.3 liter at the track.

 

13BT. Cheap, easy done.

You can probably squeeze 300hp out of a TII motor with the stock ECU and a S-AFC. Maybe more? Pretty good power for a lightweight chassis.

Unless you are really rich and have to have something "different". It'll cost you more and you will drive it less.

 

I'd vote supercharging but your only option is camden if you can't do your own fabbing. And considering that, I'd have to recommend turbo for you, because it will seriously take the car to a new level of power compared to a two rotor straight lobed roots blower.

 

unless u went with a LT1 or LS1 with all aluminum top end, i call bs. i'm not against v8 swaps in 7's when done right, but most people don't do them right, and wind up gaining 300-400 lb's when they were under the impression they'd only gain 100. theres a guy in the 1st gen section who recently posted about all the v8 bastards lying to him, he gained 400 lb's putting a 302 in his FB. anyways, i'm interested in what motor setup u did, should do a post on it

 

amen, seems like different is costing you more money for less output... theres something wrong with that formula... thats why i voted turbo. and kettlman hit the nail on the head, if its not working for u u gotta do something else, unless u got the unlimited money cheat code of life figured out i'm sure u can't afford to keep dumping money trying to break 200hp with this supercharger setup...

 

Hurrah, about time you see the light! If you want to stay supercharged (which I suggest), ditch that damn camden unit, burn the thing and make a video of it so we can all enjoy! Either pick up a paxton unit and modify it similar to what pianoprodigy has been doing, or fabricate up your own setup using a good twin-screw charger. If those two options are out of your scope, then turbo it.

 

Thanks everyone that has posted. Sure is good to have this forum for help.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dr.jones63

My guess is the reason that the last motor went out was detonation due to heat. Your set up is proven to make power. Since your running 10 psi without a intercooler, I would try a water injection system. Compressing your intake air to 10 psi generates alot of heat. Heat is bad. Heat can can cause your intake charge to ingnite (like a deisel) before it even gets a spark. The water injection itself wont give you any more power but will enable you to use the power you already have more safely. I think I want one for my next mod myself.

I just changed my boost to the 10lb pulley. The last motor was with the larger pulley. I might consider this water injection. Thanks for the info Don. I'm changing the pulley when the Microtech comes back to the larger pulley.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dDuB

He's not running a camden though, different charger and setup entirely that I believe flows more, plus higher compression rotors since I believe Deena is running TII rotors right? That's really where you're being held back Deena! If you are that is.

Drew, yes I’m running T11 rotors, and have Iotus’s turbo’d car. I love Iotus’s turbo’d car, and it’s a fairly quick car, but not nearly as exciting to drive as Blue. Maybe it’s cause I do like the low end more. Iotus has much more power after it spools up than Blue does. I'm pretty sure Blue can still beat Iotus. I’m wondering how hard a changeover on a different supercharger would be.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elysian

amen, seems like different is costing you more money for less output... theres something wrong with that formula... thats why i voted turbo. and kettlman hit the nail on the head, if its not working for u u gotta do something else, unless u got the unlimited money cheat code of life figured out i'm sure u can't afford to keep dumping money trying to break 200hp with this supercharger setup...

Can see your point Adam, but Blues already broke 212 with the old motor. New motor should get a few more. Honestly, I do wish I had a bit more with the Camden supercharger, but truthfully I’m not looking at trying to get much more than over 250hp with it if thats even possible. I’m not cutting Atkins/Camden down or anything, but to be truthful, I’m not sure how much more, or what else is needed to be done get that 271hp that they say this SC can do. Ive wanted to represent them for the good, but I’m not liked by any of them anymore. I’m pretty much on my own with the “what to do next”. This is sorta why I made this poll for advice.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SonicRaT

Hurrah, about time you see the light! If you want to stay supercharged (which I suggest), ditch that damn camden unit, burn the thing and make a video of it so we can all enjoy! Either pick up a paxton unit and modify it similar to what pianoprodigy has been doing, or fabricate up your own setup using a good twin-screw charger. If those two options are out of your scope, then turbo it.

Smile, I should have known you would find this thread. LoL I do value your opinion. I sort of would like to stay Supercharged. So I see my options to be.

1. Change Superchargers or deal with what I have since Camden has given up on my car.

2. Go Turbo

I have met someone in Idaho that is very good with these cars, and modding them. I will talk to him about other options that you suggest. This is my last attempt with this. I can’t really drive the car in the winter here, so if any changes it will be this winter.

 

The fact is that any conversion or major modification like this is a seemingly endless process of solving engineering problems, whether you are an engineer or not. Some of us just like to tinker and enjoy the challenge of solving interesting problems. Even the manufacturers do a lot of trial an error, and if you read about these specialty cars in the mags, a lot of manufacturers have cars developed by experienced hot rodders because they end up with a better product.

Doing an engine swap involves solving a lot of problems, but they are mostly pretty straightforward and don't involve a lot of rocket science, just time and fabrication skills. But a major engine mod like Blue is doing is much more difficult, and the outcome is less certain. When the results are not what you expect, there is always that constant question of whether you have done something wrong or the components are defective. This is expecially true with the electronic bits. My Ford V8 swap would certainly have better economy and driveablility with fuel injection, but that is completely outside my expertise, so I used a carb.

Regarding the comment about "adding 400 pounds with a V8 swap" that is a good estimate for a big block with iron heads. My Ford 302 has aluminum heads, intake, water pump and radiator. With no AC or power steering, but with electric windows, a sunroof and complete stock interior, my 84 GSL weighs exactly 2550 fully serviced, without fuel. That includes a Ford AOD trans which weighs 175 pounds with torque converter. These weights measured using a very accurate set of electronic scales. If I had used a 5 speed manual, the car would be about 100 pounds lighter, but I thought I needed both hands on the steering wheel! I did add a few pounds with my 2nd gen brake conversion because of the big discs.

So how much does your car weigh with the supercharger installation?