Gathering interest: Shine Auto style body kits
09-19-07, 01:24 AM
#26
Ghost Ride the Whip
Has anyone seen the irony in this thread yet?
Why is it ok to copy off the original but not from the copier of the original? No matter how you sugarcoat it, the first copier is already ripping off of someones original hardwork. No matter how much time Shine put in to copy the bumper to make it fit right, at the end of the day, they are still ripping off an original product. Does it fit right and is it cheaper overall better for consumers? Probably. So why should KSauto rip off Burnout instead of Shine if shine is already copying someone elses work and making money off of it?
Now some of the more ignorant people on this forum might say "but shine/VIS/Andyautosport/etc spent sooooo much time ripping off someone elses bumper therefore its immoral to rip them off because they "worked hard" to rip someone else off" replicating a bumper is always easier than spending the time/labor in designing a bumper from scratch, creating the original mold, and then marketing it, only to see it ripped off by someone overseas and make money off your own hard work.
BTW, I'm not convinced with the argument that copies fit better than the original. I have an ORIGINAL FEED TYPE 2 front bumper that I got before Rotary Extreme copied them and it fits perfectly. I've seen original knight sports, vertex, and R-Magic aero parts too that also fit perfectly. Until someone on this forum who has owned an original aftermarket aero part and a knock off of the exact same part and says that the copied one fits better I think it's all hogwash.
Why is it ok to copy off the original but not from the copier of the original? No matter how you sugarcoat it, the first copier is already ripping off of someones original hardwork. No matter how much time Shine put in to copy the bumper to make it fit right, at the end of the day, they are still ripping off an original product. Does it fit right and is it cheaper overall better for consumers? Probably. So why should KSauto rip off Burnout instead of Shine if shine is already copying someone elses work and making money off of it?
Now some of the more ignorant people on this forum might say "but shine/VIS/Andyautosport/etc spent sooooo much time ripping off someone elses bumper therefore its immoral to rip them off because they "worked hard" to rip someone else off" replicating a bumper is always easier than spending the time/labor in designing a bumper from scratch, creating the original mold, and then marketing it, only to see it ripped off by someone overseas and make money off your own hard work.
BTW, I'm not convinced with the argument that copies fit better than the original. I have an ORIGINAL FEED TYPE 2 front bumper that I got before Rotary Extreme copied them and it fits perfectly. I've seen original knight sports, vertex, and R-Magic aero parts too that also fit perfectly. Until someone on this forum who has owned an original aftermarket aero part and a knock off of the exact same part and says that the copied one fits better I think it's all hogwash.
If you're going to copy anything, copy originals. Shine takes the original products (which have flaws) and (with much hard work) is able to make most of them fit better than the originals. Also if you're so serious about this project, you'd take the 5 minutes and search this site to find your own info on Shine's products. It does not seem that you are quite capable of producing the type of products you want if your business plan relies on others to do your research for you.
Replicating a bumper is a lot more than taking a bumper, making a mold of it and then replicating it 1,000 times... Thats what bad companies do. Do you own an RX7? Would you be able to go to china and test fit the bumpers they produce many many times before getting it just right? Just because you work for a large company with big budget in no way guarantees a quality product in return.
You very well may "own many cars" and like to "drive fast," but that does nothing to prove to me that you can make a quality product.
Haha, good luck with that
Replicating a bumper is a lot more than taking a bumper, making a mold of it and then replicating it 1,000 times... Thats what bad companies do. Do you own an RX7? Would you be able to go to china and test fit the bumpers they produce many many times before getting it just right? Just because you work for a large company with big budget in no way guarantees a quality product in return.
You very well may "own many cars" and like to "drive fast," but that does nothing to prove to me that you can make a quality product.
Haha, good luck with that
09-19-07, 02:00 AM
#27
Let me give you guys an honest insight into this industry so you guys can get a feel for the reality of the automotive after-market aero parts industry.
The composites industry is a very difficult one to understand. The process is difficult to master. Unless you own and run a real composites manufacturing company, you are completely clueless. That is the reason why there are very very few companies that do what we do. Anyone can contact a manufacturer in China and claim they can deliver this and that. That's easy. Many have tried and many have failed.
