diabolical1

iTrader: (3)

do you have any links or files that can be e-mailed? i would be interested in getting this for my library and study materials.

Liborek

Its from "famous" SAE 900032 - Prediction of Power Output Performance of the Rotary Engine by Gas Exchange Process Simulation. I'm pretty sure that Shainiac posted it over nopistons, but files seems lost Shoot me PM with e-mail

This really is something what everyone should have

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

lmao, i agree. i looked for that paper for YEARS!

F1Pilot

Yep, will definately be looking at driving off the PPs with the 'primary' ports activated as secondaries.

I should be able to try both with my throttle body. Just need to wait and see once its mounted how I can make it work.

I would be interested to see if mechanically driving around on the primary side ports only under 50% throttle would do much for the noise level.

John Huijben

iTrader: (1)

Sure, if you know what intake port closing or opening timing you want with that 40mm opening I can look up where the hole needs to be drilled, no prob.

Shainiac

iTrader: (7)

I have SAE 900032. If anyone needs it, PM me your email address.

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

its not really scientific, but when i switched from the stock engine to the P port, i used the same exhaust and the exhaust volume and tone will be the same, but the intake will be quieter

F1Pilot

Well I was chatting to Xtreme rotaries who have offered to do the PP sleeves for me. Basically they will be where he recommends for the port combo and they will be a threaded type, so no sealng issues.

I will be doing the finishing maching however, boring out the ID of the sleeve and the hand finishing required on the housing face.

When these are done though, I will measure the loaction of the centre of the PP hole, and we could work out the timing from there.

At least that way, it is all documented so when it makes less power than a stock 20B, everyone will know not to do it this way!!! (F*&kn hope not!! LOL)

F1Pilot

For info too, my plan for the exhaust is to run 2inch primaries, long style, into a merge collector before a 3 1/2 inch resonator (400mm long) then split into a twin muffler type, 2 x 2 1/2 inch, (500mm long).

Any thoughts on the Db level of this? The mufflers are being custom made by AES here in Australia. They are rockwool style.

I was also considering a butterfly valve on one of the 2 1/2inch entries to the rear muffler, activated by the LINK to open under whatever conditions required. (eg 50% throttle).

So when I light throttle around the street it will just be an extend port with a single 2 1/2inch exit.

SPiN Racing

I know im a little late into the thread.. but...

I am now the proud owner of a 13B made in the late 70s/80s that is a former hill climb engine.

It was in a late 60s Lola chassis owned and designed by my friend (Rip) Jim Bonsi.

The car was 4 wheel steering as well.. and had front and rear wings.

The engine is a 13B with very very large Bridge ports, primary and secondary.
Also it is a Full Peripheral port.

The intake has 6 runners, running up to a 6 barrel fuel injection throttle body.

The runners are progressive, primary, secondary, peripheral port.

The reason for this was cornering, and coming out of low speed turns at sub 30MPH. He had too much power when they all opened.. so it was a beast to drive.
Once he made the throttles progressive (with bosch coming to Florida to tune it for him) it was quite drivable, and a beast on Chimney Rock (NC).

RPM was 16-17K tops for the engine, when racing. There were a boatload of things he did to it outside what 99 percent of the rotary population is aware of. He was one of the original hard core fringe rotary builders. He was building single rotor engines in the late 70s, as well as a variety of 13B engines in all forms of trim for GT/equivalent racers of the 70s and 80s.

HP figured Im not gonna post, so I dont have to deal with the "experts" on the forum. But it is strong. We will leave it at that.

SO in a nutshell.... yes your design is sound. Expressly the individual runners and progressive throttle..

t-von

iTrader: (8)

Well i've actually fabricated my na 20b intake to use a butterfly valve set-up for my secondaries. Nothing wrong with keeping it simple when doing custom fabrication like this.

John Huijben

iTrader: (1)

Well your right, nothing wrong with keeping things simple, and vaccuum does work for some things, but for something like this I would go with an electronic setup. Especially with the low amount of vaccuum of a pp.

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

! wow sounds like quite a beast, um pics?

t-von

iTrader: (8)

Open your mine a little bit more here. It can work better than you think. Yes PP's have low vacuum levels however, when coupled with an fd vacuum chamber and a 1 way check valve, you can store the higher vacuum levels the engine will pull on decel every time the throttle closes. That hi vacuum level in the chamber is more than enough to control various vacuum related items. Been their done that!

F1Pilot

Well a monster motor requires a monster muffler to shut it up, so hopefully this custom made twin 2 1/2inch rear muffler by AES in Australia will be up to the job!!





It will be running long 2inch primaries through a merge collector into a 3 1/2inch resonator into this at the back. Will be loud, but how loud? I guess Ill find out.

GTRay

heh, I guess that's the perception in foreign markets. Yukon isn't a manufacturer. It's a model of truck/suv made by gm.

Minor detail and insignificant to the thread.

Ray

RZMotorsports

amazing design, would you be able to design one for a turbo application? in carbon fiber or kevlar?

RZMotorsports

We need more people like you in the rotary community willing to push the envelope.
Amazing job keep it up!

F1Pilot

What part exactly are we talking here? The manifold?

When I worked for an advanced composites company, we did make a carbon fibre plenum/runners that went on an Oz Rally car. Was pretty cool. Big job though, and even bigger in the $$$ department if its a one off. I do however still have contacts here in Oz who could make anything carbon. (or kevlar, glass, etc..)

F1Pilot

Well finally got home and had some parts arrive to get this moving.
Got the plates back from Xtreme rotaries, complete with thier new CNC porting. Check out the extend primaries:

Just needs a bit of hand finishing.

Got the dummy motor together to work out mounting.


Starting on intake manifold:

John Huijben

iTrader: (1)

Looking good! Any reason why your using plain steel for the intake manifold?

Christopher W.

iTrader: (2)

I agree with your muffler choice. I haven't had my hands on them yet, but they look really solid. I think the mild steel will really help keep the resonating, buzzing sounds down.

I am having Kevin build my resonator and twin mufflers for my 2nd gen 20B N/A. I am hoping for a pretty deep tone.

From what I have read, the only complaint on Kevin's design is that some people think they are too quiet. I think with the new perforated tubes he is trying, the volume level will come down even more so..

F1Pilot

I need to justify me buying a MIG!

I will have it ceramic coated, but it will be heavy. If it all works out to be amazing.....well I would look into an alloy one.

Christopher W.

iTrader: (2)

Kevin quoted my around 14lbs (31 kg) per side plus the resonator. I don't really know how that compares to light weight mufflers but I am more interested in sound quality than weight savings at this point.

I hope I get to tell you how they work before you can tell me..

F1Pilot

Haha, well my goal is to be finished before May. Because after then, Ill be awake ALOT and no time for 20B fun! (kids....)