'93 R1 vs. '07 C6 Vette
08-08-07, 11:40 AM
#26
rotary sensei
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And no, you will not be able to run stock twins at 17/18psi for 105,000 miles. That's simply not true and there are tons of people on this forum that have had theirs crap out on them in less than a tenth of that time AND with less boost. You even said so yourself that stock twins won't hold up very long, it's in an old post I found.
https://www.rx7club.com/showpost.php...4&postcount=21
https://www.rx7club.com/showpost.php...4&postcount=21
I said in that quote..
If the motor isn't ported uping the boost to 17 psi will get you those numbers but the turbos won't last long
Recap on your naive assertions...
1) You won't make 360-400 rwhp on stock twins.
You got handed your azz with facts and dynos they can and do make those hp levels. You were wrong.
2) You said the turbo's won't last at that level more than a couple passes didn't you?
I have been running those hp and boost levels for years and years, so have many others. You were wrong.
3) I took my turbos off and they will easily go another 35,000 miles and I have run high boost levels, so you saying the turbos won't last is nothing more than your naive opinion, again. You are wrong.
Last edited by Mr rx-7 tt; 08-08-07 at 11:48 AM.
08-08-07, 11:45 AM
#27
rotary sensei
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Thanks Webster, I'll be sure to try something sometime. 
But seriously, you guys wanna say you can push 30lbs. through stock twins and get 800hp and it'll be as reliable as a honda civic, by all means, go ahead. Lol, I mean, there are tons of people on the board who do it right? See'em all the time..... Normally their cars are sitting on blocks, but hey! There was this one guy who hit 399 right before his apex seal shot out of the exhaust pipe! Bet I hit 450hp when my car spiked to 20psi, so you're right, I guess you can get 400 on stock twins. Just gotta crank up the boost high enough and pray the car makes it down the track.
1reven7 has the only dyno chart I've ever seen where stock twins made more than 360hp. I'd be interested to see how his car held up considering that was 2 years ago. As far as any higher than that, 390-400... To what end? The twins just won't hold up, period.
But seriously, you guys wanna say you can push 30lbs. through stock twins and get 800hp and it'll be as reliable as a honda civic, by all means, go ahead. Lol, I mean, there are tons of people on the board who do it right? See'em all the time..... Normally their cars are sitting on blocks, but hey! There was this one guy who hit 399 right before his apex seal shot out of the exhaust pipe! Bet I hit 450hp when my car spiked to 20psi, so you're right, I guess you can get 400 on stock twins. Just gotta crank up the boost high enough and pray the car makes it down the track.1reven7 has the only dyno chart I've ever seen where stock twins made more than 360hp. I'd be interested to see how his car held up considering that was 2 years ago. As far as any higher than that, 390-400... To what end? The twins just won't hold up, period.
I do it and have for years. There are six cars around here that all run 15 psi on the stock twins and they also have for years. Yellow R1 has for years. Matty looks to have gotten it done on a stock ported engine at 15 psi , for years.
You don't know what you are talking about. Tell us about your vast rotary knowledge that you can make these claims and tell all of us who do it we can't?
08-08-07, 11:50 AM
#28
rotary sensei
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You should try running more boost so you can speak from experience. Stock twins last me about 2-3 years of high boost (17-19lbs.) Of course I only drive the car a few times a week but when I do I don't baby it. It can be done. Don't be so pesssimistic. By the way I blow by C6 vettes. The new Z06 I can only edge out by about half a car in the quarter.
John
John
Stock twins last me about 2-3 years of high boost (17-19lbs.)
08-08-07, 12:26 PM
#29
Eats, Sleeps, Dreams Rotary
mr rx7tt
people are scared to run boost because of the hersay that gets posted on this forum. yet the real rx7 people know that it can be done and in fact enjoy running alot of boost for yrs and smoke fools outthere. **** i have smoked a modded 03 z06 pretty good and others have even chimmed in on smoking the new z06.
people are scared to run boost because of the hersay that gets posted on this forum. yet the real rx7 people know that it can be done and in fact enjoy running alot of boost for yrs and smoke fools outthere. **** i have smoked a modded 03 z06 pretty good and others have even chimmed in on smoking the new z06.