There are many benefits to having composite aero parts made in the U.S. Cheap is not always better. Cheap will reflect in the finish of your car sooner or later.
-Products can be test fitted here with cars available. Most Japanese sports compact cars are not available in China.
-If there is a problem, we can address it immediately.
-We can offer products in a timely manner.
-Parts are hand made. The skill level of the laminator and the chemistry of the production team is most important. The size of the company does not matter. There are many HUGE companies who manufacture parts in China, but could not make a part as good as ours if their lives depended on it.
VIS... huge company. Horrible reputation.
Extreme Dimensions...... huge company. Horrible reputation. Claims to have a flexible product, but does not.
GTP/importfan .......I used to work here. Horrible everything. Horrible products. Horrible customer service. Their mentality is quantity, not quality.
There are many many more.
We might not be the biggest company, but we are definitely one of the top dogs, if not thee top dog when it comes to quality. Please do your research on various sport compact car forums. Companies try and they always fail to compete. Yes, our parts are more expensive. But because of the quality, it requires less work at the body shop, which in most cases lowers the overall costs. Our parts also hold higher resale value in the secondary market place. We have the highest overall satisfaction rate as well as positive feedback out of all the aftermarket aero companies in the U.S, despite being active in the market for only 2 years. It's the people and the knowledge that gives us an advantage. Even Japanese companies have contacted us with interest as using us as a U.S manufacture to save cost and offer timely delivery to the U.S market.
I've been with companies that are all about manufacturing in China. Why do they manufacture in China? Because the leading staff of these companies don't know a goddamn thing about composites and wouldn't know how to run a shop if their lives depended on it.
It's very easy to look for a manufacturer in China and make "claims" about quality. If it were that easy, we would be manufacturing in China as well. Why not? It's cheaper right? In the end, we're targeting car quys who want quality at an affordable price...no necessarily the cheapest price.
Our flexible hybrid FRP material is an exclusive formula we've developed, which companies only "claim" to have, but only wished they had. Even if Chinese molds were good, which I highly doubt, their products will still be inferior because they can only offer a standard fiberglass product.
Someone should do a side by side comparison of our product versus all the top players' industry. Everything should be clear.
Let me give you guys an example....
For the 350z, there are about 4-5 companies that make a replica of the Nismo Version 2 front bumper. Most are made in China. Most are priced about $100-$150 lower than ours. But in the end, if you asked where you should purchase a quality V2 bumper around the forum......9 out of 10 times, the response will be... "get it from Shine."
Price seems to be the only argument made for these so-called China-made supporters.
Typical VIS/ Extreme Dimensions/ GTP bumper that is in demand ranges anywhere between $200-400 on average.
Our parts range between $350-$500 for a bumper. Not much difference.
Let's take for example....
Our burnout bumper is $450......
How much would a Chinese made one be? $200-300. That couple of hundred difference can be easily spent at a body shop if the bumper turns out to be a piece of ****.
Wouldn't it be better to get a product for a lil more, which holds value and is ALSO TRUELY Flexible.....not "claimed" to be flexible?
When it comes to car enthusiasts and their cars....... I've learned not to **** AROUND. We're putting stuff on our cars guys. Cheap is the only way to go until you've realize you've just been burnt.
Ken
The composites industry is a very difficult one to understand. The process is difficult to master. Unless you own and run a real composites manufacturing company, you are completely clueless. That is the reason why there are very very few companies that do what we do. Anyone can contact a manufacturer in China and claim they can deliver this and that. That's easy. Many have tried and many have failed.
There are many benefits to having composite aero parts made in the U.S. Cheap is not always better. Cheap will reflect in the finish of your car sooner or later.
-Products can be test fitted here with cars available. Most Japanese sports compact cars are not available in China.
-If there is a problem, we can address it immediately.
-We can offer products in a timely manner.
-Parts are hand made. The skill level of the laminator and the chemistry of the production team is most important. The size of the company does not matter. There are many HUGE companies who manufacture parts in China, but could not make a part as good as ours if their lives depended on it.
VIS... huge company. Horrible reputation.
Extreme Dimensions...... huge company. Horrible reputation. Claims to have a flexible product, but does not.
