Haltech 20B w/PS2K engine runs then dies sporadically
20B w/PS2K engine runs then dies sporadically
I'm running a new PS2K on my 20B and have had good luck starting the car up and it idles smoothly, pulls strong vacuum.... Everything seemed fine, but it's periodically dying on its own and very hesitant to respond to throttle movements/bogs and dies often. I will start the car and sometimes it will idle smoothly at 900-1K RPM for a minute straight, then I see the RPMs fall slowly, fuel map trying to respond and the thing just tanks. I can save it with a throttle blip sometimes, but other this just kills the engine. At idle, sometimes it will last 10-15 seconds, sometimes a minute or so before dying on its own. Seems to behave better when cold, when warm it's more eager to die.
It almost behaves like a vacuum leak, but I can't find anything. Or like fuel is just cutting off, but I see a strong 40-45 PSI all the time on the reg. I am going to shoot the timing, but this doesn't seem like a timing issue, does it? I feel like the ECU is sensing something (time, temp, etc.) that's spurring a change that the car doesn't like. Anyone have any ideas?
It almost behaves like a vacuum leak, but I can't find anything. Or like fuel is just cutting off, but I see a strong 40-45 PSI all the time on the reg. I am going to shoot the timing, but this doesn't seem like a timing issue, does it? I feel like the ECU is sensing something (time, temp, etc.) that's spurring a change that the car doesn't like. Anyone have any ideas?
In rotor we trust!
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 258
Likes: 0
From: Moscow, Russia
I'm running a new PS2K on my 20B and have had good luck starting the car up and it idles smoothly, pulls strong vacuum.... Everything seemed fine, but it's periodically dying on its own and very hesitant to respond to throttle movements/bogs and dies often. I will start the car and sometimes it will idle smoothly at 900-1K RPM for a minute straight, then I see the RPMs fall slowly, fuel map trying to respond and the thing just tanks. I can save it with a throttle blip sometimes, but other this just kills the engine. At idle, sometimes it will last 10-15 seconds, sometimes a minute or so before dying on its own. Seems to behave better when cold, when warm it's more eager to die.
It almost behaves like a vacuum leak, but I can't find anything. Or like fuel is just cutting off, but I see a strong 40-45 PSI all the time on the reg. I am going to shoot the timing, but this doesn't seem like a timing issue, does it? I feel like the ECU is sensing something (time, temp, etc.) that's spurring a change that the car doesn't like. Anyone have any ideas?
It almost behaves like a vacuum leak, but I can't find anything. Or like fuel is just cutting off, but I see a strong 40-45 PSI all the time on the reg. I am going to shoot the timing, but this doesn't seem like a timing issue, does it? I feel like the ECU is sensing something (time, temp, etc.) that's spurring a change that the car doesn't like. Anyone have any ideas?
I finished a hardware work whith 20B RX8+P2000 yersterday. Just have installed a base map and zero the timing. I plan to run and tune it next weekend.
Thanks for the reply. '94 FD with PS and A/C (A/C not running at moment, just compressor installed and spinning freely). MSD Blaster coils driven off a 6-channel Haltech ignitor. Stock 550cc primaries with Bosch 1600cc secondaries (Haltech set to 3-8 ohm resistance). Stock UIM and LIM (shortened), FD throttle body (fast idle & coolant removed), 3" downpipe and N1 exhaust with Borla modpipe (no cat). FMIC and T62 turbo not connected at the moment, just TB to open air.
In rotor we trust!
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 258
Likes: 0
From: Moscow, Russia
No, no BAC at the moment. I have tried adding air manually both through the TB and through the upper/double throttle (which should not register on the TPS, right?) and it often kills the engine either way. Is this what the BAC would be doing? I wasn't sure exactly how it'd wire up with the Haltech, but if you think this might help I can try it.
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In rotor we trust!
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 258
Likes: 0
From: Moscow, Russia
No, no BAC at the moment. I have tried adding air manually both through the TB and through the upper/double throttle (which should not register on the TPS, right?) and it often kills the engine either way. Is this what the BAC would be doing? I wasn't sure exactly how it'd wire up with the Haltech, but if you think this might help I can try it.
BAC helps to contol idle RPM to make it more stable. It reads RPM and pass more or less air instead throttle if RPM not corresponds specific value. There are many projects w/o BAC. But I personally like it in my 13B-Re Cosmo. I plan use it with 20B RX8 too.