08-08-07, 01:25 PM
#30
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08-08-07, 02:52 PM
#33
rotary sensei
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mr rx7tt
people are scared to run boost because of the hersay that gets posted on this forum. yet the real rx7 people know that it can be done and in fact enjoy running alot of boost for yrs and smoke fools outthere. **** i have smoked a modded 03 z06 pretty good and others have even chimmed in on smoking the new z06.
people are scared to run boost because of the hersay that gets posted on this forum. yet the real rx7 people know that it can be done and in fact enjoy running alot of boost for yrs and smoke fools outthere. **** i have smoked a modded 03 z06 pretty good and others have even chimmed in on smoking the new z06.
08-08-07, 04:24 PM
#35
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The twins won't hold up?
I do it and have for years. There are six cars around here that all run 15 psi on the stock twins and they also have for years. Yellow R1 has for years. Matty looks to have gotten it done on a stock ported engine at 15 psi , for years.
You don't know what you are talking about. Tell us about your vast rotary knowledge that you can make these claims and tell all of us who do it we can't?
I do it and have for years. There are six cars around here that all run 15 psi on the stock twins and they also have for years. Yellow R1 has for years. Matty looks to have gotten it done on a stock ported engine at 15 psi , for years.
You don't know what you are talking about. Tell us about your vast rotary knowledge that you can make these claims and tell all of us who do it we can't?
What the hell, when did I ever say it wasn't safe to run 15??? I said 17/18psi so don't start putting words in my mouth. If it's so safe to do, how is it MANY other people have had their twins fall apart on them when they turned it up. AnthonyNYC's twins died quickly after he cranked the boost. Rx7tt95's secondary was spewing oil at 58k and he was only running at 14psi. Even boostn7 himself said that 17+ is unsafe.You yourself said that upping the boost to 17psi would cause the twins to not last long. Now you want to say that you meant only on an unported motor? But on a ported motor, 17psi is safe? What would it matter if it was ported or not? 17psi is 17psi, ported or unported, it's the same amount of pressure.
08-08-07, 06:25 PM
#36
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If it's so safe to do, how is it MANY other people have had their twins fall apart on them when they turned it up. AnthonyNYC's twins died quickly after he cranked the boost. Rx7tt95's secondary was spewing oil at 58k and he was only running at 14psi. Even boostn7 himself said that 17+ is unsafe.
You yourself said that upping the boost to 17psi would cause the twins to not last long. Now you want to say that you meant only on an unported motor? But on a ported motor, 17psi is safe? What would it matter if it was ported or not? 17psi is 17psi, ported or unported, it's the same amount of pressure.
08-08-07, 07:42 PM
#37
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You are bouncing all over the place. You said you aren't going to make 360-400 rwhp on the stock twins. It was shown over and over it has been done and many of us do it. Then you said if you run that power the twins won't last. Again you got shown they do.
It's all about tuning and how you use them. What part of I've been doing it for years as others here aren't you comprehending????
Again you don't know you are talking about, it's flow into the engine. I'm still waiting for you to tell us your experience with running them at 17/18 psi???? Tell us your great expertise that you can tell all of us we can't do it when we have and for many, many years???
It's all about tuning and how you use them. What part of I've been doing it for years as others here aren't you comprehending????
Again you don't know you are talking about, it's flow into the engine. I'm still waiting for you to tell us your experience with running them at 17/18 psi???? Tell us your great expertise that you can tell all of us we can't do it when we have and for many, many years???
1. 400 is not possible on stock twins. When I say possible, I mean run for more than a few weeks. Hypothetically speaking, if you crank up the boost to 25lbs. or so and have all the supporting mods to let you do so, your engine won't blow but your twins won't hold up for very long. Sure, you might make 450hp, but not for very long. So when I say 400hp, I'm talking about 400 usable horsepower that won't cause you to break down in a short period of time.
2. 17/18 lbs. is not safe on stock twins. Anything above that is not safe on stock twins. I can count on one hand the number of people on this board who say otherwise. Do I have experience running that much boost? Absolutely not. Do I have to do it first hand to know that it's a bad idea? No. I've never shot myself in the leg, but I don't have to have first hand experience to tell you that it'd hurt. If you or Jodeny have run 19psi for years upon years, you guys are the exception to the rule, not the other way around.
