canonize-ryda

hi i have a 86 s4 rx7 and was wondering if this manifold would connect to my engine to connect a turbo.. i dont have the sources to make a custom manifold and this one maybe works? thanks.

KneeDragger85

are you trying to do an na to turbo conversion?

misterstyx69

iTrader: (142)

I wouldn't use that Manifold anyways,,
what is it?.,.like 80 bucks on Ebay?..you GET what you pay for.
..
Why can't you just throw an S4 turbo/manifold on the engine?

Aaron Cake

iTrader: (1)

I have heard that with some turbos, the eBay knockoff manifolds and included T4 to T3 adapter have just enough clearance to fit over the S4 LIM.

But, why not just use the TII intake manifolds by port matching the TII LIM to the 6 port block? It doesn't sound like you intend to keep the aux ports functional anyway...

canonize-ryda

how hard would port matching be.. im looking to start my na to turbo conversion and i have maybe 500-750dollars to get started. i figured with this manifold and a garret t3 t4 would bolt to it and all i would do is then change to tII injectors, drop in any intercooler and piping, use a tee off the oil pressure sender for oil supply have it dump into oil pan, use coolant line off top of s4 intake manifold for coolant supply, and find some way to get my exhuast to bolt up to this manifold............. am i even nearly correct? arron i have read your forum over the net about this and was wanting to avoid the welding and notching but by useing this manifold.... thanks since i will be starting this project in the next few months also would this mean only using 4 ports and leaving 2 with out a purpose? or having all ports open?

Aaron Cake

iTrader: (1)

http://www.aaroncake.net/rx-7/4portlimto6port.htm

You'll need some kind of fuel management other than just larger injectors. An RTek, standalone, or at the very least, an S-AFC.

canonize-ryda

k ive read it and still wondering since a t2 mani is more expensive if this mani up ther will work? and as for fuel do u have anything on how to go about running one or hooking it up?

johnturbo

listen to aaron hes the god of the 6port

canonize-ryda

i have read alot of his stuff on it and i was thinking using this mani i could avoid port matching and all that. just bolt the turbo on to this and do the rest of the tII swap and bam few months later and have me some type of progress towards have a turbo charged car..(its one of my dreams lol)

canonize-ryda

i figured i could use a kit like this to bolt to that manifold so i would avoid using most of the t2 parts. it comes with to4e turbo, billet material intercooler lots of aluminum piping and couplers(red like i want), external wastegate, oil feed and return line good for 550 psi, oil catch tank, blow off valve, boost controller and turbo timer all for 500... all i would need then are injectors and apexi s afc right? or am i wrong?
https://www.rx7club.com/picture.php?...ictureid=32920

also woould i need a fd fuel pump or similiar 255lph pump.. and as far as injectors whats the best to use to go with this sort of setup? t2 secondaries and primaries? thanks for any help

Aaron Cake

iTrader: (1)

How your standalone/fuel controller is hooked up depends on what you use and will be documented in the instructions.

TII manifolds are dirt cheap, used. But keep in mind that the stock HT-18 is a 50 year old design and pretty crappy.

I'm not sure what any of that means. You will either need to make a custom manifold so the turbo clears the NA lower intake (there is NOT a lot of room) or you will need to port match the TII lower intake and run TII manifolds. I can't say for certain whether this eBay manifold with the T3 spacer will clear. There are too many variables. I have seen pictures of such a setup but don't know what turbo was used.

Making a 6 port turbo requires some fabrication.

Made in China no-name eBay ****. The only thing I would consider using from that kit is the intercooler (if it has internal finning...some don't) and the intercooler piping.

How much power are you trying to make?

canonize-ryda

im just trying to make in a wide range from 200-300hp just maybe a little over stock t2. nothing to much as i dont really drive it much and my engine only has maybe less than 10k miles on it. but if this mani fit, it would make the turbo hook up? and the ht-18 i found was used and was over 500 dollars alone. so is there any alternat turbos out there new or used that would work fine for up to 300 hp?

RotaryRocket88

iTrader: (7)

Whaaattt? A stock HT-18 with the manifold is only worth about $1-200. S5s are at the higher end due to the better manifold/turbine design. I sold an S4 for something like $150 awhile back.

For up to about 250whp, you can just use the stock turbo to keep it cheap and easy. Some random Chinese T04E is going to need a lot more to tune it than an SAFC.

canonize-ryda

so a turbo rated for 600 hp would be hard to tune then? the t04e is only 300 lol, i found a hole conversion kit for the na all it doesnt come with is some kind of fuel management, comes with all the proper stuff to bolt right to the na block.

Aaron Cake

iTrader: (1)

What do you want? 200HP or 300HP? There is a 100HP split between the two.

For example, at 200HP you can use the NA ECU with an S-AFC and TII injectors, with a TII fuel pump and a HT-18.

At 300HP, you are into at least an RTek and at the very least a hybrid stock turbo with 550CC/720CC injectors and an upgraded fuel pump.

Honestly I'd recommend you stop at the moment, and then just research, research, research. Read up on turbo sizing, how standalones work, read the documentation of the products you are considering using.

canonize-ryda

yes i am reading and waiting i have no money for a few months and am wondering what to spend 1000 on to get the most bang for my buck. i have found most of what i need for under that besides the fuel pump, injectors, and ecu tuning, now whats an average rtek costs used?

