ok my dad is looking to get a comrpessor i want it to be able to paint my car too. i have an enclosed garage that i can paint in

how big does should the compressor be? some people told me 20 gallons can do, but you have to do small parts at a time. i saw this in a thread about some guy painting his fc flat black. anyone know what he used?

what other equipment will i need? de-humidifier? and such?

advice? thanks

 

I would not recommend doing this unless you want to lop off 10 to 20 years off your life.
You need very expensive equipment and ventilation stuffs to do this safely.
Paint, reducers, etc. get absorbed through the skin too.
This means you need a full body suit to keep all the nasty chemicals away from your body.

I'd go rent a booth if you can - it's probably cheaper and safer in the long run.


-Ted

 

ted is exaggerating a bit, but the point is true. DON"T paint inside a garage unless you have thousands worth of ventilation equipment. paint outside or in a real paint booth. if you paint outside, there are all sorts of other problems, like dust, bugs, rain, etc.

20 gallons is small. 40 is good.

pat

 

I agree. 20 gallons will not cut it. Even 40 gallons is just barely enough. And thats considering you use an older gun too (not HVLP)

 

I watched friends paint a 2G Integra, and they were hacking blue paint for a WEEK.
That cannot be healthy!


-Ted

 

The key here is masks, Ted If you just drop the $30 bucks and get a good, multi-layered charcoal and filter mask, you'll be fine.. . you'll understand why after you see the filters the first time you fire up the paint gun

oh, and Homey_V - Look for a thread called "Project paint the 7" or something like that.. you can search by my name.. that has a lot of good information that you may need.

 

ahh thanks a lot guys. my bad i didnt metion what i wanted to paint my car with =p.
well i can paint outside if i want. but i know it may get on the paint and such =/

flat black!! or white, im just going to be painting with a probably tremclad paint i saw some guy do it...but he wont tell me information about the size of tank he used and such...all i know is that he painted it at home. and wonko
Project paint the 7
lol thats exactly why i made this thread that guy who started the thread hasnt replied with the info i want so i made this thread.


anyone know how big of a tank he used???
i got a mask already. 40$ mask, charcoal, but dono about the multilayer filtration, it does say filters paint.

and whats hvlp gun differ from older guns? i know that some guns spray more paint out rather than air and vice versa.

im going to be painting each piece one by one

o and if my uncle can hook me up and give me time in his shop i obivously will not be using tremclad paint or doing it at home, but still want the equipment to do it just in case. o and he gave me a gun...but i dono if its considered old or hvlp

more advice?

thanks guys really appreciate that help and advice.

 

Its not really tank size you care about, it is your compressor CFM and duty cycle.
You need about 10-12 CFM constant for painting. Tank size is only an issue when you factor in your com pressors duty cycle.

A compressor this large can be pretty pricey... at least $900 bones cdn new for a decent brand. Try checking out KMS Tools in Coquitlam just off the number one (right beside the IKEA), they sell some decent compressors at a reasonable cost, and, even better, their staff actually know what their talking about in their respected areas.
They'll also have the HVLP guns, and if you're interested, they sell and rent DVD's/VHS on painting your entire car.
(No, I don't work for KMS, I just shop there sometimes)

NOW then... HVLP standas for High-Volume, Low pressure. The older guns used to spray the paint on the car at around 50 psi, the new HVLP guns spray it on at around 8-10 psi. This means less paint mist, so less wasted paint, less fumes, and better vision. It also means you have to hold the gun closer and move the gun faster to do a nice even coat.

I paint my own cars using equipment I bought from a bunch of companies around the lower mainland... but, like Mr. Koseki, I am a bit worried about my health, and use a $1200 fresh air feed unit instead of a $30 organic respirator.

 

be sure it also has a condensation trap, compressors produce water which will give your paint "fish eyes" if you don't keep it out of the air lines, also you will need to tons of plastic sheets to layer your area so dust particles will not be blown around and rest on the paint and cause you grief during the painting process. first and foremost though has already been covered, and that is body protection, ventilation and respiration.

 

Need a little more than a "condensation trap"...