GTP/importfan .......I used to work here. Horrible everything. Horrible products. Horrible customer service. Their mentality is quantity, not quality.
There are many many more.
We might not be the biggest company, but we are definitely one of the top dogs, if not thee top dog when it comes to quality. Please do your research on various sport compact car forums. Companies try and they always fail to compete. Yes, our parts are more expensive. But because of the quality, it requires less work at the body shop, which in most cases lowers the overall costs. Our parts also hold higher resale value in the secondary market place. We have the highest overall satisfaction rate as well as positive feedback out of all the aftermarket aero companies in the U.S, despite being active in the market for only 2 years. It's the people and the knowledge that gives us an advantage. Even Japanese companies have contacted us with interest as using us as a U.S manufacture to save cost and offer timely delivery to the U.S market.
I've been with companies that are all about manufacturing in China. Why do they manufacture in China? Because the leading staff of these companies don't know a goddamn thing about composites and wouldn't know how to run a shop if their lives depended on it.
It's very easy to look for a manufacturer in China and make "claims" about quality. If it were that easy, we would be manufacturing in China as well. Why not? It's cheaper right? In the end, we're targeting car quys who want quality at an affordable price...no necessarily the cheapest price.
Our flexible hybrid FRP material is an exclusive formula we've developed, which companies only "claim" to have, but only wished they had. Even if Chinese molds were good, which I highly doubt, their products will still be inferior because they can only offer a standard fiberglass product.
Someone should do a side by side comparison of our product versus all the top players' industry. Everything should be clear.
Let me give you guys an example....
For the 350z, there are about 4-5 companies that make a replica of the Nismo Version 2 front bumper. Most are made in China. Most are priced about $100-$150 lower than ours. But in the end, if you asked where you should purchase a quality V2 bumper around the forum......9 out of 10 times, the response will be... "get it from Shine."
Price seems to be the only argument made for these so-called China-made supporters.
Typical VIS/ Extreme Dimensions/ GTP bumper that is in demand ranges anywhere between $200-400 on average.
Our parts range between $350-$500 for a bumper. Not much difference.
Let's take for example....
Our burnout bumper is $450......
How much would a Chinese made one be? $200-300. That couple of hundred difference can be easily spent at a body shop if the bumper turns out to be a piece of ****.
Wouldn't it be better to get a product for a lil more, which holds value and is ALSO TRUELY Flexible.....not "claimed" to be flexible?
When it comes to car enthusiasts and their cars....... I've learned not to **** AROUND. We're putting stuff on our cars guys. Cheap is the only way to go until you've realize you've just been burnt.
Ken
Last edited by shineautoproject; 09-19-07 at 02:15 AM.
09-19-07, 07:24 AM
#28
Passenger
Posts: n/a
I would have to give Ken a big thumbs up on this one, I have various parts for my FD and quality is fantastic. Even one of my friends who's been into modifying cars for years commented on the quality of both the FRP and carbon fibre. I've even had shine's Feed Type IIR bumper side by side with a car with a real Feed bumper and it's the same.
Compare that to when I bought from importfan and got a phone call from the body shop asking if the bumper I'd bought was actually for the car it was going on...cost me twice the bumper to have it sorted.
Compare that to when I bought from importfan and got a phone call from the body shop asking if the bumper I'd bought was actually for the car it was going on...cost me twice the bumper to have it sorted.
09-19-07, 07:48 AM
#29
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Australia
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If your front bumper comes slighty broken/bent from overseas are you really going to spend the time/effort to send it back.
support forum sponsors (if shine is a sponsor) not someone who looks to be out there to make a quick buck.
How much do you think these Shone Euto copies will realistically save you?
support forum sponsors (if shine is a sponsor) not someone who looks to be out there to make a quick buck.
How much do you think these Shone Euto copies will realistically save you?
09-22-07, 07:11 PM
#31
As someone who owns a company with roughly a million units on the water from China at the moment and who has worked with factories in Guandong and other areas...this thread is amusing me greatly.
You'll have to excuse me if I don't come to the Olympics to check out your products. =)
GG
You'll have to excuse me if I don't come to the Olympics to check out your products. =)
GG
