I am trying to find out what is best for me. The subject is a 1980 with a GSLSE street port using pineapple templates (both exhaust and intake) with a S4 intake manifold and throttle body. No turbo. I am not intending to use an electric fan. I was leading into the Microsquirt, but the Haltech 550 has the 4 outputs for spark control and 4 sequential injector outputs as well. I have read into the batch vs sequential and while I could live with batch, sequential would be nice for my purpose.

so I have a few questions to see if I understand this.

Is "long term learning" (not available in the 550) the same as an autotune?

Is there an alternative to the FC ignition coils that people are using on their rx7s?

There is an analog input, can this be used as a trigger to activate the BAC? (air conditioning)

I would assume that one of the 5 digital pulsed outputs could not be used to activate the compressor clutch.

I have a few Haltech dealers near me, though not rotary specific shops. The should be able to fine tune an NA rotary if needed... right?


Thank You

 

Long Term Learning is a Closed Loop Long Term Fuel Trim, which will help you reshape the VE table properly.

Here's one of the 500whp cars I've tuned here after two track days. I have the Lambda settings a bit too lean at idle, so this dip here is pretty much non-existent to what the car really wants:



I'd be happy to help you with an ECU and tuning. Go sequential fueling.

A Twin Turbo FC w/ Elite 550 of mine that I've setup is now at 12.7psi and gearing up to hit the dyno this week. Should be able to turn her up to 15-16psi on pump gas due to their mild climate and easily crack 400whp for a convertible FC.

Best of luck, Richard.

 

So the 550 does not auto correct. The extra 350-400 to upgrade to the750 is a hard sell for me but not off the table. As a car that will not see competition, is the closed loop long term fuel trim that big of an advantage? My nearest Haltech dealers are about an hour and a half away, god knows if they even tune rotary.

 

Like I said, I can help you with whatever you need.

You'll still have short term that's available in closed loop, which is really all you need. Long Term will help you identify how far off the VE Fuel Map is with extended usage to get the short term trims down lower.

 

I am hoping to get the fuel system in the next 3-6 months. I did was hoping sooner, but the bodywork has some unexpected costs in labor.

 

It's always going to be a work in progress. Just overbuild stuff so there's no need to upgrade later.

 

Why bother with sequential fuel injectors? For an NA, you won't make gobs of power and don't need that much fuel.

Will modern fuel injectors, you could just go with big primaries and have a super simple system. Would you need anymore than 2000cc total? If not, throw in 1000cc primaries and block of the secondaries. A haltech can easily control 1000cc primaries like the Bosch ev-14 style.

 

Richard Miller:

I'm currently running a 13b peripheral port with 2 ID1700's on batch fire. Sequential injection is ideal, but this setup has taken me to ~270WHP non-turbo. Prior to the peripheral port, I ran 2 ID1000 primaries and no secondaries with my ITB's. No issues, whatsoever.

If self-learning is on your needs list, maybe try an Adaptronic M1200. My understanding is they offer this feature, and the algorithm is supposedly better than the Elite's (despite Haltech now owning Adaptronic). Also, they're only 850 bucks.

 

Please, install Adaptronic software before ever recommending that terrible ECU. There's calculation issues on VE values, false MAP sensor multipliers, randomly disconnecting during logs, etc. This is not a good option for anyone trying to have a reliable car.

Otherwise, Richard, you're on the right track. If you end up needing help with it, let me know.

 

My understanding was having primary injectors led to better lower rpm control and better street manners. As I understand it high flow injectors can be a bit unstable when not much of as load is needed. Seems great for track usage, but staged as I understand it works well for street. Or do I need to update my knowledge?

 

Generally that's correct, however thanks to companies like Injector Dynamics who understand suspension hysteresis and such so well, they apply that technology and understanding to their custom injectors which results in a relatively large injector that has an incredibly well controlled low duty cycle, and opening "knee" region.

While I prefer staged, you can easily get away with a single stage, even for e85 on some builds. Your build on pump gas really only needs around 2200cc/min of total fuel flow, so something like 2x ID1300x would work and allow some flex fuel or large porting overhead. Different ways to skin the cat here.

 

Meh, three of my friends are using Adaptronic ECU's on their FD's with no issues. That said, it was merely a recommendation based off their experience.

What RightBrain said about Injector Dynamics is correct though. They've made excellent injectors that can operate well under low load. When I ran my stock port and ITB's, I made 177 whp with 2 ID1000 primaries and an old *** haltech e6x (talk about a terrible ecu). Despite my garbage ecu, the car handled idle/low loads just fine with batch fire.

 

Whether or not your friends driving their FDs to work every day (hahaha) are having any issues with that ECU is beside the point. It uses poor excuses of math throughout and is running on Megasquirt calculations for the transient fueling (not great).

If you had come to him with Link G4, a higher end Haltech Elite, ECUMaster, Emtron, etc I wouldn't have had to state that. Those are all comparable, excellent choices, the Adaptronic is simply not.

 

sounds like an old haltech... on the E8/E11 ecu's the log file is basically the output of the chip, it is NOT the output of the ecu. we know this because the whole output side of the ecu can shut down and it doesn't show up in the log files.

 

Ok. You know best, I get it.

 

I mean, all I ask is if you're going to throw a recommendation out, to have installed and worked with each of the softwares, even just for a little bit. Call it what it is, trash.

 

Its ironic Haltech hired Andy to help them improve their product and just think all the "trash" math and features are now going to be apart of Haltech brand... looking forward to all the updates and improvement to both brands!

 

I think it's a more fair assessment that Haltech bought a company and its IP/ resources (Andy) during said company's poor performance due to QC issues and weird bugs even though they had some very interesting design choices. Adaptronic, as a whole, seems to be flawed in more ways than one, this is why it takes more than IP and a smart engineer to productize good ideas.

I don't think its like Haltech was clammering to buy Adaptronic because they were worried or thought they couldn't achieve what Adaptronic was trying to do, they saw an opportunity to bootstrap off of a company that was hurting.

 

This guy nailed it.

 

No they were looking to expand their market and was looking at different ways to do so and it just so happened that they asked at the right time to purchase Adaptronic. Having the second IP is a great way to create a far superior product in the end I agree. But to say the product is trash is far from the truth since I use it every single day and it works very well. Yes there maybe things that do come up that need to be fixed and they get fixed. All ECU manufactures have the same struggles some worse than others yes there is no doubt about that but it all happens.

 

Dude, re-read what I wrote.

 

I read it clearly and I was agreeing with you and making a statement on another individuals comments at the same time..

 

Focus more on OPs question and less on eachother.

 

The OP is still lurking

 

Good man! Let me know if you have any questions.