08-08-07, 08:42 PM
#38
rotary sensei
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I can't help bouncing all over, you made 30 different posts and I'm not going to reply to all of them. When I first saw your statement, I was really focusing on the 400 part. I know that you can hit 360-370. But that's kind of like saying, "Well you can make 300-400 easily." 300 is easily attainable, 400 is not. Until now, I had never seen a dyno chart of the stock twins making 390-400hp. Boostn7 is the only person on here who's hit that much and IIRC, something happened to his car that made him go single. What that was, I don't know, I can't find the thread. But that aside, let's define what we're arguing here.
I can count on one hand the number of people on this board who say otherwise. Do I have experience running that much boost? Absolutely not. Do I have to do it first hand to know that it's a bad idea? No. I've never shot myself in the leg, but I don't have to have first hand experience to tell you that it'd hurt. If you or Jodeny have run 19psi for years upon years, you guys are the exception to the rule, not the other way around.
08-08-07, 11:14 PM
#39
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Like I said you are bouncing all over the place. My original post said I was making between 360-400 rwhp. You said "not on stock twins you aren't." You didn't say not 390 or 400 rwhp did you? Boostn 7 made 400 plus rwhp on the stock twins something else you said couldn't be done. The reason he went single was for more power but why he did is irrelevant to the debate.
You're statement isn't correct just because it blankets a large hp range. "You can easily make 300-400hp". See what's wrong with that statement? It's easy to make 300, it's NOT easy to make 400. You can't cover one number just by achieving the first. Boostn7 didn't go single for more power, it was something specifically related to either his engine or the twins, but like I said, I can't find the thread. If it was because the twins **** the bed, then that proves my point even further.
Then it is possible. Secondly, tell me again what experience do you have to say that the stock twins won't hold up? First it was 17/18 lbs won't hold up now it's specifically 400 hp...What happens at 400 hp versus 380-390 that makes such a huge difference?
Yeah, stock twins won't hold up to 17/18lbs. I never said differently. YOU said that I said 15psi, which is not true. As far as what happens at 400 rather than 380, the psi that you're running at is the difference. But no, I don't believe that the stock twins will run very long at 380-390 either. Again you'll be running in the 18-19psi range to get there, and contrary to what you've been running for however many years, MOST people on this board have shown that their twins don't last at all in that boost range, even at slightly lower setting.
There are many people who do it and I know it for a fact as I build the motors and tell them what to do and send them to good tuners. Just because you haven't read it on the board doesn't mean squat. Experience talks and you know the rest of the sentence. You have been proven wrong by me and a number of other members here on the board face the fact and learn from it.
You're statement isn't correct just because it blankets a large hp range. "You can easily make 300-400hp". See what's wrong with that statement? It's easy to make 300, it's NOT easy to make 400. You can't cover one number just by achieving the first. Boostn7 didn't go single for more power, it was something specifically related to either his engine or the twins, but like I said, I can't find the thread. If it was because the twins **** the bed, then that proves my point even further.
Then it is possible. Secondly, tell me again what experience do you have to say that the stock twins won't hold up? First it was 17/18 lbs won't hold up now it's specifically 400 hp...What happens at 400 hp versus 380-390 that makes such a huge difference?
Yeah, stock twins won't hold up to 17/18lbs. I never said differently. YOU said that I said 15psi, which is not true. As far as what happens at 400 rather than 380, the psi that you're running at is the difference. But no, I don't believe that the stock twins will run very long at 380-390 either. Again you'll be running in the 18-19psi range to get there, and contrary to what you've been running for however many years, MOST people on this board have shown that their twins don't last at all in that boost range, even at slightly lower setting.
There are many people who do it and I know it for a fact as I build the motors and tell them what to do and send them to good tuners. Just because you haven't read it on the board doesn't mean squat. Experience talks and you know the rest of the sentence. You have been proven wrong by me and a number of other members here on the board face the fact and learn from it.
08-09-07, 12:01 AM
#40
rotary sensei
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Oh and guess what? I know many, many individuals with modified RX's from all the generations that NEVER come here.