You know those little silica packets that always say do not eat that you get in new shoes and electronics? You basically force your compressed air through one of those in a "Dessicant Air Dryer". They cost around $200. Only deal with these guys is you HAVE to use a good filter downstream of them, or you contaminate your paint with silica.

Next step up is a powered refridgerated compressed air drier. Basically cools and condenses out the water via a refridgeration unit and filters your compressed air. I personally use a DeVair ProDry 50 (50 CFM's), and it works fantastic. It was also somewhat expensive.

Above that it gets very expensive, and outside the realm of price of the home mechanic.

Also, grab a couple of good inline "paint gun filters" and throw them on right before the pressure regulator at the gun.

 

no one had mentioned it, it is a pretty important thing to filter out the water from your system while painting but i don't know of what is the best setup nor do i think he wants to spend $200 for a filter.

 

An easier way than plastic on the floor if thats what you mean, is to Wet the floor down completely, it will help to keep the dust down a ton, with minimal work.

 

it's not so much dust coming from the floor but from above.

 

Goddam, have any of you guys ever painted a car? Most of the crap you're spewing is total BS.

I've painted cars in my garage for many years, none of which killed me using a standard 3M paint mask & dual filter/pre filter setup. I did use plastic which is a good idea and better than water cause your hose isn't laying in it. Also I setup an old box fan drawing air out, sure it's drawing air/dust in but if you keep it outside the plastic 'box' you'll be ok.

As for compressor size my main pump was a 6hp 60ga and that did a kickass job, but I've also used a 5hp 20ga with the same results. Anyone who's actually laid paint will tell you that the CFM ratings are for constant spray and I dont know about you guys but when you're fanning across a body panel you're not just holding the trigger full throttle the whole time. A small compressor will work if you paint in sections, which you have to anyway.

Use a regular water trap filter and a pre-filter on the gun, as well as a gun mounted regulator, they're cheap & HVLP isn't friendly to periodic bursts of pressure.

The whole paint job is in the prep work, do it right with long boards and when you think you've got it right do it again. Wet sand the whole thing with 400 (or 600 grit if you haven't done alot of body work), and wipe it down inside with a good tack rag. Dont forget to blow the whole car down with air before spraying, this includes all body seams & edges to get any loose dirt or water out before you blow paint at it.

Once you're done you can wetsand out any sags (600 to 1200 grit) or runs you get and if you're spraying a flat color just use Centauri Acrylic Enamel, tell the paint shop you're spraying lawn furniture with it. It's much easier to get a workable paint job with Ac Enamel that it is with multi-stage and the paint is way cheaper.

Do it & have fun with it. I'd paint cars full time if it wasn't for the fact that I hate sanding. Good luck!

 

Right now I'm painting mine inside a garage with a 5 hp, 17 gallon compressor. It's worked just fine so far, and I'm not got much of brain damage

Really though, you can make a smaller compressor work, you just need to rest and let it refill because it will have to run quite often, even with an HVLP gun. Make sure there is plenty of ventilation and WEAR A MASK!

Lastly, a side note from today's experiences - If a cloth says that it is LINT FREE, that means that it is going to leave FREE LINT all over your primer after you wipe it down. I think I need a tack cloth.

P.S. Wonko, the Paint the Seven topic should be made into a textbook! You guys had some great information in there and it's really helping me out. I'd recommend it to anyone who wants to venture into the world of painting. Thanks

 

THANKS FOR ALL THE ADVICE GUYS!!! really appreciate it helped a lot.

im gona paint it after winter so its gona be a while but ill put up pics as soon as im done THANKS!

 

CFM is important when you look at duty cycle, regardless of what you claim. Some of us like to maintain our tools. I wait maybe a second after a strip of spray, and then move down to the next row so that I get an even coat between flashes. This is constant duty use, a paint gun is considered a constant duty item. An impact gun, for example, is not constant duty.
How long do you wait between laying down a strip of paint? 5 mins?

As for your compressors, like I said, tank size doesn't really matter: its only for storing enough air so that your compressor doesn't have to run all the time: it allows it to work within the boundaries of its duty cycle. 5 an 6 hp compressor should be pumping out 14-18 CFM in a single stage, so your should be alright if you've got a duty cycle of 60% or better.