Neobeatz

your on my same mission but i am def going aaron's way about it, because its been proven and a daily driver , which i dont want to drive my baby daily but want it that reliable, wonder what it would cost to port the engine , 3rd gen fuel pump,bigger fuel injectors, fuel rail ?, upgraded intake manifold, turbo kit Garrett turbo , ecu(motec?), and all the sensors,upgraded exhuast ,plus of course an on board comp to look at all this what would it run and im sure im missing more to the list.
( midrange price , im sure its around the 7,000 to 10,000 range if not more

at the moment im willing to spend up to 5 grand, in what steps should these upgrades be done if you dont have all that money

oh and another question can you see the info your ecu is making in real time and in what way would that benefit you in the sense of tuning your engine while your out and about.

can you trend with these programs the different parameters that are important for you as far as power and reliability goes and can they be changed on the fly as needed threw the software if you decided to race lets say one weekend and then want to change it back the next day to drive the car to work or does this even make sense lol

Aaron Cake

iTrader: (1)

Buy shares in BP. They are only at $46 now and will go up further. If you had bought earlier in the summer when it was $29-30, imagine how much money you would have now.

What I'm saying is that you should probably save your money until you have a plan.

I can't say for sure what the cost of an RTek used is. Best bet is to head over to the buy and sell forums and look around. I only recommended an RTek because it is an easy way to get an ECU where you can adjust fuel and spark. Personally I would jump directly to a full standalone but that is becaused I have installed them many times and have a lot of experience tuning.

If you are going to run an RTek, you are locked into only a few injector combinations. I'd say stick with 550CC/720CC and go from there. Use an FD fuel pump if you want to stick under 300HP.

Keep in mind though that porting the TII LIM to match up with the 6 port block is the same as wiring open the aux ports on an NA. So you will experience a decrease in torque below about 3500 RPM (the turbo will help some), decreased engine vacuum and a little bit of a mileage decrease.

My way is the most complicated way about it. The easiest way is porting the TII LIM. Both have their advantages and disadvantages. My personal opinion now, after all the stuff I've done with 6 port turbos, is that the greatest strength of the 6 port design is being able to use a reasonably sized turbo combined with the functional aux ports to have an awesome powerband. Not that there is anything wrong with wide open ports and a huge turbo, but for street use, honestly, a 300HP RX-7 w/ 300 FT-LBS of torque available in the midrange is an AWESOME car.

Porting costs nothing if you do it, because the only investment is time (and perhaps a Dremel). But of course, the engine needs to come apart to do it. Here's a video example of me doing some porting for my '76 Cosmo:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y1Gy5sVMK3o

Remember: any turbo kit you buy will be for the TII or the FD, so your only choice is to use the TII LIM. $5000 is the average cost of a full turbo kit. And by "full" I mean that it contains the turbo, manifold, oil lines, sometimes a wastegate, and a downpipe. The rest is up to you.


The Motec is an awesome ECU, but there are far more affordable ECUs that get you 90% of the way and are a fine choice. Haltech Platinum series, for example. Or if you are a DIY type, Megasquirt.

You're about right there. The easiest thing to say is that for a full turbo upgrade, including all of the ECU and support stuff to run it, $10K is a good number. Might be a little less, might be a little more.

One thin to consider is that when talking about my project, I have $5000 in just the turbo and the hoses alone. Now that's not to say that you couldn't do it for $5K. If you can make a turbo manifold, fabricate your intercooler system, make your own exhaust, do all the wiring and tuning, you can do it, no question. But that's a lot of "ifs". The moment you start paying someone to, say, weld aluminum, the price jumps.

All ECUs that don't suck can datalog and tune in real time. The better ECUs can take this datalog and use it to autotune the fuel tables while you drive, as long as you get it close enough so the car can be driven.

canonize-ryda

ok should i jsut swap in a s4 t2 engine with the 5 spd tranny and ecu and wairing harness for around 1500? that way the s4 t2 would come with all needed parts and the only thing from there wuld be a new fuel pump and a custom driveshaft. i could do this rather cheap if i pick up the engine in my van... since 5-10k is WAY outs my range for now. what would u guys suggest?

RotaryRocket88

iTrader: (7)

I'd suggest a TII swap to keep things simple. You'd need the engine and ECU at the very least. The transmission is better and I would use it, but the wiring harness is unnecessary. But figure there's about another $1k in expenses to take care of the custom driveshaft, replacement hoses, gaskets, oil, etc... it adds up quickly. When I did my swap it cost me about $2500 + another $500 for larger injectors, fuel pump and an Rtek 1.7 chip.

Aaron Cake

iTrader: (1)

An S4 TII swap will be the easiest way to go. You'll need the complete drivetrain as documented in the FAQ, or you can leave the NA rear end in place and get a custom driveshaft (local driveline shop, Mazdatrix). The FAQ also documents the electronics you'll need. Off the top of my head: TII ECU, TII AFM, TII pressure sensor. The stock wiring harness is easily modified.

It is a far easier approach to do a TII swap than to turbocharge the NA engine.

canonize-ryda

ok the more i think it over im thinking a t2 swap is within my reach, i mean what do u think i could sell my na 13b for with under 10k? with the 5 speed tranny and my ecu? that would fund some of the build as well so if im looking at 3k at least its not 10k. and after i get the turbo 2 what would be the easiest mods to push the most power besides exhuast and intake? how much more hp would the s5 turbo give me? and would it benfit me to add a frnt mount intercooler over the stock one?

1988 vertible

the s4 turbo ii came stock with 182 hp and the s5 came with around 200 hp. but i have been told(not sure if its true) that if you put a s5 turbo ii in a s4 the wiring can be difficult, but i know its possible...

RotaryRocket88

iTrader: (7)

The primary reason for the S5 having more peak power from the factory is it ran 8 psi of boost, rather than the 6 psi the S4 did. Simple fix with boost controller.

The S5 turbocharger has a divided manifold and turbine housing, which results in faster spool and more low to mid-range torque. Top-end is essentially the same, or a tiny bit better.