Originally Posted by Merlin
I think you're an arrogant ***** who can't seem to get over the fact that whatever you say is not the absolute bottom line.
It's all just internet talk? That's crap. There's a reason these forums and the big list are in existence, and it's not just to make up stories and blow smoke up each other's asses. I'm done arguing this because you obviously can't get over your ego to actually make a mature point without throwing in childish remarks and personal jabs.
http://www.sissy.com/
Nice dodge on the questions I asked you...But we all know why.
08-09-07, 12:39 AM
#41
Senior Member
How big do you think the rotary community is? This board, for the most part, is it. Those who really mod their 7's, come here. So no, I don't believe there are many more who just happen to randomly find their way to you and you guide them to 400hp at whatever psi on stock twins. I think you're an arrogant ***** who can't seem to get over the fact that whatever you say is not the absolute bottom line. I don't care how many years you've been doing whatever. Just because you say it's otherwise, all the other people on here who said they've all blown their twins, they must be lying? It's all just internet talk? That's crap. There's a reason these forums and the big list are in existence, and it's not just to make up stories and blow smoke up each other's asses. But whatever, I'm done arguing this because you obviously can't get over your ego to actually make a mature point without throwing in childish remarks and personal jabs.
When you have built & ported over 1,000 12A & 13B blocks over a quarter of century, maybe you will gain some credence. In the meantime, you would do yourself a favor to listen & learn. Mr RX-7 TT has built & run about every power application possible for streetable 1st, 2nd, & 3rd Gen RX-7s & you tried to tell him he was incorrect based on your opinion (based in large part on some neophyte experince you read on this forum)? And if you think this forum is "the only" source of info (which it ain't - far from it in fact), you have been here 2 years vs his 6 1/2 yrs. Hmmm, maybe he's seen/read a bit more than you?
People blow their motors and/or turbos running higher boost, in most cases, due to poor tuning and/or maintenance (ie do not change the fuel filters, etc). If you due the right reliability mods, change your fluids & plugs religiously, & run a little rich - your engine & stock turbos will last for years running 17 lbs (every day - my Yellow car is just one example....there are many, many more as several above have already pointed out).
08-09-07, 12:54 AM
#42
Just because you don't read it on here, doesn't mean it can't or doesn't happen. There are many people with high HP 7's that don't know this forum (or the old mailing list from the 90's) even exists and many others who lurk and don't post much. I'll sit and talk rotary with you all day in person but don't care for conversing with a computer screen. My post count (often used as a reflection of knowledge on car forums) and many others doesn't reflect their experience or knowledge of the car.
The people with problems tend to be more vocal on here, which is one of the reasons the FD has such a bad rep for reliability. If these cars were easy to mod, every idiot would have one and it would be like hondas and mustangs (kind of a blessing in disguise).
Jack
The people with problems tend to be more vocal on here, which is one of the reasons the FD has such a bad rep for reliability. If these cars were easy to mod, every idiot would have one and it would be like hondas and mustangs (kind of a blessing in disguise).
Jack
08-09-07, 01:14 AM
#43
rotary sensei
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Just because you don't read it on here, doesn't mean it can't or doesn't happen. There are many people with high HP 7's that don't know this forum (or the old mailing list from the 90's) even exists and many others who lurk and don't post much. I'll sit and talk rotary with you all day in person but don't care for conversing with a computer screen. My post count (often used as a reflection of knowledge on car forums) and many others doesn't reflect their experience or knowledge of the car.
The people with problems tend to be more vocal on here, which is one of the reasons the FD has such a bad rep for reliability. If these cars were easy to mod, every idiot would have one and it would be like hondas and mustangs (kind of a blessing in disguise).
Jack
The people with problems tend to be more vocal on here, which is one of the reasons the FD has such a bad rep for reliability. If these cars were easy to mod, every idiot would have one and it would be like hondas and mustangs (kind of a blessing in disguise).
Jack
08-12-07, 05:37 PM
#46
Senior Member
08-12-07, 09:16 PM
#48
Ahh du ma! El Es Juan!
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08-13-07, 05:39 PM
#49
Senior Member
Lighten up.
-Matt