As for just using a simple water trap filter and gun filter... Well, this is just poor quality practice. $200 for a dessicant air dryer is much cheaper than a new paint job. Perhaps in a few years you will see why professional paint jobs use expensive tools for drying compressed air, and not simply water traps.

Safety is mainly up to the user. Using a cheapo mask is fine for some people, but after watching family members die from lung cancer and leaving behind teenaged children, I tend to prioritize my longevity over the colour of my car. Again, why do you think professionals use a fresh-air supply if a mask was all that was necessary?

I think we're looking at two levels of home paint jobs here: There's doing a paint job yourself, and doing a paint job right by yourself. I'd say from your comment about using a single-stage enamel because it is easier and cheaper pretty much tells us what side you're on.

 

Well I'm not going to argue with most of your points, cause you're right if you're a pro looking to spray lots of pro paintjobs. But if you're not trying to spray a $20k show winning paintjob then you can surely do it in the garage as I explained. Everyone here seemed to want to discourage a kid from trying to do it himself, maybe he'll become the next Mike LaValle? Like I told him, you've gotta start somewhere.

As for Acrylic Enamel, what do you think cars were painted with before Urethane? Jeezus, would you really tell a kid to learn to spray multi-stage for a first time painting project? Not trying to take any cash out of all you painter's hands out there, but you need to remember where you came from.

 

I painted my s10 outside in the rain (well it rained 15 minutes after my last coat..) With TSC tractor paint. Bugs got all in it.. I just kept spraying it untill i ran out of paint (1 gallon later) Buffed all the bugs out and that paint will never come off... I wet sanded it and then buffed it, had no runs, a few oil spots (damn tirefoam) but they all snaded out before buffing.. The whole deal cost me $30 including paint and hardner and prep...

here is a shot before buffing..

BTW I used no mask, got really light headed and almost puked... wear a mask for sure, but don't be scard to paint, worst case you have to sand and start over. This was my FIRST EVER paintjob, Perfect? NO WAY, Better then multicolor/primer and visible bodywork, YEP, fun? YEP, worth $30? HELL YEAH!

 

woah some good pros and cons there! thanks for helping me notice all that. and i agree with scath about the health issue. my uncle used to paint with a mask for a long time because he was poor and couldnt afford a seperate air supply thing i guess. but now that he has it for his body shop, he says its a a lot easier painting but on my budget im for sure just going to use a mask for now. =p maybe hold my breath for a minute while painting and walking away to breath?


oo well a lil off topic here. you guys mentioned about the different paints. i dont get it...
rona said enamel is more durable then ackrylic and drys harder too, so i wanted to test thing out....they sprayed me some samples....and gave me a few used cans to play with.


tremclad rust paint(rona told me its enamel and drys HARD)....and krylon spray paint(rona said its ackrylic and isnt as hard). tremclad paint came out all tacky and my finger nails can actually sink into the paint like tofu this was like 2 weeks after drying, while the ackyrlic krylon was hard hard hard. n i didnt feel like tofu. what could the problem be there?

so this leads to my next question. could auto paint turn out all tofu plasticy likeand be able to sink my finger nail into it like the tremclad paint? ( maybe i just sprayed to thick of a coat...im still testing that. ) i peeled off some of the tremclad paint and rolled it up into a lil ball, felt like a rubber ball.

 

It might be incompatible paint "systems".
Try to stay with one "system" or manufacturer when you shoot everything down - i.e. primer, sealer, base color, clear, etc.
If you start to mix and match, weird things can happen.

As for my experiences, it's with high pressure stuff.
When I see the HVLP stuff now, it's AMAZING how much less overspray happens with these new guns!

Bottom line, you get what you pay for.
Even with the HVLP's and "low toxicity" paints and solvents, I'd rather not breathe that stuff (or have it absorb into my skin).
For several hunderd dollars, I'd let the pros handle the job.


-Ted

 

thanks for the advice everyone. thanks scath i went to kms LOTS of help!