Chris, I will get the wideband installed tonight and check it out. BTW, how do you find tuning with the Haltech wideband vs. a standalone like the LM2 (which is what I have)? Is the Haltech wideband setup worth investing in with this ECU? Thanks.
You're wasting your time trying to dial things in without the proper equipment. A wideband is required to get this running. What you're doing is like trying to diagnose an oil pressure problem without an oil pressure gauge.
The LM2 can be interfaced with the Haltech. Connect the 0-5V output of the LM2 to the O2 input of the Haltech. You'll need to make sure both are configured for the same voltage scale. Once that is done the Haltech will see the AFR from the LM2 so that you can view it in real time with the software, log it, and use it for closed loop operation.
The LM2 can be interfaced with the Haltech. Connect the 0-5V output of the LM2 to the O2 input of the Haltech. You'll need to make sure both are configured for the same voltage scale. Once that is done the Haltech will see the AFR from the LM2 so that you can view it in real time with the software, log it, and use it for closed loop operation.
You're wasting your time trying to dial things in without the proper equipment. A wideband is required to get this running. What you're doing is like trying to diagnose an oil pressure problem without an oil pressure gauge.
The LM2 can be interfaced with the Haltech. Connect the 0-5V output of the LM2 to the O2 input of the Haltech. You'll need to make sure both are configured for the same voltage scale. Once that is done the Haltech will see the AFR from the LM2 so that you can view it in real time with the software, log it, and use it for closed loop operation.
The LM2 can be interfaced with the Haltech. Connect the 0-5V output of the LM2 to the O2 input of the Haltech. You'll need to make sure both are configured for the same voltage scale. Once that is done the Haltech will see the AFR from the LM2 so that you can view it in real time with the software, log it, and use it for closed loop operation.
, but will do. Setting up the wideband was my next step, it's just that now I can barely keep it running long enough to take any readings, so I thought something must have changed. Anyway, thanks for the help on the LM2, I'll see if I can get some data.
I loaded a base map and the car started right up and idled fine for a few days while I buttoned up some odds and ends on the rest of the car. Suddenly out of nowhere it has problems staying alive. I didn't want to go in and start changing fuel and ignition tables without first exploring the possibility that I missed something obvious. But it sounds like the next step is trying to try and get some AFR info, so that's what I'll do.
After 5 FDs, this would be a first!
AFRs are in the 10s, 11s at idle, so it's richtastic. ECU tries to add more fuel to save it from dying, which clearly does not help, but decreasing fuel in the table also kills it. I'm going to shoot the timing to check it then will post details on the LM2 log once I know that's solid.
AFRs are in the 10s, 11s at idle, so it's richtastic. ECU tries to add more fuel to save it from dying, which clearly does not help, but decreasing fuel in the table also kills it. I'm going to shoot the timing to check it then will post details on the LM2 log once I know that's solid.
OK, it's my coolant temp fuel correction. If I keep the values at 8% across the board the engine stays running, but as soon as the correction table ends and there's 0% enrichment the engine dies. So, guess I just need to correct my fuel and ignition to compensate so the car will still run when this drops off. Will see how it goes.
If it's good with 8% correction, simply highlight all cells of the base fuel map, hit P (percentage), type in 8, and hit enter. Should get you in the ballpark once the engine warms up.
Do not mess with the ignition. Those maps are independent of the fuel trim value.
Do not mess with the ignition. Those maps are independent of the fuel trim value.
OK, it's my coolant temp fuel correction. If I keep the values at 8% across the board the engine stays running, but as soon as the correction table ends and there's 0% enrichment the engine dies. So, guess I just need to correct my fuel and ignition to compensate so the car will still run when this drops off. Will see how it goes.
It runs pretty well in the 5%-8% range, but this garbage pile of an LM2 is completely unreliable so it's tough to see where I'm at with the AFR. It revs pretty well now but under load is very touchy; doesn't respond well to driving load. Until I get the wideband working reliably, though, it's tough to say what this might be. Might have to try different sensors....
Compared to the Haltech wideband option, considering datalogging, effectiveness and ease of use/limiting clutter would you still go with the NGK? Either way would like to buy it from you as a small thanks for your continued help. Shoot me a PM with your thoughts and how to go forward with either.